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Old 10-01-2010, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Seward, Alaska
2,739 posts, read 7,661,753 times
Reputation: 1963

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Why do some people...who say they are a Christian, go to church, pray to God, read the Bible, fellowship with other Christians...

...at the same time do REALLY bad things to others???

We are an "acquaintance" of one such a person, a middle-aged woman, who came out to visit me and my wife a couple of times. First, we caught this person stealing a "zester" (kitchen tool for grating cheese) from our kitchen. It was brand-new...had never been used. Later, my wife noticed it was missing, and then one day when visiting this woman saw it setting there in a drawer in this woman's kitchen. The woman gave it back, so we forgave her, and put the incident behind us...no big deal. (or so we thought) (Besides, how much can the item be worth...maybe $5 ?)

So...the same woman comes back to visit us again. A day later, my wife notices that 6 (yes, SIX!) of her rings are missing, from the drawer she keeps them in. There were our wedding bands, and 4 other rings, all gold, three had real diamonds, with a total appraised value of about $2500. We thought at first that my wife had simply misplaced the rings, so we searched the entire house THOROUGHLY, top to bottem, over the course of about 10 days. We left nothing unopened, nothing unturned...searched every box, every pocket, every drawer....I mean everything. We also searched our vehicles, and every other place we had been that day...nothing. That woman had been in the room where the rings were...unattended and unwatched...for about 5 to 10 minutes. We asked around, and learned she had been fired from THREE jobs for stealing stuff. A local church had kicked her out and asked her not to come back, unless she talked to the pastor first. And we heard from others that she had taken stuff from them as well. So....circumstantial evidence only: we believe she took our rings. Nobody else has visited us since that woman was here (except for the police)...the house wasn't broken into...we have only her as suspect...

We filed a theft report with the police, and they are investigating, but haven't gotten back to us yet. We don't know what else we can do. (except to pray) Because of what they represent, we cannot replace our wedding bands for any price...unless they are recovered, they are now gone forever...

I am just totally flabbergasted that anyone who calls themselves "Christian" can, at the same time, steal thousands of dollars worth of stuff that doesn't belong to them....they have way more than just "one screw loose"...they are playing with half their deck of cards missing. Personally, I do not care $.02 about jewelry (don't even wear a watch), but since my wife is so heart broken and depressed over all this it also affects me. We don't know what else we can do, at this point...

Why do people do such things, to others? I fear for this woman on that day she has to stand before the Lord...

(and yes....nothing of value will ever be left just laying around in our house anymore...unless we are standing right there)


Bud
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Old 10-01-2010, 02:13 PM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,697,919 times
Reputation: 639
Paul actually has the answer to this. Although we do not really read the details of what Paul was referring to when he said he did the things he hated.

Perhaps this woman, without you being able to observe, says the same things.

What was pauls conclusion to this problem?
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Old 10-01-2010, 02:17 PM
 
Location: South Jordan, Utah
6,652 posts, read 7,145,372 times
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Look how many financial criminals are activie in church, it is easy because people assume the best since they claim to be a Christian.
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Old 10-01-2010, 02:25 PM
 
Location: Prattville, Alabama
4,883 posts, read 5,131,277 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by BudinAk View Post
Why do some people...who say they are a Christian, go to church, pray to God, read the Bible, fellowship with other Christians...

...at the same time do REALLY bad things to others???

We are an "acquaintance" of one such a person, a middle-aged woman, who came out to visit me and my wife a couple of times. First, we caught this person stealing a "zester" (kitchen tool for grating cheese) from our kitchen. It was brand-new...had never been used. Later, my wife noticed it was missing, and then one day when visiting this woman saw it setting there in a drawer in this woman's kitchen. The woman gave it back, so we forgave her, and put the incident behind us...no big deal. (or so we thought) (Besides, how much can the item be worth...maybe $5 ?)

So...the same woman comes back to visit us again. A day later, my wife notices that 6 (yes, SIX!) of her rings are missing, from the drawer she keeps them in. There were our wedding bands, and 4 other rings, all gold, three had real diamonds, with a total appraised value of about $2500. We thought at first that my wife had simply misplaced the rings, so we searched the entire house THOROUGHLY, top to bottem, over the course of about 10 days. We left nothing unopened, nothing unturned...searched every box, every pocket, every drawer....I mean everything. We also searched our vehicles, and every other place we had been that day...nothing. That woman had been in the room where the rings were...unattended and unwatched...for about 5 to 10 minutes. We asked around, and learned she had been fired from THREE jobs for stealing stuff. A local church had kicked her out and asked her not to come back, unless she talked to the pastor first. And we heard from others that she had taken stuff from them as well. So....circumstantial evidence only: we believe she took our rings. Nobody else has visited us since that woman was here (except for the police)...the house wasn't broken into...we have only her as suspect...

We filed a theft report with the police, and they are investigating, but haven't gotten back to us yet. We don't know what else we can do. (except to pray) Because of what they represent, we cannot replace our wedding bands for any price...unless they are recovered, they are now gone forever...

I am just totally flabbergasted that anyone who calls themselves "Christian" can, at the same time, steal thousands of dollars worth of stuff that doesn't belong to them....they have way more than just "one screw loose"...they are playing with half their deck of cards missing. Personally, I do not care $.02 about jewelry (don't even wear a watch), but since my wife is so heart broken and depressed over all this it also affects me. We don't know what else we can do, at this point...

Why do people do such things, to others? I fear for this woman on that day she has to stand before the Lord...

(and yes....nothing of value will ever be left just laying around in our house anymore...unless we are standing right there)


Bud
Fool me once...shame on you.
Fool me twice...shame on me!
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Old 10-01-2010, 02:29 PM
 
6,039 posts, read 9,238,450 times
Reputation: 3933
She may be mentally ill; a kleptomaniac. It happens. Not that it excuses her actions, but it might be the answer.
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Old 10-01-2010, 02:29 PM
 
Location: Indianapolis
4,325 posts, read 5,143,751 times
Reputation: 666
Quote:
Originally Posted by BudinAk View Post
Why do some people...who say they are a Christian, go to church, pray to God, read the Bible, fellowship with other Christians...

...at the same time do REALLY bad things to others???

We are an "acquaintance" of one such a person, a middle-aged woman, who came out to visit me and my wife a couple of times. First, we caught this person stealing a "zester" (kitchen tool for grating cheese) from our kitchen. It was brand-new...had never been used. Later, my wife noticed it was missing, and then one day when visiting this woman saw it setting there in a drawer in this woman's kitchen. The woman gave it back, so we forgave her, and put the incident behind us...no big deal. (or so we thought) (Besides, how much can the item be worth...maybe $5 ?)

So...the same woman comes back to visit us again. A day later, my wife notices that 6 (yes, SIX!) of her rings are missing, from the drawer she keeps them in. There were our wedding bands, and 4 other rings, all gold, three had real diamonds, with a total appraised value of about $2500. We thought at first that my wife had simply misplaced the rings, so we searched the entire house THOROUGHLY, top to bottem, over the course of about 10 days. We left nothing unopened, nothing unturned...searched every box, every pocket, every drawer....I mean everything. We also searched our vehicles, and every other place we had been that day...nothing. That woman had been in the room where the rings were...unattended and unwatched...for about 5 to 10 minutes. We asked around, and learned she had been fired from THREE jobs for stealing stuff. A local church had kicked her out and asked her not to come back, unless she talked to the pastor first. And we heard from others that she had taken stuff from them as well. So....circumstantial evidence only: we believe she took our rings. Nobody else has visited us since that woman was here (except for the police)...the house wasn't broken into...we have only her as suspect...

We filed a theft report with the police, and they are investigating, but haven't gotten back to us yet. We don't know what else we can do. (except to pray) Because of what they represent, we cannot replace our wedding bands for any price...unless they are recovered, they are now gone forever...

I am just totally flabbergasted that anyone who calls themselves "Christian" can, at the same time, steal thousands of dollars worth of stuff that doesn't belong to them....they have way more than just "one screw loose"...they are playing with half their deck of cards missing. Personally, I do not care $.02 about jewelry (don't even wear a watch), but since my wife is so heart broken and depressed over all this it also affects me. We don't know what else we can do, at this point...

Why do people do such things, to others? I fear for this woman on that day she has to stand before the Lord...

(and yes....nothing of value will ever be left just laying around in our house anymore...unless we are standing right there)


Bud
Maybe she "unintentionally" takes things. Some people are clepto's because it's a disorder. They know they do it, they just can't stop themselves.

A good friend of mine went to school with someone like this. They had to watch him all the time. No matter where they went, he took something. Fortunately, this guy was very good natured. It soon became a joke so when people knew he was coming over, they wouldn't hide anything. When he stole it, they told him right away and he gave it back.

Maybe you should point it out to her so she can get counselling. Let her know that you care about her enough that you would like to see her get a better handle on the situation.

On the other hand, if she steals just to steal, maybe you should never leave her alone when you have her visit and inform her that you know about her actions.
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Old 10-01-2010, 02:44 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
2,031 posts, read 2,694,500 times
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I'm really sorry that happened to you. That's awful. There are many people who say they are Christians, but clearly aren't. By their fruit you'll know them.
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Old 10-01-2010, 02:55 PM
 
7,790 posts, read 10,470,982 times
Reputation: 3397
Quote:
Originally Posted by BudinAk View Post

First, we caught this person stealing a "zester" (kitchen tool for grating cheese) from our kitchen.

A day later, my wife notices that 6 (yes, SIX!) of her rings are missing, from the drawer she keeps them in.

We asked around, and learned she had been fired from THREE jobs for stealing stuff.

And we heard from others that she had taken stuff from them as well.

Why do people do such things, to others?
June agrees with Mercury Cougar and Reverend: The woman would appear to be suffering from kleptomania. The fact that she has a well estabished pattern of having been caught in thefts would tend to make June lean in the direction of her actions being those of kleptomania. What particularly stands out to June is the fact that she stole the kitchen tool: Unlike the rings, the kitchen tool was not anything of any personal value to her, yet she took it. The rings would likewise fit a pattern of kleptomania, as they would have had no personal value to her. (Monetary value notwithstanding.) Clinically speaking, an individual who suffers from kleptomania acts (operates) along the same continuum as someone with an obsessive-compulsive disorder.

Although having a name or term to attribute to what is, in fact, a point of loss for both you and your wife may or may not help, nonetheless June feels that this woman is not intentionally looking to be a thief or a sinner. She would appear to suffer from what is (as experienced by her) a disorder that exists outside of her control.

For what's it's worth, the link below, in the event it might lend context.

Kleptomania (http://www.psychnet-uk.com/dsm_iv/kleptomania.htm - broken link)


Take gentle care.
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Old 10-01-2010, 03:49 PM
 
Location: In God's Hand
1,315 posts, read 1,533,595 times
Reputation: 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by BudinAk View Post
Personally, I do not care $.02 about jewelry (don't even wear a watch), but since my wife is so heart broken and depressed over all this it also affects me. We don't know what else we can do, at this point...
Ask Jesus for help in not being so heartbroken.

Colossians 3: 1If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. 2Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

1 Timothy 6: 6But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.

Matthew 6:19Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: 20But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal: 21For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

If you consider that a natural catastrophe could come on your home suddenly: and you have no time to grab your valuables and you escaped with your lives: would you then be heartbroken over your loss or would you be glad that you all survived?

There is no point fretting over the loss of those rings.

Instead: be thankful that the loss of those rings does not mean the end of your marriage down on earth and that your love for each other still exists in spite of the loss of those rings.

Other marriages haven't lost their rings and yet they have lost their love.

If you consider that the rapture will be coming soon, no one will be taking anything with them when it is time to go. They will have to treasure the things above more than the things below in order to leave them behind.

So ask Jesus for help in not being so heartbroken, and be thankful for what you have.
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Old 10-01-2010, 03:55 PM
 
Location: Seward, Alaska
2,739 posts, read 7,661,753 times
Reputation: 1963
I have a feeling that those who mentioned kleptomania are "spot on"...she does seem to fit that pattern: that she has that mental disorder...she doesn't seem to be able to control the problem...she doesn't seem to be able to stop herself from stealing. (anything: could be a "nickel" item, or something worth thousands...doesn't seem to matter) (having that disorder doesn't excuse the stealing) My wife watched her take a bicycle that was leaning against a building, and when my wife confronted her about it, that the bike most likely belonged to someone, the woman said "but...there was nobody standing there next to it...". (The woman's husband made her take it back)
Also, it seems like every single time she is caught she has some kind of "justification" to excuse her stealing...that it's "ok" for her to be doing what she is doing, because "______" (fill in the blank) Like once a friend caught her stealing something, and she said "oh, but I thought you gave me this..." (yeah...right...)
Could she really be a Christian, and still have this disorder? Well...yeah...I think it's possible. Christians get sick just like any other person...

Bud
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