Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The foundation of the church does not have to be built again or Jesus does not have to be die on the cross again , But Jesus is still giving the gifts of the Prophet and Apostle, Evangelist and the Pastor and the Teacher Today In the churches were there is tolerances that do not rejected the gifts of Holy Spirit.... For Lord Jesus will Honor those who oppose the Gifts and NOT give them there, so he gives them to other Churches who give Holy Spirit the lead ..... God did not loss his tongue after the scriptures were canonised, but the scipture are complete for this age for the church...... The Churches were prophecy is accepted Jesus gives a lead for up and coming times, he brings understanding and clearity into the scriptures,, he brings a lead in faith were issues are happening and people are hurting in their lives to believe .....The gifts of the Apostle are still given to men who will have authority over the land to build churches in other areas and communities, so others can spread the gospel to the world and beyond the lone church walls.....
The spiritual gifts of pastor/teacher, evangelist, helps, leadership, administration, ministering, service, giving, etc... are permanent gifts.
The temporary spiritual gifts of Apostleship, prophecy, healing, tongues, interpretation of tongues, faith -not saving faith, but the supernatural faith given to certain believers at the beginning of the church-age, wisdom, knowledge, discernment, and miracles, no longer exist. They each served a purpose at the beginning of the church-age before the written Canon of scripture was completed, but no longer are extant.
The gifts of prophet and Apostleship were designed for the purpose of producing the New Testament Canon and stablizing the Church before the completion of the Bible.
A prophet was someone who received and conveyed to others messages or doctrines that came by direct revelation from God before the Canon of Scripture was complete. No one today can proclaim anything that is not already revealed in Scripture. If there were prophets today, it would mean that God didn't convey His complete message to man in the Bible. The Canon of Scripture is closed. God has communicated everything He intends to say to man during the church-age.
The spiritual gift of apostleship existed only in the pre-canon period of the church-age. It was necessary for someone to possess absolute authority to establish churches, train pastors, to regulate doctrine, to formulate policy and keep churches doctrinally correct, in addition to writing Scripture. An Apostle was infallibly sent by God to bring new revelation to the body of Christ. Paul’s writings were infallible (1 Thess. 2:13; 2 Tim. 3:16 cf. 2 Pet 3:15, 16 where Peter placed Paul’s writing on the same level as the Old Testament).
When the Apostle John died around 96 A.D or so, the gift of apostleship was permanently removed.
In 1 Cor. 15:7, 9 Paul indicates that one of the criteria for being an Apostle was to have seen the resurrected Jesus and been personally commissioned by Him. No one today has seen the resurrected Christ and therefore cannot be an Apostle.
With the completion of the New Testament Canon, the need for apostleship ceased. The highest authority in the church today is the pastor/teacher who has authority only over his own local church.
Regarding the gift of healing, there came a time when Paul could no longer heal. Compare Acts 19:11,12 when he could heal, with Phil. 2:27 and 2 Tim. 4:20, when he couldn't heal.
People who today claim to possess the gifts of Apostleship, prophecy, tongues, miracles, or healing are apostate and reversionistic (back sliden).
The spiritual gifts of pastor/teacher, evangelist, helps, leadership, administration, ministering, service, giving, etc... are permanent gifts.
The temporary spiritual gifts of Apostleship, prophecy, healing, tongues, interpretation of tongues, faith -not saving faith, but the supernatural faith given to certain believers at the beginning of the church-age, wisdom, knowledge, discernment, and miracles, no longer exist. They each served a purpose at the beginning of the church-age before the written Canon of scripture was completed, but no longer are extant.
The gifts of prophet and Apostleship were designed for the purpose of producing the New Testament Canon and stablizing the Church before the completion of the Bible.
A prophet was someone who received and conveyed to others messages or doctrines that came by direct revelation from God before the Canon of Scripture was complete. No one today can proclaim anything that is not already revealed in Scripture. If there were prophets today, it would mean that God didn't convey His complete message to man in the Bible. The Canon of Scripture is closed. God has communicated everything He intends to say to man during the church-age.
The spiritual gift of apostleship existed only in the pre-canon period of the church-age. It was necessary for someone to possess absolute authority to establish churches, train pastors, to regulate doctrine, to formulate policy and keep churches doctrinally correct, in addition to writing Scripture. An Apostle was infallibly sent by God to bring new revelation to the body of Christ. Paul’s writings were infallible (1 Thess. 2:13; 2 Tim. 3:16 cf. 2 Pet 3:15, 16 where Peter placed Paul’s writing on the same level as the Old Testament).
When the Apostle John died around 96 A.D or so, the gift of apostleship was permanently removed.
In 1 Cor. 15:7, 9 Paul indicates that one of the criteria for being an Apostle was to have seen the resurrected Jesus and been personally commissioned by Him. No one today has seen the resurrected Christ and therefore cannot be an Apostle.
With the completion of the New Testament Canon, the need for apostleship ceased. The highest authority in the church today is the pastor/teacher who has authority only over his own local church.
Regarding the gift of healing, there came a time when Paul could no longer heal. Compare Acts 19:11,12 when he could heal, with Phil. 2:27 and 2 Tim. 4:20, when he couldn't heal.
People who today claim to possess the gifts of Apostleship, prophecy, tongues, miracles, or healing are apostate and reversionistic (back sliden).
That's funny, now you are saying all the gifts that are not considered to be miraculous are permanent, while the scriptures teach that ALL the gifts are temporary, not just the miraculous gifts. Only faith hope and love are permanent. The purpose for prophecy and healing are for edification of the church, as well for a witness to the world of the power of God in Christ. Unfortunately those who are teaching the things you are teaching are an example to the world of the hypocrisy pf the church ... They hear your arguments concerning these things and think to themselves ...
So was it in A.D. 363, at the time of the Council of Laodicea that God decided that the miraculous gifts should be done away with? Oh maybe not, because that canon had the apocrypha added in. So then, it must have been after the Council of Hippo (A.D. 393) and the Council of Carthage (A.D. 397) ... Boy, the Christian church must have noticed that their faith healing and prophesying were no longer working, i mean one day they were there and the next day they were gone. I wonder why none of the early Church fathers ever seemed to notice or mention the fact that they lost the spiritual gifts after these councils.
1 Cor. 13:8 Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away( Prophecy, tongues and knowledge were all miraculous temporary spiritual gifts which had caused a lot of trouble at Corinth). 9] For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. 10] But when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11] When I was a child, I used to speak as a child, think as a child, reason as a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12] For now we see in a mirror dimly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13] But now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
Mike,
This made my day!!!
(and since it's been a long one, I'm now going to bed...)
That's funny, now you are saying all the gifts that are not considered to be miraculous are permanent, while the scriptures teach that ALL the gifts are temporary, not just the miraculous gifts. Only faith hope and love are permanent. The purpose for prophecy and healing are for edification of the church, as well for a witness to the world of the power of God in Christ. Unfortunately those who are teaching the things you are teaching are an example to the world of the hypocrisy pf the church ... They hear your arguments concerning these things and think to themselves ...
"How convenient" ...
The temporary spiritual gifts were done away with by the time of the completion of the New Testament Scriptures around 96 A.D.
The other gifts such as pastor/teacher, evangelist, helps, etc... continue to exist through out the Church-age.
So was it in A.D. 363, at the time of the Council of Laodicea that God decided that the miraculous gifts should be done away with? Oh maybe not, because that canon had the apocrypha added in. So then, it must have been after the Council of Hippo (A.D. 393) and the Council of Carthage (A.D. 397) ... Boy, the Christian church must have noticed that their faith healing and prophesying were no longer working, i mean one day they were there and the next day they were gone. I wonder why none of the early Church fathers ever seemed to notice or mention the fact that they lost the spiritual gifts after these councils.
I have already said everything that I am going to say in posts#1, 5, 7, 12, 16, 21, and 25. Moderator cut: deleted
You either agree with what the Bible says about the matter of the temporary spiritual gifts as opposed to the gifts which continue to be operational, or you don't. I have provided sufficient information, and those who wish can do their own research. I recommend going into the sites provided in the first post.
where did it go?...it was right on context, believe me...lol
Moderator cut: orphaned reference
One mans heretic is another mans prophet. One mans trash is another mans treasure.
I cant say how many times i have been called an heretic or a false prophet or an apostate etc., or told that i was going to burn in the lake of fire or hell for all eternity on this forum ... and its all good ...
Whatever ... My post was not intended as an attack, it was intended as an honest assessment.
1 Cor. 13:8 Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away
When I was a child, I used to speak as a child, think as a child, reason as a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things.
Luke 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto "babes": even so Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.
24 For I tell you, that many prophets and kings have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.
And this was followed by the "Parable of the Good Samaritan"
The gifts of prophet and Apostleship were designed for the purpose of producing the New Testament Canon and stablizing the Church before the completion of the Bible.
Can you prove this?
Quote:
A prophet was someone who received and conveyed to others messages or doctrines that came by direct revelation from God before the Canon of Scripture was complete. No one today can proclaim anything that is not already revealed in Scripture. If there were prophets today, it would mean that God didn't convey His complete message to man in the Bible. The Canon of Scripture is closed. God has communicated everything He intends to say to man during the church-age.
Can you prove this?
Quote:
The spiritual gift of apostleship existed only in the pre-canon period of the church-age. It was necessary for someone to possess absolute authority to establish churches, train pastors, to regulate doctrine, to formulate policy and keep churches doctrinally correct, in addition to writing Scripture.
And there is apparently no further need to regulate doctrine and to keep churches doctrinally correct since all Christians are today in 100% agreement over doctrine.
Quote:
When the Apostle John died around 96 A.D or so, the gift of apostleship was permanently removed.
Can you prove this?
Quote:
People who today claim to possess the gifts of Apostleship, prophecy, tongues, miracles, or healing are apostate and reversionistic (back sliden).
Can you prove this?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Who has the gift of Prophesy?
