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Old 07-17-2010, 04:03 PM
 
2,526 posts, read 2,390,103 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Not true. The Bible, and Christians clearly teach that God loves everyone, but hates sin. However, according to God's own rules sin cannot go unpunished.

"He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him," (John 3:36).

God is not a liar, so he WILL do as he says.
In your post you say that God loves everyone, right? So, according to your ET belief system, God sets sinners on fire (for eternity), and He does so because He loves them. Is that it? Strange kind of love, don't you think?

God Himself tells us what love is:

1Co 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind, and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant,
1Co 13:5 does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered,

Let me understand this ET doctrine: God sets rebellious sinners (sinners mind you, not their sin) on fire because He is kind, is not provoked and does not take into account the wrong suffered?

Does this summarize your ET doctrine?
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Old 07-17-2010, 05:15 PM
 
1,883 posts, read 2,557,049 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I LOVE NORTH CAROLINA View Post
Once again, yes He came to save the world, but everyone is NOT going to accept His free offer of salvation, it's not that He won't or can't, it's because some people are going to reject Him and those people will spend eternity separated from Him.
Yes,it IS that He either can't or won't.There are no other options.Laying it off on people supposedly rejecting Him falls into the "can't" category.As if the people throughout history who never knew of a Christ were capable of rejecting what they did not know about.
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Old 07-17-2010, 05:16 PM
 
Location: in the woods
180 posts, read 229,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm View Post
In your post you say that God loves everyone, right? So, according to your ET belief system, God sets sinners on fire (for eternity), and He does so because He loves them. Is that it? Strange kind of love, don't you think?

God Himself tells us what love is:

1Co 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind, and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant,
1Co 13:5 does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered,

Let me understand this ET doctrine: God sets rebellious sinners (sinners mind you, not their sin) on fire because He is kind, is not provoked and does not take into account the wrong suffered?

Does this summarize your ET doctrine?
Hello AlabamaStorm,

One question...didn't Jesus Christ become sin, so that believing in Him, as this said aformentioned, is neccessary for salvation, and avoidance of eternal destruction? I would think the relationship of the soul committing the sin, and the body acting out the sin, reject the Christ that became the sin, would be a justificable punishment eternally in Hell?

Thank you for your consideration in my post.
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Old 07-17-2010, 05:18 PM
 
1,883 posts, read 2,557,049 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerimiahJohnson View Post
Hello AlabamaStorm,

One question...didn't Jesus Christ become sin, so that believing in Him, as this said aformentioned, is neccessary for salvation, and avoidance of eternal destruction? I would think the relationship of the soul committing the sin, and the body acting out the sin, reject the Christ that became the sin, would be a justificable punishment eternally in Hell?

Thank you for your consideration in my post.
Why do you think this?
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Old 07-17-2010, 05:38 PM
 
Location: in the woods
180 posts, read 229,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifertexan View Post
Why do you think this?
Hello lifertexan,

Thank you for asking. If, by the reasoning of AlabamaStorm's post, the sin is only punished, but Christ became the sin for mankind, and if mankind rejects such Christ becoming sin for him, then his sin is not paid for, and mankind pays for his sin, as opposed to Christ becoming it for him. What I mean is, that since Christ became sin, and if He is rejected, then man, becomes what his sins were in his life, and pays for them eternally, as is stated in the Bible. He becomes the sin and receives the punishment for it and of it, forever. This to me, seems logical, according to AlabamaStorm's post. What does not seem logical, and if not contradictory in my opinion, is what AlabamaStorm appeared to summarize in the relationship of man, his sin, Christ's sacrifice, and the effects of accepting and rejecting that sacrifice.
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Old 07-17-2010, 05:44 PM
 
1,883 posts, read 2,557,049 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerimiahJohnson View Post
Hello lifertexan,

Thank you for asking. If, by the reasoning of AlabamaStorm's post, the sin is only punished, but Christ became the sin for mankind, and if mankind rejects such Christ becoming sin for him, then his sin is not paid for, and mankind pays for his sin, as opposed to Christ becoming it for him. What I mean is, that since Christ became sin, and if He is rejected, then man, becomes what his sins were in his life, and pays for them eternally, as is stated in the Bible. He becomes the sin and receives the punishment for it and of it, forever. This to me, seems logical, according to AlabamaStorm's post. What does not seem logical, and if not contradictory in my opinion, is what AlabamaStorm appeared to summarize in the relationship of man, his sin, Christ's sacrifice, and the effects of accepting and rejecting that sacrifice.
Why would an eternity in neverending torment be just payment for 80 years worth of silly and minor sins,which is only what most of mankind could be considered guilty of?Or even heinous sins?

Also,why would God create a system of justification that was unavailable to most of mankind for most of the Christian era?
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Old 07-17-2010, 05:50 PM
 
Location: Florida
62,961 posts, read 34,302,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlabamaStorm View Post
In your post you say that God loves everyone, right? So, according to your ET belief system, God sets sinners on fire (for eternity), and He does so because He loves them. Is that it? Strange kind of love, don't you think?

God Himself tells us what love is:

1Co 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind, and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant,
1Co 13:5 does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered,

Let me understand this ET doctrine: God sets rebellious sinners (sinners mind you, not their sin) on fire because He is kind, is not provoked and does not take into account the wrong suffered?

Does this summarize your ET doctrine?
No, it summarizes nothing but your unquenchable need to attack other people's faith. Do you feel smart twisting the meaning of Christian belief like that? You keep presenting the old & naive atheist argument that loving God would not send anyone to hell. I hear is from atheists and universalists every day.

God is a righteous judge, and he will judge according to the law which he created and which has been revealed to us. The Bible makes it crystal clear that sin cannot go unpunished. If He permitted people to violate his law and get away with it, it would make God himself a liar, but God is incapable of lying. Lying would make him unrighteous. Why would God create law if he didn't want people to obey it? There would be no purpose to such law, and God does nothing without a purpose.
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Old 07-17-2010, 05:56 PM
 
409 posts, read 350,363 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hljc View Post
The terminology of hate has diffrent meanings; 1st the god of hate is not the Lord God the most High God,,,,,,,2nd.. hate thy neighbour comes from the laws of Moses and not from Heaven,,,,,,,,3rd.. do good to thoughs who hate you , is the words of Jesus,,,,,,,4th...words of Jesus signifing spiritual rejection of the devil or the Lords Ways,,,,,,5th.6th.7th. 8th.9th.10th,,words of Jesus that the world will hate you... 11th .. words of Jesus hate is wrong word for the understanding of the message, means if you follow their lead away from God then you can not be my disciple. for their influence must be rejected....there is NO scripture where God hates people here and he teaches to love people, hate the sin and the devil only .....
Please tell me where the law of Moses speaks of hating our neighbor. I've never read that.
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Old 07-17-2010, 07:45 PM
 
40,039 posts, read 26,720,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
God is a righteous judge, and he will judge according to the law which he created and which has been revealed to us. The Bible makes it crystal clear that sin cannot go unpunished. If He permitted people to violate his law and get away with it, it would make God himself a liar, but God is incapable of lying. Lying would make him unrighteous. Why would God create law if he didn't want people to obey it? There would be no purpose to such law, and God does nothing without a purpose.
Sorry . . . could you specifically explain God's purpose for ET?
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Old 07-17-2010, 09:03 PM
 
Location: Florida
592 posts, read 650,721 times
Reputation: 157
1 John 5:3 This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome,
Romans 2:8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger.
Matthew 10:28
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
Luke 12:5
But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him.
2 Peter 2:4
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, [ Greek Tartarus] putting them into gloomy dungeons [ Some manuscripts into chains of darkness] to be held for judgment;
Revelation 20:15
If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

We know God kills the body and the breath of life leaves. Whether by natural causes or by sin, everyone's body and breath belong to our Creator God. If God kills everyone's body, why would it be the different for God to send an unbelieving, rejecting, disobedient, belonging to the devil soul to the lake of fire? They are not a child of God, they reject the truth of Christ by their non confessions and their actions, the Holy Spirit is not in them, they are not marked with the seal of God. The only good they do is masquerading as an angel of light.

All we can do is sow the seed and pray. God makes it grow.
All we can do is love God(loving others is loving God), He kills the body. Saves the soul if we believe in Christ.

God Bless,
Mercy
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