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Old 08-05-2010, 09:05 AM
 
Location: West Coast USA
1,577 posts, read 1,041,745 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pneuma View Post


Does it really matter?

Jesus commands us to be perfect as God is perfect

Perfect in regards to us is the same as perfect in regard to God.

So in effect Jesus is commanding us to be just like God.
Of course, it matters! The writers' intent, by the guidance of the H Spirit, is ALL that matters! That is why wwe, too, are to study to show ourselves approved.

No one is "perfect" as in error-free, which is how this word is often, and errantly, taught!
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Old 08-05-2010, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Canada
4,274 posts, read 1,663,812 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VelcroQueen View Post
Of course, it matters! The writers' intent, by the guidance of the H Spirit, is ALL that matters! That is why wwe, too, are to study to show ourselves approved.

No one is "perfect" as in error-free, which is how this word is often, and errantly, taught!
Ya missed the point VQ.

Jesus tells us to be perfect as God is perfect

The word perfect in relation to us is the exact same word perfect in relation to God.

Is God error free?

If so we are to be error free.

I am not saying man has reached this stage yet, but we are to press towards the high calling in Christ.

To be as He is

Perfect, error free
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:45 AM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
6,521 posts, read 4,429,870 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pneuma View Post
Ya missed the point VQ.

Jesus tells us to be perfect as God is perfect

The word perfect in relation to us is the exact same word perfect in relation to God.

Is God error free?

If so we are to be error free.

I am not saying man has reached this stage yet, but we are to press towards the high calling in Christ.

To be as He is

Perfect, error free
We are error free because of what Jesus did on the cross for us, not because of our rags (good works).
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:04 AM
 
1,964 posts, read 2,752,936 times
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Scgraham, I was talking about you and some others on here who preach heresy. Therefore, you cannot belong to God.
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:29 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 2,812,079 times
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Hi all,
fwiw, it seems clear to me that a large part of Christianity is having a big, big struggle with sin.
Is this what the Lord wants???

So the world goes on in sin.
And the church goes round and round about which is sin, who is sinning, how to stop sinning, what God says and thinks about sin, etc....
Sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin.

The Lord told me this: where sin abounded, Grace did much More abound!

God covers our sin daily,folks. Why keep dwelling on it????

Blessings,
brian
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:35 AM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
6,521 posts, read 4,429,870 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Hi all,
fwiw, it seems clear to me that a large part of Christianity is having a big, big struggle with sin.
Is this what the Lord wants???

So the world goes on in sin.
And the church goes round and round about which is sin, who is sinning, how to stop sinning, what God says and thinks about sin, etc....
Sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin sin.

The Lord told me this: where sin abounded, Grace did much More abound!

God covers our sin daily,folks. Why keep dwelling on it????

Blessings,
brian
Great post!

I have said to my works friends that they say the word sin more than Jesus and their focus is either all about others or all about thier good works. Very Sad.
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:50 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 2,812,079 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hilgi View Post
Great post!

I have said to my works friends that they say the word sin more than Jesus and their focus is either all about others or all about thier good works. Very Sad.
Hi hilgi,
yes, i think the church has a genuine fixation on sin and hell! It's all some people talk about! What it is, who's doing it, for how long, with whom, how bad they're gonna pay in hell for it, etc etc...

Blessings,
brian
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Pike Road, Alabama
4,852 posts, read 3,204,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Hi hilgi,
yes, i think the church has a genuine fixation on sin and hell! It's all some people talk about! What it is, who's doing it, for how long, with whom, how bad they're gonna pay in hell for it, etc etc...

Blessings,
brian
Hmmm....most of us call that GOSSIP....of my that's a SIN isn't it...
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Canada
4,274 posts, read 1,663,812 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hilgi View Post
We are error free because of what Jesus did on the cross for us, not because of our rags (good works).
So now you are saying you are perfect and do not sin?

You can't have it both ways

But yes all OUR works are filthy rags

But, but , but

Jesus said greater WORKS shall ye do because I go to the Father.

These greater WORKS are not OUR works(the filthy rag works), but Gods WORKS, that which He tells us to do.

People simply confuse works lumping them all together but that is not the case.


James 1:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

Romans 4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. 3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.


Do these scriptures conflict with one another? Or are they speaking of two aspects of faith.

First it should be pointed out that Paul in Romans 4 is speaking of faith in the birth of Isaac (this is seen in verses 18-22) and James is speaking of the sacrifice of Isaac.

Two different aspects of faith.

Abraham did nothing but believe in Isaacs birth, but once Isaac/Christ is birthed in us He produces works of faith. It is these works of faith James is speaking of and this can be seen in verse 22 ďSeest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?Ē /complete

If Abraham never offered up Isaac (which is works) then his faith would never have come to completion.

We can see these same works of faith also mentioned by both Jesus and Paul.

John 8:39
39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abrahamís children, ye would do the works of Abraham.

1 Corinthians 3:11-15
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every manís work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every manís work of what sort it is.( Are they works of faith or works of the law)
14 If any manís work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any manís work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works,(these would be works of the law) least any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. (works of faith)

2 Thessalonians 1:11
11 Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power:

Hebrews 11:7
7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark (works) to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

Now think on this; if Noah had not built the boat (which was a work of faith, the same works of faith James is speaking on) then he and his house would have drowned with the rest of mankind.

Adds another layer to ďfaith without works is deadĒ donít it.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:13 PM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
6,521 posts, read 4,429,870 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pneuma View Post
So now you are saying you are perfect and do not sin?
Yep, when God looks down at me he sees Jesus on the Cross.
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