The sinner is separated from Christ...and God does not hear the prayers of sinners. (Gospel, believe)

[AlabamaStorm]

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

Jesus Christ came to save sinners. Romans 5:8 says, "But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us." The Lord says that Jesus died for us while we WERE STILL sinners. That i...s past tense.

Actually, it reads in the present tense. But that's another matter .

Jesus Christ died for sinners. Jesus rose from the dead as a promise to those who followed after Him who would die in the flesh to their sins. His death was the atonement. His resurrection was the promise. You don't get the promise without the atonement.

I'm not sure I follow your line of reasoning. Jesus' resurrection from the dead was much more than a "promise", it was a testimony from God that we (the sinner) are free from the penalty and curse of the law. That is the GOOD NEWS of the GOSPEL! Read it hear:

Rom 4:25 who was delivered up because of our offences, and was raised up because of our being declared righteous.

God has declared the sinner to be JUSTIFIED! The sinner is DECLARED RIGHTEOUS by GOD in Jesus' resurrection. That was not a promise by God, but a full and outright DECLARATION! That is the GOOD NEWS! And that is why we call it the GOSPEL!

Here, let's read the GOSPEL that Paul proclaimed:

1Co 15:1 And I make known to you, brethren, the good news that I proclaimed to you, which also ye did receive, in which also ye have stood,
1Co 15:2 through which also ye are being saved, in what words I proclaimed good news to you, if ye hold fast, except ye did believe in vain,

I want to stop here for a moment. Do you see what Paul says: "except ye did believe in vain"? There were some that denied the resurrection and what God had declared therein! Paul tells us that if so, then they've believed in vain. And why so? Because without that resurrection then there is also no justification! NONE! But praise God, Jesus rose up out of that grave! The sinner is JUSTIFIED!

1Co 15:3 for I delivered to you first, what also I did receive, that Christ died for our sins, according to the Writings,
1Co 15:4 and that he was buried, and that he hath risen on the third day, according to the Writings,

Therein is our JUSTIFICATION before God! We are JUSTIFIED on the merits of CHRIST ALONE!

Believe it Verna!

[Meerkat2]

Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane

I am not a Christian, but the scripture you quote from John was NOT said by the Jesus fellow. That was an assumption made by his rivals the Pharisees, if I recall.

Correct

In context
Joh 9:16 Therefore said some of the Pharisees, This man is not of God, because he keepeth not the sabbath day. Others said, How can a man that is a sinner do such miracles? And there was a division among them.
Joh 9:17 They say unto the blind man again, What sayest thou of him, that he hath opened thine eyes? He said, He is a prophet.
Joh 9:18 But the Jews did not believe concerning him, that he had been blind, and received his sight, until they called the parents of him that had received his sight.
Joh 9:19 And they asked them, saying, Is this your son, who ye say was born blind? how then doth he now see?
Joh 9:20 His parents answered them and said, We know that this is our son, and that he was born blind:
Joh 9:21 But by what means he now seeth, we know not; or who hath opened his eyes, we know not: he is of age; ask him: he shall speak for himself.
Joh 9:22 These words spake his parents, because they feared the Jews: for the Jews had agreed already, that if any man did confess that he was Christ, he should be put out of the synagogue.
Joh 9:23 Therefore said his parents, He is of age; ask him.
Joh 9:24 Then again called they the man that was blind, and said unto him, Give God the praise: we know that this man is a sinner.
Joh 9:25 He answered and said, Whether he be a sinner or no, I know not: one thing I know, that, whereas I was blind, now I see.
Joh 9:26 Then said they to him again, What did he to thee? how opened he thine eyes?
Joh 9:27 He answered them, I have told you already, and ye did not hear: wherefore would ye hear it again? will ye also be his disciples?
Joh 9:28 Then they reviled him, and said, Thou art his disciple; but we are Moses' disciples.
Joh 9:29 We know that God spake unto Moses: as for this fellow, we know not from whence he is.
Joh 9:30 The man answered and said unto them, Why herein is a marvellous thing, that ye know not from whence he is, and yet he hath opened mine eyes.
Joh 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.
Joh 9:32 Since the world began was it not heard that any man opened the eyes of one that was born blind.
Joh 9:33 If this man were not of God, he could do nothing.
Joh 9:34 They answered and said unto him, Thou wast altogether born in sins, and dost thou teach us? And they cast him out.
Joh 9:35 Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and when he had found him, he said unto him, Dost thou believe on the Son of God?
Joh 9:36 He answered and said, Who is he, Lord, that I might believe on him?
Joh 9:37 And Jesus said unto him, Thou hast both seen him, and it is he that talketh with thee.
Joh 9:38 And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.
Joh 9:39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
Joh 9:40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
Joh 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

[ans57]

Originally Posted by meerkat2

Correct

In context
Joh 9:16 Therefore said some of the Pharisees, This man is not of God, because he keepeth not the sabbath day. Others said, How can a man that is a sinner do such miracles? And there was a division among them.
Joh 9:17 They say unto the blind man again, What sayest thou of him, that he hath opened thine eyes? He said, He is a prophet.
Joh 9:18 But the Jews did not believe concerning him, that he had been blind, and received his sight, until they called the parents of him that had received his sight.
Joh 9:19 And they asked them, saying, Is this your son, who ye say was born blind? how then doth he now see?
Joh 9:20 His parents answered them and said, We know that this is our son, and that he was born blind:
Joh 9:21 But by what means he now seeth, we know not; or who hath opened his eyes, we know not: he is of age; ask him: he shall speak for himself.
Joh 9:22 These words spake his parents, because they feared the Jews: for the Jews had agreed already, that if any man did confess that he was Christ, he should be put out of the synagogue.
Joh 9:23 Therefore said his parents, He is of age; ask him.
Joh 9:24 Then again called they the man that was blind, and said unto him, Give God the praise: we know that this man is a sinner.
Joh 9:25 He answered and said, Whether he be a sinner or no, I know not: one thing I know, that, whereas I was blind, now I see.
Joh 9:26 Then said they to him again, What did he to thee? how opened he thine eyes?
Joh 9:27 He answered them, I have told you already, and ye did not hear: wherefore would ye hear it again? will ye also be his disciples?
Joh 9:28 Then they reviled him, and said, Thou art his disciple; but we are Moses' disciples.
Joh 9:29 We know that God spake unto Moses: as for this fellow, we know not from whence he is.
Joh 9:30 The man answered and said unto them, Why herein is a marvellous thing, that ye know not from whence he is, and yet he hath opened mine eyes.
Joh 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.
Joh 9:32 Since the world began was it not heard that any man opened the eyes of one that was born blind.
Joh 9:33 If this man were not of God, he could do nothing.
Joh 9:34 They answered and said unto him, Thou wast altogether born in sins, and dost thou teach us? And they cast him out.
Joh 9:35 Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and when he had found him, he said unto him, Dost thou believe on the Son of God?
Joh 9:36 He answered and said, Who is he, Lord, that I might believe on him?
Joh 9:37 And Jesus said unto him, Thou hast both seen him, and it is he that talketh with thee.
Joh 9:38 And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.
Joh 9:39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
Joh 9:40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
Joh 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

Thanks for the reminder meerkat!

[Verna Perry]

John 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.

[God heareth not - When a miracle was performed it was customary to invoke the aid of God. Jesus often did this himself, and it was by his power only that prophets and apostles could perform miracles. The word "heareth" in this place is to be understood as referring to such cases. God will not hear - that is, He will not answer. ]


This verse (John 9:31) has no reference to the prayers which sinners make for salvation.


The only prayers which God will not hear are those which are offered in mockery, or when the man loves his sins and is unwilling to give them up. Such prayers God will not hear...

Psalm 66:18 "If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me;"

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Isaiah 1:

14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.
15 And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.

[Isaiah, verses 10-15: Judea was desolate, and their cities burned. This awakened them to bring sacrifices and offerings, as if they would bribe God to remove the punishment, and give them leave to go on in their sin. Many who will readily part with their sacrifices, will not be persuaded to part with their sins. They relied on the mere form as a service deserving a reward. The most costly devotions of wicked people, without thorough reformation of heart and life, cannot be acceptable to God. He not only did not accept them, but he abhorred them. All this shows that sin is very hateful to God. If we allow ourselves in secret sin, or forbidden indulgences; if we reject the salvation of Christ, our very prayers will become abomination.]


16 Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil;
17 Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.
18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
19 If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land: 20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

27 Zion shall be redeemed with judgment, and her converts with righteousness.28 And the destruction of the transgressors and of the sinners shall be together, and they that forsake the LORD shall be consumed.

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Job 27:
7 Let mine enemy be as the wicked, and he that riseth up against me as the unrighteous.
8 For what is the hope of the hypocrite, though he hath gained, when God taketh away his soul?
9Will God hear his cry when trouble cometh upon him?

[Job looked upon the condition of a hypocrite and a wicked man, to be most miserable. If they gained through life by their profession, and kept up their presumptuous hope till death, what would that avail when God required their souls? The more comfort we find in our religion, the more closely we shall cleave to it. Those who have no delight in God, are easily drawn away by the pleasures, and easily overcome by the crosses of this life.]

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Jeremiah 11:
1 The word that came to Jeremiah from the LORD, saying,
2 Hear ye the words of this covenant, and speak unto the men of Judah, and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem;
3 And say thou unto them, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel; Cursed be the man that obeyeth not the words of this covenant,
4 Which I commanded your fathers in the day that I brought them forth out of the land of Egypt, from the iron furnace, saying, Obey my voice, and do them, according to all which I command you: so shall ye be my people, and I will be your God:
5 That I may perform the oath which I have sworn unto your fathers, to give them a land flowing with milk and honey, as it is this day. Then answered I, and said, So be it, O LORD.

6 Then the LORD said unto me, Proclaim all these words in the cities of Judah, and in the streets of Jerusalem, saying, Hear ye the words of this covenant, and do them.
7 For I earnestly protested unto your fathers in the day that I brought them up out of the land of Egypt, even unto this day, rising early and protesting, saying, Obey my voice.
8 Yet they obeyed not, nor inclined their ear, but walked every one in the imagination of their evil heart: therefore I will bring upon them all the words of this covenant, which I commanded them to do; but they did them not.
9 And the LORD said unto me, A conspiracy is found among the men of Judah, and among the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
10 They are turned back to the iniquities of their forefathers, which refused to hear my words; and they went after other gods to serve them: the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers.
11Therefore thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will bring evil upon them, which they shall not be able to escape; and though they shall cry unto me, I will not hearken unto them.

[Those whose own prayers will not be heard, cannot expect benefit from the prayers of others.
When God found so much evil among them we cannot think it strange if it follows, Therefore I will bring evil upon them (v. 11), the evil of punishment for the evil of sin; and there is no remedy, no relief: the decree has gone forth and the sentence will be executed.]

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Ezekiel 8:
18 Therefore will I also deal in fury: mine eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity: and though they cry in mine ears with a loud voice, yet will I not hear them.


[God passes sentence upon them that they shall be utterly cut off: Therefore, because they are so bent upon sin, I will also deal in fury with them, v. 18. They filled the land with their violence, and God will fill it with the violence of their enemies; and he will not lend a favourable ear to them. Of his own pity: My eye shall not spare, neither will I have pity; repentance shall be hidden from his eyes. Of their prayers: Though they cry in my ears with a loud voice, yet will I not hear them; for still their sins cry more loudly for vengeance than their prayers cry for mercy.]

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Micah 3:
4 Then shall they cry unto the LORD, but he will not hear them: he will even hide his face from them at that time, as they have behaved themselves ill in their doings.

[They hate the good and love the evil; they hate good in others, and hate it should have any influence on themselves; they hate to do good, hate to have any good done, and hate those that are good and do good; and they love the evil, delight in mischief.]

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Zechariah 7:
12 Yea, they made their hearts as an adamant stone, lest they should hear the law, and the words which the LORD of hosts hath sent in his spirit by the former prophets: therefore came a great wrath from the LORD of hosts.
13 Therefore it is come to pass, that as he cried, and they would not hear; so they cried, and I would not hear, saith the LORD of hosts:

[The law of God lays restraint upon the heart. But they filled their minds with prejudices against the word of God. Nothing is harder than the heart of a presumptuous sinner. See the fatal consequences of this to their fathers. Great sins against the Lord of hosts, bring great wrath from his power, which cannot be resisted. Sin, if regarded in the heart, will certainly spoil the success of prayer. The Lord always hears the cry of the broken-hearted penitent; yet all who die impenitent and unbelieving, will find no remedy or refuge from miseries which while here they despised and defied, but which they then will not be able to bear.]

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A worshipper - A sincere worshipper; one who fears, loves, and adores him.
Doeth his will - Obeys his commandments. This is infallibly true. The Scripture abounds with promises to such that God will hear their prayer...

Psalm 34:
15 The eyes of the LORD are upon the righteous, and his ears are open unto their cry.

16 The face of the LORD is against them that do evil, to cut off the remembrance of them from the earth. 17 The righteous cry, and the LORD heareth, and delivereth them out of all their troubles.


Matthew 7:
7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.



Bless Your Holy Word Dear Father...Bless the eyes that read and see with understanding...Bless the ears that hear and believe... Bless the hearts that are open to receive the knowledge of Your truth...and Bless them with the wisdom to do them. Amen.


God Bless.

In Christ's love...and prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.

[Ironmaw1776]

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

THE SINNER IS SEPARATED FROM CHRIST.

Hebrews 7:26 "For such a high priest was fitting for us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, [FONT=Arial BlackSEPARATE FROM SINNERS[/font], and has become higher than the heavens." If you are a sinner Jesus Christ does not live in your heart as the Word of God clearly says you are separate from Him. Sin separates you from God, therefore, being a sinner makes you separate.



GOD DOES NOT HEAR THE PRAYERS OF SINNERS

John 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.

1 Peter 3:12 also says, "For the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous, and His ears are open to their prayers; ]But the face of the Lord is against those who do evil." God is saying here that He hears the prayers of the righteous but those who do evil (sinners) are not His and His face is set against them. If God is against you, are you saved? Certainly not!


Jesus Christ came to save sinners.

Romans 5:8 says, "But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us." The Lord says that Jesus died for us while we WERE STILL sinners. That i...s past tense. Jesus Christ died for sinners. Jesus rose from the dead as a promise to those who followed after Him who would die in the flesh to their sins. His death was the atonement. His resurrection was the promise. You don't get the promise without the atonement. If you want to follow Jesus you must walk where He walked. You must go where He went. When Jesus said in Matthew 16:24, "If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, let him take up his cross, and follow Me." Follow Him? Where was Jesus going? To the crucifixion at Calvary. That too is where you must go. The path to the resurrection goes straight through the crucifixion.

If you want to be resurrected like Christ and be with Him you must crucify your flesh on the cross.

Galatians 5:24, " Those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires." You must crucify your sin. That is repentance. Once that is done then your spirit is raised from the dead in Christ and you are saved. Then you become born again as Jesus said in John 3:3 "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." But being born again means dying first. If you are still a sinner you are still the old you and not born again as the new you.

The Word says you become a new creation in Christ when you get born again (2 Corithians 5:17). If you still sin wilfully, how are you a new creation? If you say that you are saved and Christ lives in you and yet you cannot stop willfully sinning then you are saying that Christ living in you is weaker than the Devil outside of you who causes you to sin. But if you willfully sin Christ is not in you.

Once you have crucified your flesh and the Holy Spirit does indeed live in you then you will have the power of God Himself to walk apart from sin. Then you will be transformed into a SAINT.


In Christ's love...and prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.

Originally Posted by scgraham

God only hears the prayers of sinners when seeking repentance; the prayers of unrepentant sinners and hypocrites go unheard.

I'm a sinner, and God obviously hears my prayers as they are usually answered. I don't care what anyone says.

As a matter of fact i am very thankful for this thread, because i am certain that there are many others on this forum Whom you guys confuse and cause to sway in their faith in Christ as their savior because of your false teaching who will recognize and be convinced that you're lying, because they will know from first hand experience that God answers their prayers even though they are sinners ...



Peace ...

[herefornow]

Verna, I can't figure out why you are always slinging hundreds of Old Testament verses at people. Are you sure you want to live under the law? I hear that's not such a good place to be hanging out. Have you heard the Good News? I think it starts in Matthew, somewhere.

[pcamps]

Originally Posted by herefornow

Verna, I can't figure out why you are always slinging hundreds of Old Testament verses at people. Are you sure you want to live under the law? I hear that's not such a good place to be hanging out. Have you heard the Good News? I think it starts in Matthew, somewhere.

It's pretty easy to figure out herefornow, as Ironmaw pointed out on another thread

Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts, but when anyone turns to the Lord the veil is taken away (2 Cor 3 :16).The only way to read the law correctly and not come under the bondage of it is by turning from from the law to grace(grace is an eye opener) ,otherwise the veil remains and all you will see as you are reading it is a sinner hating god , with the confusing message that he both loves us and hates us at the same time. .

The good news is actually right there in the OT , even in the books of Moses you will find the good news , God said to Moses that will raise up a prophet (referring to Jesus). Isaiah prophecised the good news too .

[TheUnknown67]

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

Indignant rant no 3999

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

Indignant rant no 4000

That you view yourself as one of the few righteous on here and that the vast majority of others posters on here are deluded sinners whom God loathes with a burning and fiery passion, I can just picture you seething with rage and your face turning bright purple, before you unleash your anger towards all on this forum

The question is, why do you feel this incessant urge and need to keep repeating yourself over and over again

[Verna Perry]

Originally Posted by herefornow

Verna, I can't figure out why you are always slinging hundreds of Old Testament verses at people. Are you sure you want to live under the law? I hear that's not such a good place to be hanging out. Have you heard the Good News? I think it starts in Matthew, somewhere.

Where I am in the LORD herefornow is the most beautiful place to be...that he can place his delight on such an unworthy creature as I am...Oh! how much more should I hold close and dear to my heart every single word that comes from His mouth...from the beginning to the end...it started even before the foundations of the earth were formed...He knew my name...and then, when He made the earth and all that is upon it...and it never ends for those who love and live for Him...eternity...that is a very, very long time, and I plan on being by His side, loving, praising and adoring Him.


"Ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto the unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently, being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever," (1 Pet. 1:22, 23).

Originally Posted by alisonminnie

That you view yourself as one of the few righteous on here and that the vast majority of others posters on here are deluded sinners whom God loathes with a burning and fiery passion, I can just picture you seething with rage and your face turning bright purple, before you unleash your anger towards all on this forum

The question is, why do you feel this incessant urge and need to keep repeating yourself over and over again

I am not righteous...I am so unworthy, so wretched...it is the righteousness of Christ within me...it is His Spirit within me that gives me the power to be an overcomer.

The LORD and His every law and precept is my delight...He is my joy...my hope...my everything...and I love to minister to Him through my faith in Him by living as He wills me to live...I love knowing that I make Him smile...and that I please Him...all His delights are in His saints that are in the earth.

...and my hope is that someone somewhere will read what I post and believe and be saved so that they too will know what it is...the love of God, and live eternally with Him by their side. It is all that matters in this life. That's why.

Psalm 119:24 Thy testimonies also [are] my delight [and] my counsellers.

Psalm 119:16 I delight in your decrees; I will not neglect your word.

Psalm 119:41 May your unfailing love come to me, O LORD, your salvation according to your promise;

Psalm 119:50 My comfort in my suffering is this: Your promise preserves my life.

Psalm 119:76 May your unfailing love be my comfort, according to your promise to your servant.

Psalm 119:77 Let thy tender mercies come unto me, that I may live: for thy law [is] my delight.

Psalm 119:92 Unless thy law [had been] my delights, I should then have perished in mine affliction.

Psalm 119:143 Trouble and distress have come upon me, but your commands are my delight.

Psalm 119:174 I long for your salvation, O LORD, and your law is my delight.

Proverbs 23:26 My son, give me your heart and let your eyes keep to my ways,

Psalm 16:3 [But] to the saints that [are] in the earth, and [to] the excellent, in whom [is] all my delight.

Psalm 101:6 My eyes will be on the faithful in the land, that they may dwell with me; he whose walk is blameless will minister to me.


God Bless.

In Christ's love...and prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.



"For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments, and his commandments are not grievous."

[Phazelwood]

I am not righteous...I am so unworthy, so wretched...it is the righteousness of Christ within me...it is His Spirit within me that gives me the power to be an overcomer.

Yes, it is Christ that will enable everyone to see that it isn't about you being unworthy or wretched. What you will hopefully come to see is that the passages in the bible are from the eastern cultures that make comparisons to greater things, not to impose a sense of worthlessnes, but to instill in us what wonders awaits us.

That wonder will naturally instill a sense of worth so that we can live life to it's fullest. You are worthy, that is why you were drawn in the first place, that is why you were loved before you could love back.