1 Timothy 2:3-6..."For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savio; Who will have all men to be saved, and (scripture, sinned)

[pcamps]

Originally Posted by Eusebius

Maybe we just have to bind Saaaaaaaaatun in the name of JEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZus ! who has these Christians in bondage. LOL!

Yay I say I say, oh yay I say my daughter! Yay, though thou believedst in eternal torment, whoop! Yay, I say I say thou shalt be delivered from bondage to Satan and be FREED into the truth of God saving all in JEEEESUS name! (said in the voice of Ernest Angley)

There, does that help?

LOL

I remember a time when i gullibly at the request of a minister went foward to be prayed for, this minister was literally using all his might to slam me down on the floor by the laying on of hands,i thought to myself, i'm not having anything of this and there was no way i was going to go down in this display of showmanship, he was pushing one way i was pushing the other way , he was rebuking everything under the sun out of me in the name of Jeeeeesus , he gave upon me in the end and blamed my pride for not going down.

[trettep]

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

...read it again trettep..this time with eyes wide open...and truly try to see with the eyes of your heart what it is saying...


This one God will have all men to be saved; he desires not the death and destruction of any (Eze. 33:11), but the welfare and salvation of all. Not that he has decreed the salvation of all, for then all men would be saved; but he has a good will to the salvation of all, and none perish but by their own fault, Mt. 23:37...which states: "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!" He will have all to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth, to be saved in the way that he has appointed and not otherwise. It concerns us to get the knowledge of the truth, because that is the way to be saved; Christ is the way and the truth, and so he is the life.

...and this...

(2.) God has a good will to the salvation of all; so that it is not so much the want of a will in God to save them as it is a want of will in themselves to be saved in God's way. Here our blessed Lord charges the fault: You will not come unto me that you may have life, Jn. 5:40. I would have gathered you, and you would not. (3.) Those who are saved must come to the knowledge of the truth, for this is God's appointed way to save sinners. Without knowledge the heart cannot be good; if we do not know the truth, we cannot be ruled by it.

...Not only DOES IT! contradict! your belief that all will be saved...but 2 Timothy(as well as every other passage in the entire Bible) truly has ABSOLUTELY! NOTHING! at all to do with Universal Salvation...WHATSOEVER!!! Praise God!!! I believe you've touched upon something here trettep!!! Praise God!!!

In Christ,
Verna.

Let me be more specific. There is not one verse in all scripture that contradicts Universal Salvation.

There is only the mistranslated and misunderstood examination of God's Word that breaths eternal torment and annihilationism.

[sschulz]

Verna. You seem to treat God's will and wishes as some weak desire that he would like but it may not happen.

So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it. Isa 55:11

God will accomplish all his pleasures and will.

for God it is who is working in you both to will and to work for His good pleasure. Phil 2:13

God works in us to accomplish his will and his good pleasure.

In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: Eph 1:11

God works all thing to the counsel of his will.

[ahigherway]

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

...read it again trettep..this time with eyes wide open...and truly try to see with the eyes of your heart what it is saying...


This one God will have all men to be saved; he desires not the death and destruction of any (Eze. 33:11), but the welfare and salvation of all. Not that he has decreed the salvation of all, for then all men would be saved; but he has a good will to the salvation of all, and none perish but by their own fault, Mt. 23:37...which states: "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!" He will have all to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth, to be saved in the way that he has appointed and not otherwise. It concerns us to get the knowledge of the truth, because that is the way to be saved; Christ is the way and the truth, and so he is the life.

...and this...

(2.) God has a good will to the salvation of all; so that it is not so much the want of a will in God to save them as it is a want of will in themselves to be saved in God's way. Here our blessed Lord charges the fault: You will not come unto me that you may have life, Jn. 5:40. I would have gathered you, and you would not. (3.) Those who are saved must come to the knowledge of the truth, for this is God's appointed way to save sinners. Without knowledge the heart cannot be good; if we do not know the truth, we cannot be ruled by it.

...Not only DOES IT! contradict! your belief that all will be saved...but 2 Timothy(as well as every other passage in the entire Bible) truly has ABSOLUTELY! NOTHING! at all to do with Universal Salvation...WHATSOEVER!!! Praise God!!! I believe you've touched upon something here trettep!!! Praise God!!!

In Christ,
Verna.

It sounds to me like UR has really hurt your pride, Verna..

The truth is, that God is the One who saved you, not you yourself. And you're no different than anyone else on the planet..

Blessings,
Brian

[trettep]

Originally Posted by sschulz

Verna. You seem to treat God's will and wishes as some weak desire that he would like but it may not happen.

So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it. Isa 55:11

God will accomplish all his pleasures and will.

for God it is who is working in you both to will and to work for His good pleasure. Phil 2:13

God works in us to accomplish his will and his good pleasure.

In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: Eph 1:11

God works all thing to the counsel of his will.

Great post.

[Verna Perry]

Romans 6:15-16 "What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?"


...deal with it.


In Christ's love and prayerfully in His truth,
Verna

[Eusebius]

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

Romans 6:15-16 "What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?"


...deal with it.


In Christ's love and prayerfully in His truth,
Verna

Dear Verna, All mankind are slaves of sin until saved. Romans 6:15-16 does not say all mankind are eternally slaves of sin. Paul just told you in Romans 5:12 that all mankind sin because death passed through into all mankind just because of what Adam did.

Now read Romans 5:18 and 19. Paul gives the way out of the dilemma. Because of what one man did all mankind are made sinners. Due to what one Man did all mankind will be made righteous.

All mankind get condemned due to what Adam did and all mankind get their lives justified due to what Jesus did.

Fair is fair Verna. If all mankind can get what they get due to what Adam did then all mankind can get what they will get due to what Jesus did.

So in the end all mankind will not be servants of sin or Satan.

Does this not bless your heart?

[Finn_Jarber]

Originally Posted by Verna Perry

...come to the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God, and one Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 6 Who gave himself a ransome for all, to be testified in due time.


This is to set the record straight (for all you who ignorantly and wrongfully offend The Source of these words, as well as the innocent hearers of these words), by teaching the true meaning of this passage. I come against you Satan, in the Name that is above all names!...I come against all who assail and abuse with utter contemptuousness, the precious truth of God's holy word and abuse it to the point of disgust...in a futile attempt to prove the lie in which you live. I loath the lies...they are repulsive!...and not only to me, but to God, our Father, Who is watching and seeing and hearing every word that comes from every tongue/heart under the sun!


1 Timothy 2.

Paul is teaching Timothy that we, as Christians, should pray for all people...that we would have peace in worshiping our Father and live a godly life...and in order for us (Christians) to be able to live a peacable, godly life, we need to pray in love for all those who are in charge of us...as well as others who live in our midst who are evil and wicked, who do not believe.

The design of the Christian religion is to promote prayer; and the disciples of Christ must be praying people. Pray always with all prayer, Eph. 6:18. There must be prayers for ourselves in the first place; this is implied here in 1 Timothy 2. We must also pray for all men, for the world of mankind in general, for particular persons who need or desire our prayers. The Christian religion taught men this charity, to pray, not only for those of their own way, but for all men. Pray for kings (v. 2); though the kings at this time were heathens, enemies to Christianity, and persecutors of Christians, yet they must pray for them, because it is for the public good that there should be civil government, and proper persons entrusted with the administration of it, for whom therefore we ought to pray, yea, though we ourselves suffer under them. For kings, and all that are in authority, that is, inferior magistrates: we must pray for them, and we must give thanks for them, pray for their welfare and for the welfare of their kingdoms, and therefore must not plot against them, that in the peace thereof we may have peace, and give thanks for them and for the benefit we have under their government, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. Here we see through Paul's teaching, what we must desire for kings, that God will so turn their hearts, and direct them and make use of them, that we under them may lead a quiet and peaceable life. He does not say, "that we may get preferments under them, grow rich, and be in honour and power under them;" no, the summit of the ambition of a good Christian is to lead a quiet and peaceable life, to get through the world unmolested in a low private station. We should desire that we and others may lead a peaceable life in all godliness and honesty, implying that we cannot expect to be kept quiet and peaceable unless we keep in all godliness and honesty. Let us mind our duty, and then we may expect to be taken under the protection both of God and the government. In all godliness and honesty. Here we have our duty as Christians summed up in two words: godliness, that is, the right worshipping of God; and honesty, that is, a good conduct towards all men. These two must go together; we are not truly honest if we are not godly, and do not render to God his due; and we are not truly godly if we are not honest, for God hates robbery for burnt-offering. Here we may observe, 1. Christians are to be men much given to prayer, and should use themselves to prayers, supplications, etc. 2. In our prayers we are to have a generous concern for others as well as for ourselves; we are to pray for all men, and to give thanks for all men; and must not confine our prayers nor thanksgiving to our own persons or families. 3. Prayer consists of various parts, of supplications, intercessions, and thanksgivings; for we must pray for the mercies we want, as well as be thankful for mercies already received; and we are to deprecate the judgments which our own sins or the sins of others have deserved. 4. All men, and kings themselves, and those who are in authority, are to be prayed for. They want our prayers, for they have many difficulties to encounter, many snares to which their exalted stations expose them. 5. In praying for our governors, we take the most likely course to lead a peaceable and quiet life. The Jews at Babylon were commanded to seek the peace of the city whither the Lord had caused them to be carried captives, and to pray to the Lord for it; for in the peace thereof they should have peace, Jer. 29:7. 6. If we would lead a peaceable and quiet life, we must live in all godliness and honesty; we must do our duty to God and man. He that will love life, and see good days, let him refrain his tongue from evil, and his lips that they speak no guile; let him eschew evil, and do good; let him seek peace, and pursue it, 1 Peter 3:10, 11. Now the reason Paul gives for this is because this is good in the sight of God our Saviour; that is, the gospel of Christ requires this. That which is acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour we should do, and should abound in. As a reason why we should in our prayers concern ourselves for all men, he shows God's love to mankind in general, v. 4.

One reason why all men are to be prayed for is because there is one God, and that God bears a good will to all mankind. There is one God (v. 5), and one only, there is no other, there can be no other, for there can be but one infinite. This one God will have all men to be saved; he desires not the death and destruction of any (Eze. 33:11), but the welfare and salvation of all. Not that he has decreed the salvation of all, for then all men would be saved; but he has a good will to the salvation of all, and none perish but by their own fault, Mt. 23:37...which states: "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!" He will have all to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth, to be saved in the way that he has appointed and not otherwise. It concerns us to get the knowledge of the truth, because that is the way to be saved; Christ is the way and the truth, and so he is the life.

There is one Mediator, and that mediator gave himself a ransom for all. As the mercy of God extends itself to all his works, so the mediation of Christ extends itself thus far to all the children of men that he paid a price sufficient for the salvation of all mankind; he brought mankind to stand upon new terms with God, so that they are not now under the law as a covenant of works, but as a rule of life. They are under grace; not under the covenant of innocence, but under a new covenant: He gave himself a ransom. Observe, The death of Christ was a ransom, a counter-price. We deserved to have died. Christ died for us, to save us from death and hell; he gave himself a ransom voluntarily, a ransom for all; so that all mankind are put in a better condition than that of devils. He died to work out a common salvation: in order hereunto, he put himself into the office of Mediator between God and man. A mediator supposes a controversy. Sin had made a quarrel between us and God; Jesus Christ is a Mediator who undertakes to make peace, to bring God and man together, in the nature of an umpire or arbitrator, who lays his hand upon us both, Job 9:33...which states: "Neither is there any daysman betwixt us, that might lay his hand upon us both." He is a ransom that was to be testified in due time; that is, in the Old-Testament times, his sufferings and the glory that should follow were spoken of as things to be revealed in the last times, 1 Peter 1:10, 11. And they are accordingly revealed, Paul himself having been ordained a preacher and an apostle, to publish to the Gentiles the glad tidings of redemption and salvation by Jesus Christ. This doctrine of Christ's mediation Paul was entrusted to preach to every creature, Mk. 16:15. He was appointed to be a teacher of the Gentiles; besides his general call to the apostleship, he was commissioned particularly to preach to the Gentiles, in faith and truth, or faithfully and truly. Note, (1.) It is good and acceptable in the sight of God and our Saviour that we pray for kings and for all men, and also that we lead a peaceable and quiet life; and this is a very good reason why we should do the one as well as the other. (2.) God has a good will to the salvation of all; so that it is not so much the want of a will in God to save them as it is a want of will in themselves to be saved in God's way. Here our blessed Lord charges the fault: You will not come unto me that you may have life, Jn. 5:40. I would have gathered you, and you would not. (3.) Those who are saved must come to the knowledge of the truth, for this is God's appointed way to save sinners. Without knowledge the heart cannot be good; if we do not know the truth, we cannot be ruled by it. (4.) He that is a Mediator in the New-Testament sense, gave himself a ransom. According to Paul, Christ's giving himself a ransom was a necessary part of the Mediator's office; and indeed this lays the foundation for his intercession. (5.) Paul was ordained a minister, to declare this to the Gentiles, that Christ is the one Mediator between God and men, who gave himself a ransom for all. This is the substance of which all ministers are to preach, to the end of the world; and Paul magnified his office, as he was the apostle of the Gentiles, Rom. 11:13. (7.) Ministers must preach the truth, what they apprehend to be so, and they must believe it themselves; they are, like our apostle, to preach in faith and verity, and they must also be faithful and trusty.


Let the truth of these words enter and be received by open eyes and hearts. Amen.


In Christ's love...and prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.

God desires that all men be saved. Here are a few other verses talking about 'desire', 'wish', 'will'.

Luke 8:20 And he was told, “Your mother and your brothers are standing outside, desiring to see you.”

Luke 23:8 When Herod saw Jesus, he was very glad, for he had long desired to see him, because he had heard about him, and he was hoping to see some sign done by him

John 16:19 Jesus knew that they wanted to ask him, so he said to them, “Is this what you are asking yourselves, what I meant by saying, ‘A little while and you will not see me, and again a little while and you will see me’?

Galatians 4:20 I wish I could be present with you now and change my tone, for I am perplexed about you.

Mark 7:24 And from there he arose and went away to the region of Tyre and Sidon. And he entered a house and did not want anyone to know, yet he could not be hidden.

1 Corinthians 7:7 I wish that all were as I myself am. But each has his own gift from God, one of one kind and one of another.

Matthew 15:28 Then Jesus answered her, “O woman, great is your faith! Be it done for you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed instantly.

[Eusebius]

Finn, you forgot this one:

"All My desire I shall do" (God). (Isa 46:10)

[sciotamicks]

All is never used in an unrestricted sense.