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Someone mentioned 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9. Here it is in Young's Literal Translation:
6since [it is] a righteous thing with God to give back to those troubling you -- trouble, 7and to you who are troubled -- rest with us in the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven, with messengers of his power, 8in flaming fire, giving vengeance to those not knowing God, and to those not obeying the good news of our Lord Jesus Christ; 9who shall suffer justice -- destruction age-during -- from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength,
Trouble for trouble is justice and it's righteous.
Jesus and the messengers are in flaming fire. Not scary to me.
Vengence - God's vengence will be just, as stated in verse 9.
Destruction age-during - not without end.
From the face of the Lord and from the glory of his strength - not separated from the Lord. It's all good! Sounds very fair and just. God is good all the time! He will get the glory! Every knee will bow and tongue confess that Jesus is Lord to the glory of the father!
Great post Mike, but you're talking to someone who openly admits to not being a Christian and does not follow the Bible.
I know. But it's really for the benefit of those reading it who do care about the truth. I don't waste my time anymore endlessly going back and forth with those who obviously reject the truth. I'll just make my statement and leave it at that. People will believe what they want to.
Yes. Aside from the matter of the fire, can you imagine what it will be like for those who have rejected Christ to be in a place where there will be billions of other eternally lost people who have no hope? Where there is nothing but suffering and torment in whatever form it is realized. Like the ever constant memories of all the opportunites that they had to receive Christ as Savior but refused to do so. And now they are forever shut off from any relationship with Christ. And the ever constant realization that they are there forever. There will be no authority there. No order. Nothing but chaos. And all are in a condition of utter ruin and uselessness. Just misery and hopelessness and emptyness. Eternal judgment, eternal torment.
It is not a place that anyone in their right mind would want to spend a moment in. Much less, all eternity. But that is what awaits those who refuse God's offer of salvation through faith in Christ.
I know. But it's really for the benefit of those reading it who do care about the truth. I don't waste my time anymore endlessly going back and forth with those who obviously reject the truth. I'll just make my statement and leave it at that. People will believe what they want to.
Yes me too and the Bible says in Matthew 7:6 don't give what is holy to unholy people, they will trample it and then turn and attack you, and I have seen many times on here.
Yes me too and the Bible says in Matthew 7:6 don't give what is holy to unholy people, they will trample it and then turn and attack you, and I have seen many times on here.
Me three, they've heard and they KNOW, they're WITHOUT an excuse! Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul. (Ezekiel 3: 19) They've been warned!
Yes me too and the Bible says in Matthew 7:6 don't give what is holy to unholy people, they will trample it and then turn and attack you, and I have seen many times on here.
ILNC, how many times have I called people names? And how many times have I been called names? Some, rather nasty. Indirectly. But, still..........
Mike squashes my rather thoughtful and well-put together posts (if I do say so myself) with a flick of his wrist. Not even a "well, I'll think about that" from him.
Originally Posted by Bright Hope for Tomorrow That is not true. People, with their vile imaginations and preconceived notions of an unloving God, projected those interpretations into Jesus' parables instead of realizing the spiritual nature of what He was saying. I know what you'll say - "To the contrary, " but you won't be able to come back and reply with a verse that says, "If you don't believe in me after I die, you will be set on fire and burn forever." You'll probably just quote that verse in a parable about the devil and his angels, without regard to the fact that he says it's BECAUSE they did not do good to "the least of these," or verses in Revelation that is completely full of symbolism.
Can you share a verse that is NOT in a parable and is NOT a prophesy where Jesus warns people to believe in Him or BE BURNED FOR ETERNITY? I didn't ask about perishing, by the way. Perish does not equal being set on fire.
I would ask you to show me where I've said the Bible contradicts itself, but you can't do it. You should not accuse people of saying things they did not say.
I would ask you to show me where I've said the Bible contradicts itself, but you can't do it. You should not accuse people of saying things they did not say.
I apologize for that. It wasn't you that said the bible contradicts itself, it was your friend herefornow. You guys post so similar. Sound so much alike......
I would ask you to show me where I've said the Bible contradicts itself, but you can't do it. You should not accuse people of saying things they did not say.
I apologize for that. It wasn't you that said the bible contradicts itself, it was your friend herefornow. You guys post so similar. Sound so much alike......
I am not your friend?
Anyhow, could you point me to the post where I said that, so I can review it?
YOU SAID: "When one loves God and each other, (commandments given by Jesus) they do things in a loving manner. By saying someone will burn in hell for eternity is not loving. It's instilling fear."
Let me show you lovingly....how GOD HIMSELF SAID IT:
Matthew 25:41 (Jesus speaking to unbelievers at the great while throne of judgment), "...Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels."
Revelation 14:11, "And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night."
Revelation 20:12, 15, "And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life...And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."
Matthew 10:28, "And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."
Luke 12:5, "But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which AFTER he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him."
Matthew 18: 8-9, "Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or feet to be cast into everlasting fire. And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire."
Matthew 25:46, "And these shall go away into EVERLASTING punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."
2 Thessalonians 1:9, Who shall be punished with EVERLASTING destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power.
Isaiah 66:24, "And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcasses of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be abhorring unto all flesh."
Mark 9:44 (speaking of hell), "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched." (Some believe this worm refers to the conscience. Unbelievers will have an eternity to regret their foolish decisions; whereas, Believers will someday have every tear wiped away by God Himself--Revelation 21:4).
Jude 7, "Sodom and Gomorrha...are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire."
Matthew 22:13," ...Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
Matthew 13:41-42, "The Son of man (Jesus) shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; and shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
Revelation 21:8, "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death."
Psalm 9:17, "The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God."
Isaiah 14:11-15 (Satan's final doom), "Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee...all they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us? Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee...thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit."
Daniel 12:2, "And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and EVERLASTING contempt."
It all boils down to believing doesn't it? Who are YOU GOING to BELIEVE? Forget me Betsey!! As I said before, your disbelief has nothing to do with me. It's God that you have an issue with! Your issue: BELIEVING HIM!! BELIEVING EVERY WORD THAT PROCEEDETH OUT OF HIS MOUTH! Not mines, mind you......HIS! I couldn't make this stuff up if I tried, you know that.
Wait, there's more.........
You cannot prove the bible with the bible. That is not proof that God said anything. I believe the best way to listen to God and what His truths are is to go within. Listen to that Still Small Voice. Do you honestly believe with all your heart and mind that a being who is all loving and merciful, without condition, would send any of His children to a place that is not Loving? C'mon, Betsy. God is not petty like us humans. His world and His creations are all about Love.
As I stated, hell is aplace as well as a condition. What we think, so shall it be. If our thoughts are not loving in any way (Instilling fear to leave one with no hope) we create a place that is not in harmony with God. What makes you so sure that you will be in God's presence after death if you are not in a condition to see Him on earth? When you die, you will still be the same person with the same thoughts. You will go to a place that your soul is fitted for. Some people don't even know they're dead because that is how close our two worlds are. You don't have to believe a word I say but it would be in your best interest if you instill loving thoughts and ideas to your fellow humans.
The wide gate gets everyone in. The narrow Gate can only be gone through by those who are in harmony with God. God is Divine. You must become Divine in order to enter His Kingdom. The Divine do not judge nor condemn. The Divine are merciful and kind, compassionate and forgiving. The Divine Love without condition.
How can you say you are Divine if you put conditions on your religion or ideas?
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) with a flick of his wrist. Not even a "well, I'll think about that" from him.
