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And you accept absurdities and ridiculous interpretations and abominations as if they are Good . . . because you do not properly DIVIDE the scriptures. It is an intellectual travesty.
If you describe any part of God's word as absurdities, it's obvious you will never be able to properly DIVIDE anything in Scripture.
If you describe any part of God's word as absurdities, it's obvious you will never be able to properly DIVIDE anything in Scripture.
He was talking about absurdities of I N T E R P R E T A T I O N.
ie. believing God purposes people to be tormented forever while on the other hand believing God (who is love) tells us to love each other, and even tells us to love our enemies so we can be like him.
If you describe any part of God's word as absurdities, it's obvious you will never be able to properly DIVIDE anything in Scripture.
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman
He was talking about absurdities of I N T E R P R E T A T I O N.
ie. believing God purposes people to be tormented forever while on the other hand believing God (who is love) tells us to love each other, and even tells us to love our enemies so we can be like him.
That is an absurdity.
Thank you, legoman . . . of course you are correct . . . but C34 actually believes his interpretations are the word of God. His reading comprehension and knowledge of the intent of the communications is infallible in his eyes . . . so he does not even realize that he is interpreting anything. It is a sad situation that suggests no cure but an act of God. We all operate at the level of understanding God provides and of which we are capable.
Do you believe that Eby is a prophet, and are you part of the Latter Rain Movement?
What matters to me is that Eby (along with Ray Prinzing, my hero and mentor, and Canadian George Hawtin, believe that a correctly (literally, not interpretively) translated Bible teaches universal salvation, not ET, or AN, or your own FPCC. All other issues about Eby, Prinzing, and Hawtin, and about anything else that they believe are relatively unimportant to me. Kingdom Bible Studies: J. Preston Eby, Kingdom of God; Saviour of The World
I am glad for this forum where people can learn about the existence of a UR interpretation of the Bible, and based on the evidence available they can make up their mind whether or not the UR interpretation of the Bible has any merit.
Early in my life I was taught that universalists don't believe the Bible and at that time in my life I didn't know that there are URs who do believe the Bible.
Like I said before, had I known that a UR interpretation of the Bible existed, I never would have had a horrific twelve year nervous breakdown (1966-78) over my inability to successfully emotionally cope with the idea that God would let anyone choose themselves into an inescapable state of everlasting suffering forever (Arminian), or deserve to suffer forever just by being born into the human race totally depraved and not one of the elect. I'm 72 now.
sciotamicks, your Full Preterists/Covenant Creationism theology is a HUGE improvement on ET theology. But URs believe that the truth is more glorious than what is believed by FPCCers and annihilationists.
In response to Alabama you said, "It appears I may have misled you into thinking that I am considering UR, I am not and never will."
So here for others to read is the contrast as I see it.
Full Preterists/Covenant Creationism theology says that people who do not hear about Jesus before they die, and even if they do hear about Him, if they are not “willing” to take one of the statistical four or five "chances" that they just might be given to start trusting Him as their Savior, then they will simply cease to exist when they die.
VERSUS
Universal Transformation theology which says that sooner or later, because of what Christ accomplished by His death and resurrection, through the power in the blood of His cross, God will save everyone from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will. THE OUTCOME OF INFINITE GRACE – Dr. Loyal Hurley
The Outcome Of Infinite Grace, by Dr. Loyal F. Hurley (http://www.gtft.org/Library/miscellaneous/TheOutcomeOfInfiniteGrace.htm - broken link)
Not only that, but God will also transform the existence of evil and suffering into something better for everyone that it existed as He fits each individual into His master plan in their own unique way; a way that necessitates their unique temporary involvement in not choosing Jesus that will enable God to manifest, and glorify, and magnify the many facets of His character in a way that uniquely involves that person, and everyone else involved in that person’s life too.
Then, after God has finished using the existence of evil and suffering to bring blessings to all of His creatures, He will eradicate them both from existence. THE PURPOSE OF EVIL – A.P. Adams evil.html
QUESTION:
Why would anyone even want to investigate a theology that that makes our Savior anything less than CHRIST TRIUMPHANT ?? Christ Triumphant by Thomas Allin
So sciotamicks, to paraphrase what you said to Alabama
It appears that I have not misled you into thinking that I am considering Full Preterists/Covenant Creationism, I am not and never will.
Last edited by rodgertutt; 12-18-2010 at 09:11 AM..
Reason: addition
He was talking about absurdities of I N T E R P R E T A T I O N.
ie. believing God purposes people to be tormented forever while on the other hand believing God (who is love) tells us to love each other, and even tells us to love our enemies so we can be like him.
That is an absurdity.
And when Jesus tells the Jews during the Sermon on the mount to love their enemies. This was not a list of things for future Christians to do. Jesus was showing the Jews of that time that if they really wanted the law to save them. Then they would have to exceed the requirements of the law. Which the Jews knew would be impossible. And if you believe we are to love our enemies. Do you also believe if our eye offends us, we should pluck it out of our head as Jesus taught in the same Sermon? Because if you believe we are to love our enemies, you should also be giving people pointers on eye removal. Of course that would be an absurdity.
The fact is, Jesus clearly tells us that there will be people who will never enter the Kingdom of God. And trying to force fit your beliefs that ignore Christ clear teachings is the greatest absurdity of all. In Matthew 7:21,23 Jesus tells you that not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven. Only those who do what my Father in heaven wants will enter. (NOW I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU. YET I DO NOT SEE ANY BIBLICAL DISCLAIMER SUGGESTING OTHERWISE.)
Then Jesus tells these same people, and very clearly. I never knew you. Get away from me, you who do evil!
Jesus doesen't say anything about some future work release program. That's a human concept that is not supported by anything Jesus has ever told us. To push such a belief, you really have to fully ignore the words of Christ.
Matthew 13:49-50
So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth and sever the wicked from among the just, and shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
Last edited by Campbell34; 12-18-2010 at 10:03 AM..
And when Jesus tells the Jews during the Sermon on the mount to love their enemies. This was not a list of things for future Christians to do. Jesus was showing the Jews of that time that if they really wanted the law to save them. Then they would have to exceed the requirements of the law. Which the Jews knew would be impossible. And if you believe we are to love our enemies. Do you also believe if our eye offends us, we should pluck it out of our head as Jesus taught in the same Sermon? Because if you believe we are to love our enemies, you should also be giving people pointers on eye removal. Of course that would be an absurdity.
The fact is, Jesus clearly tells us that there will be people who will never enter the Kingdom of God. And trying to force fit your beliefs that ignore Christ clear teachings is the greatest absurdity of all.
I think your concept of the kingdom is off.
When you see someone loving their enemies, you are seeing God's Kingdom come.
When you see someone going the extra mile, you are seeing God's kingdom come.
When you see someone turn the other cheek, you are seeing God's kingdom come.
This person living by these principles has entered into the kingdom of God.
And when Jesus tells the Jews during the Sermon on the mount to love their enemies. This was not a list of things for future Christians to do. Jesus was showing the Jews of that time that if they really wanted the law to save them. Then they would have to exceed the requirements of the law. Which the Jews knew would be impossible. And if you believe we are to love our enemies. Do you also believe if our eye offends us, we should pluck it out of our head as Jesus taught in the same Sermon? Because if you believe we are to love our enemies, you should also be giving people pointers on eye removal. Of course that would be an absurdity.
The fact is, Jesus clearly tells us that there will be people who will never enter the Kingdom of God. And trying to force fit your beliefs that ignore Christ clear teachings is the greatest absurdity of all. In Matthew 7:21,23 Jesus tells you that not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven. Only those who do what my Father in heaven wants will enter. (NOW I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU. YET I DO NOT SEE ANY BIBLICAL DISCLAIMER SUGGESTING OTHERWISE.)
Then Jesus tells these same people, and very clearly. I never knew you. Get away from me, you who do evil!
Jesus doesen't say anything about some future work release program. That's a human concept that is not supported by anything Jesus has ever told us. To push such a belief, you really have to fully ignore the words of Christ.
Matthew 13:49-50
So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth and sever the wicked from among the just, and shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
Hey Campbell, what happens to those that don't forgive others? Do they receive forgiveness?
When you see someone loving their enemies, you are seeing God's Kingdom come.
When you see someone going the extra mile, you are seeing God's kingdom come.
When you see someone turn the other cheek, you are seeing God's kingdom come.
This person living by these principles has entered into the kingdom of God.
And when was the last time you saw someone pluck out their eyeball because it was ofending them spiritually?
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