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Old 07-14-2010, 04:19 PM
 
Location: New England
32,302 posts, read 21,155,366 times
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Saw a sign today stuck in someones front yard that said "Jesus is the only way to heaven".

Following on from the "Main error of UR" thread. I would like to point out a glaring error in fundamental christianity .

Fundamental christianity talks much about future events and little about what Jesus is actually doing in reality in their lives today , even preterists do it i hasten to add , the future events are Jesus is coming again , heaven and the lake of fire(eternal torment) .

True salvation that Jesus spoke about is "for today" .

Salvation is not being saved from eternal torment , it's for the here and now.

When Moses said stand still and see the Salvation of the Lord , it was in real time and they saw it in real time. .

Jesus said to him, "Today salvation has come to this house, because this man, too, is a son of Abraham. (Luke 19: 9)

Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation" (2 Corinthians 6:1,2).

The thief comes only in order to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have and enjoy life, and have it in abundance (to the full, till it [a]overflows). (John 10 : 10).

Believing Salvation is a future event will leave you empty today , leave you missing out on the riches of His grace and His reality in your life today, and a form of godliness which just consists of bible knowledge.
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Old 07-14-2010, 06:41 PM
 
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Good points pcamps! Also note: now is "a" day of salvation, not "the" only day of salvation.
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Old 07-15-2010, 01:34 AM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,411,021 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Saw a sign today stuck in someones front yard that said "Jesus is the only way to heaven".

Following on from the "Main error of UR" thread. I would like to point out a glaring error in fundamental christianity .

Fundamental christianity talks much about future events and little about what Jesus is actually doing in reality in their lives today , even preterists do it i hasten to add , the future events are Jesus is coming again , heaven and the lake of fire(eternal torment) .

True salvation that Jesus spoke about is "for today" .

Salvation is not being saved from eternal torment , it's for the here and now.

When Moses said stand still and see the Salvation of the Lord , it was in real time and they saw it in real time. .

Jesus said to him, "Today salvation has come to this house, because this man, too, is a son of Abraham. (Luke 19: 9)

Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation" (2 Corinthians 6:1,2).

The thief comes only in order to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have and enjoy life, and have it in abundance (to the full, till it [a]overflows). (John 10 : 10).

Believing Salvation is a future event will leave you empty today , leave you missing out on the riches of His grace and His reality in your life today, and a form of godliness which just consists of bible knowledge.
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
Good points pcamps! Also note: now is "a" day of salvation, not "the" only day of salvation.

Salvation is already procured, its just a matter of time until we all recognize the fact.


Everyone in there one order, in there own time. God is love, and love never fails. Whoever does not believe this truth, they are yet of little faith.



Amen ...
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Old 07-15-2010, 05:57 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,295,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Believing Salvation is a future event will leave you empty today , leave you missing out on the riches of His grace and His reality in your life today, and a form of godliness which just consists of bible knowledge.
Beautiful. Worship is in the Spirit, because God is Spirit.

There are some people who also believe, that God is speaking to us today, if we will listen to His voice; and that heaven and hell are both within man. No need to look for God and Jesus up in the sky, you can see Him arising in your own heart! Same with the devil: no need to look out on the street corner or in a porn shop. The devil is your fleshly desires and torments which are IN you. (The serpent eats the dust, which we are.)

Just a thought..

Blessings,
brian
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Old 07-15-2010, 06:58 AM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 10,022,757 times
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Yes it is a flaw of fundamental Christianity that everything is a future event, that we can't have and know salvation RIGHT NOW. Salvation is not something that keeps you from burning in hell, it is something to "save" us from the here and now, the "hell" on earth. It brings you joy NOW, it brings all the fruits of the spirit NOW, and all the hope for NOW and for the future.
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Old 07-15-2010, 07:24 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,193 posts, read 34,429,291 times
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I have never heard anyone claim salvation is a future event, but of course eternal life is a part of being saved. Jesus said you should not worry too much about what happens to you here on earth, because what really counts is what happens to you in eternal life. After all, our existence here is like dew in the morning, which evaporates as soon as the sun comes up. It is like a blink of an eye.

Eternal life is indeed fundamental to the teachings of Christ. He talkes about it all the time.

Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies; 26and whoever lives and believes in me will never die. Do you believe this?"

1 John 5:12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.

Matthew 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
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Old 07-15-2010, 07:44 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,295,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Matthew 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
Yes; here is an important verse.
I know the traditional thinking on this verse, and it is a thinking which requires no spiritual understanding; very "literal," very "carnal" understanding. But is this what Jesus was saying?
Jesus spoke to the people in parables, and I wonder why He used "kill" for what man does, and "destroy" for what God does...? How does God destroy? Why does God destroy?

Blessings,
brian
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Old 07-15-2010, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,193 posts, read 34,429,291 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Yes; here is an important verse.
I know the traditional thinking on this verse, and it is a thinking which requires no spiritual understanding; very "literal," very "carnal" understanding. But is this what Jesus was saying?
Jesus spoke to the people in parables, and I wonder why He used "kill" for what man does, and "destroy" for what God does...? How does God destroy? Why does God destroy?

Blessings,
brian
Basically he says to not worry about the death of the body, but to stay away from sin because it will lead to destruction the soul in hell. He encourages people to believe in Him, so that can have eternal life. How you choose to define destruction is really not revelant since we are talking about the meaning of salvation here. Salvation is not a future event, because you are saved the moment you accept Christ into your life.
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Old 07-15-2010, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,295,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Basically he says to not worry about the death of the body, but to stay away from sin because it will lead to destruction the soul in hell. He encourages people to believe in Him, so that can have eternal life. How you choose to define destruction is really not revelant since we are talking about the meaning of salvation here. Salvation is not a future event, because you are saved the moment you accept Christ into your life.
No, I believe there's much much more to it. Killing is different than destroying.

Blessings,
brian
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Old 07-15-2010, 02:13 PM
 
Location: New England
32,302 posts, read 21,155,366 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
I have never heard anyone claim salvation is a future event, but of course eternal life is a part of being saved. Jesus said you should not worry too much about what happens to you here on earth, because what really counts is what happens to you in eternal life. After all, our existence here is like dew in the morning, which evaporates as soon as the sun comes up. It is like a blink of an eye.

Eternal life is indeed fundamental to the teachings of Christ. He talkes about it all the time.

Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies; 26and whoever lives and believes in me will never die. Do you believe this?"

1 John 5:12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.

Matthew 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
Finn you have just proved the point i was making .
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