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Old 07-15-2010, 11:18 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,942,496 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
I'm not Richard...but I have an answer...

...everyone will have knees...even the ones who are dead in their sin...but they will be gone, with their knees leading them to their final destiny...and it isn't with God.

The knees of the wicked will be bowing...but not in heaven...not in the Kingdom of God....they will be destroyed...the soul will be totally destroyed.

...and I pray to God that as many as possible will hear what the Spirit is trying to say to them in these last days...there is still time...but God and God alone only...knows when your time is up...He never promised any of us a tomorrow..today could very well be your last day here on earth...I pray you get down on your knees now...and cry out to God and repent of your sins...and go...and sin no more...by the power of the Holy Spirit of Christ...keep the ten commandments of God that is written upon the hearts of those who will.

In Christ''s love...prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.

Isn't it interesting how we are told that we need to believe scripture but when someone sees scripture in a light that uses the words as they are with no added commentary that there then is a problem?


The passage states what it does. it does not say, "those who are left" it does not say "they are realizing their mistake" it does not say "they will be gone"

It says none of that.

Saul of Tarsus is a scriptural premise, you do not have to add or subtract from the word to then see what happens to the wicked.

Saul of Tarsus was one of the wicked and God showed us what his wrath does to them.
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Old 07-15-2010, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,863,949 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
I'm not Richard...but I have an answer...

...everyone will have knees...even the ones who are dead in their sin...but they will be gone, with their knees leading them to their final destiny...and it isn't with God.

The knees of the wicked will be bowing...but not in heaven...not in the Kingdom of God....they will be destroyed...the soul will be totally destroyed.

...and I pray to God that as many as possible will hear what the Spirit is trying to say to them in these last days...there is still time...but God and God alone only...knows when your time is up...He never promised any of us a tomorrow..today could very well be your last day here on earth...I pray you get down on your knees now...and cry out to God and repent of your sins...and go...and sin no more...by the power of the Holy Spirit of Christ...keep the ten commandments of God that is written upon the hearts of those who will.

In Christ''s love...prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.
How can the wicked be bowing and be destroyed at the same time?

I like how you say "God and God alone knows" but you seem to know a lot more than even the apostles did about what will happen to the wicked...

Just think... a wicked man gets to live... die... live....bow...die...be burned...and then be utterly destroyed.

First thought: overkill!
Second thought? WOW! If you have faith that God tortures then destroys those on their knees... what about those who are wicked and have lost their knees?
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Old 07-15-2010, 11:53 AM
 
23,292 posts, read 17,527,515 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Twin, Ironmaw as just explained why the devils cannot say Jesus is Lord.

No one can say Jesus is Lord but by the Holy Spirit .

In Phillipanss 2 we read "Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord ".

There is only one way they could be doing that , and that is by the Holy Spirit.

You believe that God has given us free will , so please do not even try to tell me that God is forcing them to bow and confess.
To the contrary. Here on earth, with Jesus Christ in Heaven and not physically on the earth, believers in Christ can, because the Holy Spirit indwells their body, recognize that Jesus Christ is Lord.

But at the judgment, when unbelievers appear before Jesus Christ, they will, when they see Him as He is, finally realize and be forced to acknowledge that Christ is Lord. That does not save them.

All who rejected Christ as Savior during their life on earth will be forced in view of His glory, to realize that He is Lord. He will be acknowledged not as Savior, but as Lord.


Exomologeó...

From ek and homologeo = to speak the same, to agree.

As used in the NASB
acknowledge (2), admit (1), assured (1), confess (6), confessed (4), confesses (6), confessing (1), declare (1), give thanks (1), made (1), profess (1), promised (1).

Believers will indeed joyfully declare that Christ is Lord. But those who rejected Christ as Savior will acknowledge as the defeated enemies of Christ, that He is after all, Lord.

Matthew 7:21 ''Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, 'Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven; but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven (the will of the Father concerning unbelievers is that they believe in Christ as Savior. John 6:28;29). [22] ''Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'' [23] ''And then I will declare to them, 'I NEVER KNEW YOU; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

Those who are being ordered By Christ to depart from Him had just called Him Lord. They had done things in His name. But they had never trusted in Him for salvation, and Jesus declares that He never knew them.

And where do they depart to??? Matthew 25:41 ''Then He (Jesus speaking of Himself) will also say to those on His left, 'depart from Me, accursed ones into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels. [46] ''And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.''

The demons do indeed know that Jesus Christ is Lord. Matthew 8:28 And when He had come to the other side into the country of the Gadarenes, two men who were demon-possessed met Him as they were coming out of the tombs; they were so exceedingly violent that no one could pass by that road. [29] And behold, they cried out, saying, ''What do we have to do with You, Son of God? Have You come here to torment us before the time?

The demons know that Jesus Christ is God and the demons in Matthew 8:28 called Him by His title of deity, 'Son of God'.

And to head off anyone trying to twist things, the fact that believers are adopted sons of God has absolutely nothing to do with the divine title of Christ who is the 'Son of God' and therefore, God.

Nor am I going to waste my time in debate with the universalists who are without doubt going to reject what has just been said. The Scriptures are clear that those who have rejected Christ as Savior in this life, will be forced as defeated enemies of Christ to acknowledge His Lordship over all of creation. And then they will be thrown into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels.

Those who value truth will uderstand this. Those who have already rejected the truth will simply continue in their ways.
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Old 07-15-2010, 01:45 PM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,942,496 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Nor am I going to waste my time in debate with the universalists who are without doubt going to reject what has just been said. The Scriptures are clear that those who have rejected Christ as Savior in this life, will be forced as defeated enemies of Christ to acknowledge His Lordship over all of creation. And then they will be thrown into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels.

Those who value truth will uderstand this. Those who have already rejected the truth will simply continue in their ways.

You would be wasting your time, because you have nothing to debate with.

There is nothing you have written describing the wonderful Glory of God being someone who forced acknoeledgement and then damns then for all eternity, the passage simply contains none of that, so there is no debate because that isn't there.

You really should come up with something more clever though really because see if you disagree with this, then obviously, YOU DO NOT VALUE TRUTH.

Such nonsense you try to use.
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Old 07-15-2010, 01:55 PM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,534,352 times
Reputation: 899
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
ex-om-ol-og-eh'-o
From G1537 and G3670; to acknowledge or (by implication of assent) agree fully: - confess, profess, promise.

I don't know where you are getting your translations from...maybe the same place as the JWs did...
Its called the "Strongs" concordance ...

Here is the link ... Blue Letter Bible - Lexicon


You don't like that version of the definition? Well, lets see what the Vines has to say about the word ...



Quote:
exomologeo
ek, "out," intensive, and homologeo, and accordingly stronger than homologeo, "to confess forth," i.e., "freely, openly," is used
(a) "of a public acknowledgment or confession of sins," Matt_3:6; Mark_1:5; Acts_19:18; James_5:16;
(b) "to profess or acknowledge openly," Matt_11:25 (translated "thank," but indicating the fuller idea); Php_2:11 (some mss. have it in Rev_3:5: see homologeo);
(c) "to confess by way of celebrating, giving praise," Rom_14:11; Rom_15:9. In Luke_10:21, it is translated "I thank," the true meaning being "I gladly acknowledge." In Luke_22:6 it signifies to consent (RV), for AV, "promised."


From ... http://www.antioch.com.sg/cgi-bin/bible/vines/get_defn.pl?num=537 (broken link)
Peace ...
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Old 07-15-2010, 02:04 PM
 
Location: Canada
7,309 posts, read 4,411,213 times
Reputation: 422
Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
I'm not Richard...but I have an answer...

...everyone will have knees...even the ones who are dead in their sin...but they will be gone, with their knees leading them to their final destiny...and it isn't with God.

The knees of the wicked will be bowing...but not in heaven...not in the Kingdom of God....they will be destroyed...the soul will be totally destroyed.

...and I pray to God that as many as possible will hear what the Spirit is trying to say to them in these last days...there is still time...but God and God alone only...knows when your time is up...He never promised any of us a tomorrow..today could very well be your last day here on earth...I pray you get down on your knees now...and cry out to God and repent of your sins...and go...and sin no more...by the power of the Holy Spirit of Christ...keep the ten commandments of God that is written upon the hearts of those who will.

In Christ''s love...prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.
Nonsense, the verse starts be ye saved all the ends of the earth. if it is only concerning the saved as you suggest the verse would not speak of all the ends of the earth being saved. After all did not the christian already bow and confess
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Old 07-15-2010, 04:04 PM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,534,352 times
Reputation: 899
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776 View Post
Its called the "Strongs" concordance ...

Here is the link ... Blue Letter Bible - Lexicon


You don't like that version of the definition? Well, lets see what the Vines has to say about the word ...



Peace ...
Sorry for my use of the color red in the above post Mods ... I didn't know that it made your job difficult. I will try and remember next time ...
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Old 07-16-2010, 03:44 AM
 
Location: US
28,735 posts, read 15,784,194 times
Reputation: 1904
Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
Everyone THAT IS LEFT WILL! bow down on their knees and cry "HOLY!...HOLY!...HOLY! is the Lamb of God!"


...there will BE NO MORE unbeliever's because they will all be dead in their sin......lifeless...soul dead...buried...destroyed...total destruction of the soul...forever separated from God.


It will be a new heaven and a new earth...no sin...no tears...no pain...no sorrow...no want or need for anything but our King...our God...our Father.

And God will glory in all those knees..the knees of the saints...bowing down before Him praising His Holy Name!!!

In Christ's love...prayerfully in His truth,
Verna....
oh, then you are a JW....
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Old 07-16-2010, 03:55 AM
 
Location: US
28,735 posts, read 15,784,194 times
Reputation: 1904
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Well if that is the case... I can see why you treat some people like they are already lifeless, soul dead buried.... and useless..

The only thing that bothers me about annihilation is.. why are they on the earth if they 1. have no chance at salvation (there was one act on the cross not several) 2. just going to be utterly destroyed anyway.

??? Anyone know what the purpose of even having unbelievers around is?
All the world's a stage, and all the men and women merely players...Shakespere
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Old 07-16-2010, 04:10 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,558,199 times
Reputation: 439
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
All the world's a stage, and all the men and women merely players...Shakespere

You're going to quote Shakespeare when talking about God's love for the lost? The kind of love that dies a brutal death and then cries, "Father, forgive them?"

If this is the attitude in Calvinism (I'm assuming you are Calvinist with that thar attitude) I can see why the lost don't feel that God loves them. There are many watching and waiting in the middle of a cold and dark world to see if there really is any good news out there, and they run into this crud.

How BEAUTIFUL are the feet.......
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