U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 07-15-2010, 05:20 PM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,612,233 times
Reputation: 688

Advertisements

Fundamental Christianity tends to focus on living forever ie. "eternal life", but in reality it is about knowing God, which is what eonian life is:

NIV:
John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

Concordant Literal:
John 17:3 Now it is eonian life that they may know Thee, the only true God, and Him Whom Thou dost commission, Jesus Christ.

This makes a big difference when trying to understand a verse like John 3:16 (from the Concordant):

For thus God loves the world, so that He gives His only-begotten Son, that everyone who is believing in Him should not be perishing, but may be having life eonian.

The idea is simple: if you believe in Jesus, then you will know Him. If you don't then you are perishing. Thus the reason why there is no limit at our earthly death - there will be a resurrection, and then if you believe in Christ, you will know Him (eonian life).

Knowing Jesus means knowing His ways and His commandments: Love God and love one another. That is what it is all about. Knowing God - who is LOVE. Its not about avoiding a fiery after life or even living forever. Its about knowing God (yes we ultimately will be made immortal - but that is not what eonian life is about).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-15-2010, 06:36 PM
 
Location: Florida
62,947 posts, read 34,295,019 times
Reputation: 10454
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
Fundamental Christianity tends to focus on living forever ie. "eternal life", but in reality it is about knowing God, which is what eonian life is
I don't know where you get that claim about Christianity. I have never heard such claim before. You enter eternal life at the moment you receive Christ as your saviour, not at the moment of your physical death, so the eternal life begins during this life, and continues into the next. Yes, living your life as a believer is about knowing God.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-15-2010, 09:17 PM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,612,233 times
Reputation: 688
Sorry I read that back and I don't think that first sentence came across right. Forgot it.

I was speaking about the words "eternal life" which seems to get equated to "salvation", because it is assumed you are saved from "eternal hell" which would then mean you have "eternal" life.

But the "eternal" in eternal life is translated from aionios, transliterated as eonian, and is really talking about knowing God (shown by John 17:3), as opposed to an infinite duration of life (ie immortality). Thus John 3:16 is not even talking about promising immortality. It is talking about knowing God.

In essence, the salvation is not "eternal life" - it is knowing God.

When we are fully saved, we will know God - in that we will follow Him and be like Him - do His commandments.

Hmm, that's still not worded the best, but I hope someone will understand what I'm trying to say. Sometimes its hard to get ideas down on paper. Just some thoughts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-16-2010, 01:49 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,285,255 times
Reputation: 869
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
Sorry I read that back and I don't think that first sentence came across right. Forgot it.

I was speaking about the words "eternal life" which seems to get equated to "salvation", because it is assumed you are saved from "eternal hell" which would then mean you have "eternal" life.

But the "eternal" in eternal life is translated from aionios, transliterated as eonian, and is really talking about knowing God (shown by John 17:3), as opposed to an infinite duration of life (ie immortality). Thus John 3:16 is not even talking about promising immortality. It is talking about knowing God.

In essence, the salvation is not "eternal life" - it is knowing God.

When we are fully saved, we will know God - in that we will follow Him and be like Him - do His commandments.

Hmm, that's still not worded the best, but I hope someone will understand what I'm trying to say. Sometimes its hard to get ideas down on paper. Just some thoughts.
Are you trying to say something like, it's not "living forever," but "forever Living." ?

Blessings,
brian
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-16-2010, 02:02 AM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,666,149 times
Reputation: 1699
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Are you trying to say something like, it's not "living forever," but "forever Living." ?

Blessings,
brian
And living vicariously through future generations who follow in the ways of God is another way to be "forever living."
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-16-2010, 05:33 AM
 
Location: Florida
62,947 posts, read 34,295,019 times
Reputation: 10454
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
Sorry I read that back and I don't think that first sentence came across right. Forgot it.

I was speaking about the words "eternal life" which seems to get equated to "salvation", because it is assumed you are saved from "eternal hell" which would then mean you have "eternal" life.

But the "eternal" in eternal life is translated from aionios, transliterated as eonian, and is really talking about knowing God (shown by John 17:3), as opposed to an infinite duration of life (ie immortality). Thus John 3:16 is not even talking about promising immortality. It is talking about knowing God.

In essence, the salvation is not "eternal life" - it is knowing God.

When we are fully saved, we will know God - in that we will follow Him and be like Him - do His commandments.

Hmm, that's still not worded the best, but I hope someone will understand what I'm trying to say. Sometimes its hard to get ideas down on paper. Just some thoughts.
You can start by giving us the translation of aionios/ eonian to prove it translates to 'knowing God'.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-16-2010, 06:57 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,612,233 times
Reputation: 688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
You can start by giving us the translation of aionios/ eonian to prove it translates to 'knowing God'.

NIV:
John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

Concordant Literal:
John 17:3 Now it is eonian life that they may know Thee, the only true God, and Him Whom Thou dost commission, Jesus Christ.

This tells us what eonian life is: to know God and Jesus.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-16-2010, 07:01 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,612,233 times
Reputation: 688
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Are you trying to say something like, it's not "living forever," but "forever Living." ?

Blessings,
brian
Not exactly.

Basically what I am saying is that the phrase "eternal life" is misunderstood. People use it to mean living on forever, when in reality the scripture defines it literally as life of the ages (eons) knowing God. So John 3:16 is not a promise about living forever... it is a promise about knowing God for the ages.

That's not to say we won't live forever or won't know God forever - because scripture also tells us that we will be made immortal and God will be all in all.

JMHO but I believe that is the correct understanding of these terms.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-16-2010, 07:09 AM
 
Location: Florida
62,947 posts, read 34,295,019 times
Reputation: 10454
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
NIV:
John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

Concordant Literal:
John 17:3 Now it is eonian life that they may know Thee, the only true God, and Him Whom Thou dost commission, Jesus Christ.

This tells us what eonian life is: to know God and Jesus.
For a limited period of time? How long?

The word does not translate to "to know God", it translates to "eternal".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-16-2010, 07:14 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,612,233 times
Reputation: 688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
For a limited period of time? How long?
Ages. The bible does not define how long that is. There is mention of the 1000 year reign in Revelations which may be part of that.

Quote:
The word does not translate to "to know God", it translates to "eternal".
It is defined as "to know God" according to John 17:3. Did you read John 17:3? And it is debatable that "eternal" is the correct translation, as some bibles translate it as "eonian", "age-abiding", "age-lasting", or "age-enduring".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top