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Old 09-05-2010, 05:42 AM
 
Location: Oregon
3,066 posts, read 2,935,861 times
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Many of the world's religions have a sacred book which it is claimed or believed to have been authored by God.

For example, there is the Bible, the Koran, The book of Mormon, the Vedas, the Pali Tripitaka, the I Ching, the Chun Boo Kyung, etc. etc.

In western civilization the Bible usually is claimed to have divine authorship. But does it? What evidence, aside from it's own assertion, can be offered to prove divine rather than human authorship?

Aren't the claims for all holy books more or less the same?

Last edited by ancient warrior; 09-05-2010 at 05:53 AM.. Reason: small size of print

 
Old 09-05-2010, 08:38 AM
 
Location: maryland
3,967 posts, read 5,671,712 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ancient warrior View Post
Many of the world's religions have a sacred book which it is claimed or believed to have been authored by God.

For example, there is the Bible, the Koran, The book of Mormon, the Vedas, the Pali Tripitaka, the I Ching, the Chun Boo Kyung, etc. etc.

In western civilization the Bible usually is claimed to have divine authorship. But does it? What evidence, aside from it's own assertion, can be offered to prove divine rather than human authorship?

Aren't the claims for all holy books more or less the same?

It's depends on your view of things i imagine. Is the bible infalible without any errors? No it is not while it does get some things correct it has a lot of things that never happened in it also. Inspired possibly....but then again it also inspires a lot of negative in us which i am not sure the goddess/god wants out of us.
 
Old 09-05-2010, 08:48 AM
 
Location: New York City
5,556 posts, read 6,708,938 times
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The "fulfilled prophecy" claim will soon be brought up as proof.
 
Old 09-05-2010, 08:58 AM
 
20,292 posts, read 15,633,754 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ancient warrior View Post
Many of the world's religions have a sacred book which it is claimed or believed to have been authored by God.

For example, there is the Bible, the Koran, The book of Mormon, the Vedas, the Pali Tripitaka, the I Ching, the Chun Boo Kyung, etc. etc.

In western civilization the Bible usually is claimed to have divine authorship. But does it? What evidence, aside from it's own assertion, can be offered to prove divine rather than human authorship?

Aren't the claims for all holy books more or less the same?
The Bible is not one book. It is 66 books with 40 human authors who for the most part didn't know each other, and each inspired by God the Holy Spirit, written over a period of nearly two thousand years (1600 years or so) and containing an integrated message.

The prophecies of the Old Testament which have been historically fulfilled attest to the divine authorship of the Bible.

Jesus Himself acknowledged the authority of the Old Testament Scriptures. And the fact that immediately after His resurrection, the Apostles had been transformed from cowards into courageous men who endured intense opposition and persecution, and eventually most were martyred, to spread His word and establish churches attest to the reality of Jesus Christ. There was no time lag between His resurrection and the beginning of the establishment of those churches and the spreading of His message sufficent for a legend concerning Jesus to develop. There were many hundreds of people who saw Jesus after He resurrected.

Then there is the fact that the Jews still exist despite intense Satanic opposition and his desire to destroy them, and the fact that they are partially back in the land in a state of unbelief in preparation for the tribulation which will occur after the rapture of the church. When Christ returns at the end of the tribulation, He returns to an already existing nation Israel.

Only the Bible is the word of God. Unless they believed in Jesus Christ for salvation before they died, the authors of the Koran, The book of Mormon, the Vedas, the Pali Tripitaka, the I Ching, the Chun Boo Kyung, etc. etc., are in Hades today awaiting their sentencing to the eternal lake of fire.
 
Old 09-05-2010, 10:28 AM
 
Location: New York City
5,556 posts, read 6,708,938 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
The Bible is not one book. It is 66 books with 40 human authors who for the most part didn't know each other, and each inspired by God the Holy Spirit, written over a period of nearly two thousand years (1600 years or so) and containing an integrated message.

The prophecies of the Old Testament which have been historically fulfilled attest to the divine authorship of the Bible.

Jesus Himself acknowledged the authority of the Old Testament Scriptures. And the fact that immediately after His resurrection, the Apostles had been transformed from cowards into courageous men who endured intense opposition and persecution, and eventually most were martyred, to spread His word and establish churches attest to the reality of Jesus Christ. There was no time lag between His resurrection and the beginning of the establishment of those churches and the spreading of His message sufficent for a legend concerning Jesus to develop. There were many hundreds of people who saw Jesus after He resurrected.

Then there is the fact that the Jews still exist despite intense Satanic opposition and his desire to destroy them, and the fact that they are partially back in the land in a state of unbelief in preparation for the tribulation which will occur after the rapture of the church. When Christ returns at the end of the tribulation, He returns to an already existing nation Israel.

Only the Bible is the word of God. Unless they believed in Jesus Christ for salvation before they died, the authors of the Koran, The book of Mormon, the Vedas, the Pali Tripitaka, the I Ching, the Chun Boo Kyung, etc. etc., are in Hades today awaiting their sentencing to the eternal lake of fire.
Again, sounds like something straight out of a book of apologetics from Josh McDowell or Lee Strobell. Makes it sound so 'matter of fact' when in reality it is not.
 
Old 09-05-2010, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Oregon
3,066 posts, read 2,935,861 times
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Mike 555 posted:

>>The prophecies of the Old Testament which have been historically fulfilled attest to the divine authorship of the Bible. <<


RESPONSE:

No. There are a number of prophecies never fulfilled by Jesus or any of the other messiah candidate. For example, the Jews have not yet been gathered back ro the land of Israel (Is 43), universal peace hasn't been established (Is 2:4), God didn't become king over the whole world (Zec 14.9), and a messiah has never sat of the throne of Israel.


>>There was no time lag between His resurrection and the beginning of the establishment of those churches<<


Not true. The immediate followers of Jesus remained a sect of orthodox Temple worshipping Jews. Christian churches were only established after the original Jerusalem Christian community was crushed.


>>There were many hundreds of people who saw Jesus after He resurrected.<<

We only have Paul's claim for this and he wasn't a witness to the Resurrection, nor does he name the witnesses. Moveover, Luke claims that Jesus ascended to heaven on the eve of the Resurrection and was only seen by Jesus' immediate disciples.


>>Only the Bible is the word of God.<<

That's an assumption which you have not evidenced.

Last edited by ancient warrior; 09-05-2010 at 08:30 PM.. Reason: typo
 
Old 09-06-2010, 09:26 AM
 
Location: Oregon
3,066 posts, read 2,935,861 times
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Current thinking is that Hebrew folklore began to be collected and the Bible began to be written about 922 BC. This would be long after the death of Moses.
 
Old 09-06-2010, 09:51 AM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,260 posts, read 20,859,174 times
Reputation: 9950
Quote:
Originally Posted by ancient warrior View Post
Many of the world's religions have a sacred book which it is claimed or believed to have been authored by God.

For example, there is the Bible, the Koran, The book of Mormon, the Vedas, the Pali Tripitaka, the I Ching, the Chun Boo Kyung, etc. etc.

In western civilization the Bible usually is claimed to have divine authorship. But does it? What evidence, aside from it's own assertion, can be offered to prove divine rather than human authorship?

Aren't the claims for all holy books more or less the same?
I never have been able to figure out why God wouldn't have revealed His word to people throughout the world and why so many people are so insistent that the Bible is the one and only record of what He wants us to know. I'm not familiar with most of the books you listed, so I can't comment as to what they teach. But it is really pretty absurd, in my opinion, to think that God wanted just a relative handful of His children to have access to what He wanted to say.
 
Old 09-06-2010, 10:11 AM
 
Location: New York City
5,556 posts, read 6,708,938 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
I never have been able to figure out why God wouldn't have revealed His word to people throughout the world and why so many people are so insistent that the Bible is the one and only record of what He wants us to know. I'm not familiar with most of the books you listed, so I can't comment as to what they teach. But it is really pretty absurd, in my opinion, to think that God wanted just a relative handful of His children to have access to what He wanted to say.
Sets the stage for "exclusivity" thinking. "We special - you not!"

Things have not changed. I can't tell you the amount of times I've been told on THIS forum that I CANNOT understand the bible because I am not led by some spirit. What is really being said is that since I don't interpret the bible as (whoever is making the statement), I am clueless, deceived, blind and not up on things like they are.
 
Old 09-06-2010, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,260 posts, read 20,859,174 times
Reputation: 9950
Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane View Post
Sets the stage for "exclusivity" thinking. "We special - you not!"
Makes sense to me.

Quote:
Things have not changed. I can't tell you the amount of times I've been told on THIS forum that I CANNOT understand the bible because I am not led by some spirit. What is really being said is that since I don't interpret the bible as (whoever is making the statement), I am clueless, deceived, blind and not up on things like they are.
I know what you're saying, and I agree with you up to a point. I do think, however, that if you were to start reading any one of these books with the idea in mind that it's just a bunch of "bs," you wouldn't get much out of it. I think you've got to be open to the possibility that there is something of value there in order to be able to find it.
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