"Original sin???" (believing, evolution, Jesus Christ, history)
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Yes, it is quite disturbing isn't it, but that is how we are thanks to Adam and his rebellion.
The tenacity of this childish belief in this "monumental sin" (of eating a fruit) that supposedly condemned all of mankind . . . is completely incomprehensible to me. What an absolutely primitive and ignorant view of the nature and motivations of our loving Almighty God you people must carry in your hearts. It was our ORIGINAL LESSON . . . NOT sin.
That's why I stated that we are born with the inclination to sin. We can be born sinless in the material sense but we aren't born sinless in the spiritual sense. The inclinations are with the spirit/soul, not the material body.
Arguing and fighting are natural with children. It's when we label it sin that it becomes a sin.
My logic is that if you react negatively to that which comes natural, then it will lead to sinfullness. If you react positively, then it will become normal and more humane to "love thy neighbor" instead of hate thy neighbor and fight, argue, etc.
I think we may agree more than we disagree on this point though we may go about explaining it differently.
I believe the doctrine of inherited is most likely fallacious. But the old testament does contradict itself on the idea that the children inherit the sins of the parents. Of course i think that has more to do with the multitude of transcriptions of the old testament that were made during the times of the original writings of the old testament and the birth of Christ.
As i have come to understand it so far, the sin of Adam is not inherited and counted against every other person who is born, but because of the sin of Adam humanity and in fact all creation was subjected to the futility of mortality and material bodily corruption.
So when a baby is newly born that babe is not already guilty of any sin, but he/she is born into a world which is subject to the effects of sin which is corruption and death. The influence of sin and corruption on new born babes as they mature naturally inclines them to sin by physical necessity/instinct, and thus we all necessarily eventually become sinners because of the corrupt bodies into which we are born.
However, Christ was not susceptible to the same corruption that the rest of mankind is subject to at the time of birth due to the fact that he was immaculately conceived, and to the fact that he was inherently born with divine and or superhuman attributes. So he was able to overcome the influences and the temptations of corruptible bodies, and live his life completely without sin.
The tenacity of this childish belief in this "monumental sin" (of eating a fruit) that supposedly condemned all of mankind . . . is completely incomprehensible to me. What an absolutely primitive and ignorant view of the nature and motivations of our loving Almighty God you people must carry in your hearts. It was our ORIGINAL LESSON . . . NOT sin.
What DO you believe in? It seems like everything is primitive and ignorant to you.
I think we may agree more than we disagree on this point though we may go about explaining it differently.
I believe the doctrine of inherited is most likely fallacious. But the old testament does contradict itself on the idea that the children inherit the sins of the parents. Of course i think that has more to do with the multitude of transcriptions of the old testament that were made during the times of the original writings of the old testament and the birth of Christ.
As i have come to understand it so far, the sin of Adam is not inherited and counted against every other person who is born, but because of the sin of Adam humanity and in fact all creation was subjected to the futility of mortality and material bodily corruption.
So when a baby is newly born that babe is not already guilty of any sin, but he/she is born into a world which is subject to the effects of sin which is corruption and death. The influence of sin and corruption on new born babes as they mature naturally inclines them to sin by physical necessity/instinct, and thus we all necessarily eventually become sinners because of the corrupt bodies into which we are born.
However, Christ was not susceptible to the same corruption that the rest of mankind is subject to at the time of birth due to the fact that he was immaculately conceived, and to the fact that he was inherently born with divine and or superhuman attributes. So he was able to overcome the influences and the temptations of corruptible bodies, and live his life completely without sin.
Peace ...
I agree with all but the last statement. I believe Jesus waas conceived as we were, however, while He was in the womb, He longed, with His soul aspirations, for God's Love to take away the inclination to sin, thus making Him sin free at birth. I understand those who disagree with this so it's only up to ourselves to either find the truth or stick with what the norm has considered the truth.
Yes, it is quite disturbing isn't it, but that is how we are thanks to Adam and his rebellion.
I've seen some very disturbing behavior in children as well. I also look to the parents because they imitate their parents. If all children were loved beyond our current understanding at birth and all through their lives, we would have a totally different world than what we have today. The children always take on traits of the parents. In my own experience,
I had to unlearn what was taught and learn all over again. It's very hard to do but it can be done. I really didn't think it was right to abuse and control children and I wanted no part of that for my child or myself. I unlearned those traits and adopted traits of love and things in my life reflect that as well as the traits of my child.
I agree with all but the last statement. I believe Jesus waas conceived as we were, however, while He was in the womb, He longed, with His soul aspirations, for God's Love to take away the inclination to sin, thus making Him sin free at birth. I understand those who disagree with this so it's only up to ourselves to either find the truth or stick with what the norm has considered the truth.
Well, we will agree to disagree on the divine nature of Christ.
What DO you believe in? It seems like everything is primitive and ignorant to you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin
Himself ....
Do you mature adults with (hopefully) fully functioning brains and reasoning power mean to insist that our loving Almighty God condemned His entire creation for the ignorant actions of His newly created innocent beings (infant living souls) over a "Fruit" because He was angry???? You find this credible without the slightest reservation or purpose of evasion???? Wouldn't it be more logical to believe that it was our species first lesson in the control of our inner drives (and the consequences of failure to do so) . . . so that our species might eventually develop sufficient self-control to discriminate between good and evil and develop mature souls?
Do you mature adults with (hopefully) fully functioning brains and reasoning power mean to insist that our loving Almighty God condemned His entire creation for the ignorant actions of His newly created innocent beings (infant living souls) over a "Fruit" because He was angry???? You find this credible without the slightest reservation or purpose of evasion???? Wouldn't it be more logical to believe that it was our species first lesson in the control of our inner drives (and the consequences of failure to do so) . . . so that our species might eventually develop sufficient self-control to discriminate between good and evil and develop mature souls?
He didn't so it because he was angry, he did it because he is righteous. If he had not done what he said he would do if they ate the fruit, it would have made God a liar. God cannot lie.
The command: "but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."
Well, they ate the fruit, and died. The Bible says sin entered the world though them, and death enterd through sin.
And he also means it when he says this: the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.
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