There are those who KNOW and LOVE God...and there are those who DO NOT...which are you...? (belief, scriptures)
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We are all "loving" children of our heavenly Father? So, you're saying that everyone is a child of God?
Where did you get that from? Certainly not from the words of Jesus, who called some people children of the devil. If some people are children of the devil, then we can't all be children of God.
John 8:41-44
41Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
42Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
43Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
44Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Bud
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin
Amen.... Bud !
Quote:
Originally Posted by BudinAk
The link/reference you are quoting is not from the Bible, therefore is not the inspired word of God, but rather is some other (deceiving) "gospel". (especially in that it contradicts what Jesus said in the Bible) God does not contradict Himself...ever. His written word (Bible) will stand forever.
Bud
LOL ... And Jesus Called Peter Satan, does that mean the pharisees where the children of Peter? Can one who Jesus Called Satan be a child of God? If God did not create Satan, does that mean Satan has always existed? If God did create Satan, doesn't that make Satan the child of God?
Perhaps you are missing something important that is all but lost in translation?
Because we see in the book of acts that, indeed, all people are the children of God.
Acts 17:22-29
So Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus and said, “Men of Athens, I observe that you are very religious in all respects. “For while I was passing through and examining the objects of your worship, I also found an altar with this inscription, ‘TO AN UNKNOWN GOD.’ Therefore what you worship in ignorance, this I proclaim to you. “The God who made the world and all things in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands; nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all people life and breath and all things; and He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation, that they would seek God, if perhaps they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; for in Him we live and move and exist, as even some of your own poets have said, ‘For we also are His children.’ “Being then the children of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, an image formed by the art and thought of man.
So above we see Paul, while speaking with the stoics(who were pagans) about the "unknown God", clearly admits that all people are the children of God, and even quotes some pagan poets who had said the same thing. He makes no distinction here between Christian believers and unbelievers when he lumps all together as the children of God.
So if the scriptures are inspired, and If Jesus and John calls some children of the devil, while Paul says all people are the children of God, what can that mean?
Are the scriptures contradicting themselves? Is Paul contradicting Christ and John?
Or are many Christians simply interpreting certain statements entirely too literally and instead of understanding that When Christ said that the pharisees where the children of the devil, just as when he Called Peter Satan, he was not referring to their origin as creatures, but he was instead making a reference to the origin of their beliefs and their then present state of mind because of their having been under that false religion.
LOL ... And Jesus Called Peter Satan, does that mean the pharisees where the children of Peter? Can one who Jesus Called Satan be a child of God? If God did not create Satan, does that mean Satan has always existed? If God did create Satan, doesn't that make Satan the child of God?
Perhaps you are missing something important that is all but lost in translation?
Because we see in the book of acts that, indeed, all people are the children of God.
So above we see Paul, while speaking with the stoics(who were pagans) about the "unknown God", clearly admits that all people are the children of God, and even quotes some pagan poets who had said the same thing. He makes no distinction here between Christian believers and unbelievers when he lumps all together as the children of God.
So if the scriptures are inspired, and If Jesus and John calls some children of the devil, while Paul says all people are the children of God, what can that mean?
Are the scriptures contradicting themselves? Is Paul contradicting Christ and John?
Or are many Christians simply interpreting certain statements entirely too literally and instead of understanding that When Christ said that the pharisees where the children of the devil, just as when he Called Peter Satan, he was not referring to their origin as creatures, but he was instead making a reference to the origin of their beliefs and their then present state of mind because of their having been under that false religion.
I believe you are confused about what the word of God says concerning children of the devil, and children of God. Jesus did not call Peter Satan (He never said Peter was Satan)...instead Jesus was speaking a word directly to Satan, who was trying to act through Peter. It was an order, a command. to "knock it off...stop right now"! Think about this: was Peter born again, at the time that event happened? No, he was not. Why not? Because...Jesus had not yet died on the cross...Peter was still under old covenant law. When people are born again, then they become a new creature in Christ, but not before. Until that moment of rebirth, they can (and often do) manifest the works of their father: Satan.
It is exactly as Jesus said: we all will do the works of our father, whether that father be Satan, or whether that father be God. The only way we can become children of God is through the born-again experience, through belief and confession in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. If one is not saved through faith in Jesus Christ, then that person is still a child of Satan (in the spirit, not the flesh)...he has not been reborn in his/her spirit.
Not all people are children of God!
I believe you are confused about what the word of God says concerning children of the devil, and children of God. Jesus did not call Peter Satan (He never said Peter was Satan)...instead Jesus was speaking a word directly to Satan, who was trying to act through Peter. It was an order, a command. to "knock it off...stop right now"! Think about this: was Peter born again, at the time that event happened? No, he was not. Why not? Because...Jesus had not yet died on the cross...Peter was still under old covenant law. When people are born again, then they become a new creature in Christ, but not before. Until that moment of rebirth, they can (and often do) manifest the works of their father: Satan.
It is exactly as Jesus said: we all will do the works of our father, whether that father be Satan, or whether that father be God. The only way we can become children of God is through the born-again experience, through belief and confession in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. If one is not saved through faith in Jesus Christ, then that person is still a child of Satan (in the spirit, not the flesh)...he has not been reborn in his/her spirit.
Not all people are children of God!
Bud
Yet another unthinking selective belief born of ancient ignorance . . . ::Sigh:: I'll repeat what I said to sciota.
Under your view . . . not only are WE . . . this insignificant species on an insignificant planet around an insignificant Sun among of biilions of suns in an insignificant spiral arm of an insignificant galaxy amongst uncounted trillions of such galaxies . . . the ONLY ones our Almighty Creator cares about . . . BUT you believe that only an insignificant minority of US will be favored by God. That is what I call egotism taken to its extreme. Unbelievable!!!This view is so incredibly myopic and ego-centric when viewed against the infinite majesty of existence and the glory of our almighty God. You would make of Him a petty egotistical megalomaniac.
I believe you are confused about what the word of God says concerning children of the devil, and children of God. Jesus did not call Peter Satan (He never said Peter was Satan)...instead Jesus was speaking a word directly to Satan, who was trying to act through Peter. It was an order, a command. to "knock it off...stop right now"! Think about this: was Peter born again, at the time that event happened? No, he was not. Why not? Because...Jesus had not yet died on the cross...Peter was still under old covenant law. When people are born again, then they become a new creature in Christ, but not before. Until that moment of rebirth, they can (and often do) manifest the works of their father: Satan.
It is exactly as Jesus said: we all will do the works of our father, whether that father be Satan, or whether that father be God. The only way we can become children of God is through the born-again experience, through belief and confession in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. If one is not saved through faith in Jesus Christ, then that person is still a child of Satan (in the spirit, not the flesh)...he has not been reborn in his/her spirit.
Not all people are children of God!
Bud
Jesus turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.â€
But when Jesus turned and looked at his disciples, he rebuked Peter. “Get behind me, Satan!†he said. “You do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.â€
And Jesus answered and said to him(Peter), “Get behind Me, Satan! For it is written, ‘You shall worship the LORD your God, and Him only you shall serve.’â€
Nice try ... But Christ was speaking to and rebuking Peter, and he was calling Peter Satan for being a stumbling stone to him in his mission.
I agree that Peter had not yet been born again, but he had already been born again when Paul rebuked him publicly for teaching what was contrary to the true gospel by preferring the circumcision and teaching the Gentiles that they must observe the law ...
We are all of our father the devil before we are born of the spirit, but this is symbolic or our bondage to sin and death which is the power of the devil. Humanity fell into a state of disgrace and enmity with God. However, we were all created in his image and we are all his children, though many are at this time prodigal in their spiritual disposition.
Did the Prodigal son truly stop being the child of his father when he abused his inheritance and left his home to wallow in a life of sin and depravity?
Let me ask you this question, do you believe that God loves all people, or not?
Acts 17:22-29
So Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus and said, “Men of Athens, I observe that you are very religious in all respects. “For while I was passing through and examining the objects of your worship, I also found an altar with this inscription, ‘TO AN UNKNOWN GOD.’ Therefore what you worship in ignorance, this I proclaim to you. “The God who made the world and all things in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands; nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all people life and breath and all things; and He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation, that they would seek God, if perhaps they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; for in Him we live and move and exist, as even some of your own poets have said, ‘For we also are His children.’ “Being then the children of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, an image formed by the art and thought of man.
Thankyou for posting this passage Ironmaw. It is the first time I've noted it: Paul directly saying God doesn't need anything! "as though he needed anything" Paul replies. He understood God needs nothing, nor is there anything we could do for God that He would need or want. Many assume this life is all about us doing something so that we can somehow affect God (please Him, cause Him to save us, etc), when in fact the complete opposite is true. This world is for our benefit, not God's. It is so we will learn.
Again it is confirmed God is in complete control...
Thankyou for posting this passage Ironmaw. It is the first time I've noted it: Paul directly saying God doesn't need anything! "as though he needed anything" Paul replies. He understood God needs nothing, nor is there anything we could do for God that He would need or want. Many assume this life is all about us doing something so that we can somehow affect God (please Him, cause Him to save us, etc), when in fact the complete opposite is true. This world is for our benefit, not God's. It is so we will learn.
Again it is confirmed God is in complete control...
Consider we all have two natures:
- physical vs. spiritual
- carnal vs. spiritual
- old man vs. new man
- bad side vs. good side
- vessel of dishonor vs. vessel of honor
- what we actually do vs. what we wish we could do
- child of the devil vs. child of God.
We are all at different places in our walk, but consider that God is destroying the physical/carnal while building the spiritual/new man.
THINK:
Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left.
Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.
Saul the chief of sinners became Paul the greatest apostle.
We will all be given a new name.
The link/reference you are quoting is not from the Bible, therefore is not the inspired word of God, but rather is some other (deceiving) "gospel". (especially in that it contradicts what Jesus said in the Bible) God does not contradict Himself...ever. His written word (Bible) will stand forever. Bud
You know, BudinAk, we are privileged now to have the internet so that we can do all kinds of research on the subject of the bible and it's authenticity. And what do we find out there? That it was rewritten many, many times throughout the centuries... so the original writings from the apostles were tweaked until the founders of various churches were satisfied with what they supposed was the word of God.
Luke tells us in this message that his document called the "Acts of Apostles" was so messed with that it barely contains what he originally wrote:
"I know that the writings that I had left were not preserved intact after my own death, and that many things that I had incorporated therein were, in the numerous copyings and recopyings of my manuscripts, left out and ignored. Many things that I did not write, and that were not in accord with the truth, were inserted by these various successive copyists in their work of reproduction and many of these omitted things and additions were of vital importance to the truth of spiritual things, as they had been declared by the disciples as containing the truths that Jesus had taught."
And here, he describes how the writers came up with the idea of Jesus' blood sacrifice, taking it from the Jewish teachings.
"This fact was conspicuously shown by these writers attempting to substitute Jesus in their "plan of salvation" in the place of the animals of sacrifice in the Jewish plan of salvation. As the God of the Jews demanded "blood and more blood" in order to be "appeased" and satisfactorily worshiped, so the God that Jesus declared was the God of all the peoples of the earth "demanded blood" in order to be appeased and satisfactorily worshiped - and that, the blood of His dearly beloved son."
Countless Changes Have Been Made in the Copying and Recopying of the Original Manuscripts Left by the Disciples and Apostles of Jesus (http://tinyurl.com/3xj7bhv - broken link)
One last thing... when our souls are developed with God's Divine Love, then it knows the truth, even though our minds may not be in accord. Life is short, so to at least have heard about God's Divine Love as the true salvation is better than not hearing about it at all. Blessings.
Not all men will be judged by God. Only those who have "known" God will be "judged." Those who have not "known" God, since sentence cannot be passed upon them for their acquittal, are already judged and condemned, since the Holy Scriptures testify that the wicked shall not arise to judgment.
Psalm 1:5 states: "The ungodly shall not stand in the judgment." They shall indeed arise, but it will be to "the resurrection of damnation."...and let's look at Daniel 12:2...shall we...?...it states: "And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt."
...and John 5:28-29 states: "Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation."
...and Acts 24:15 also states: "And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.
...so...who is it that Scripture says "knows" and "loves" God...?...
Certain conditions were essential on the part of the disciples of Christ: "If ye love me, keep my commandments."...THEN! the promise follows..."And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you forever."
"He that hath (knows and preserves) my commandments, and also keepeth (faithfully observes) them, he it is that loveth me; and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him (including an active demonstration of love), and will manifest myself to him." One of the disciples, yet blinded by carnal expectations, said to him, "Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?" This led Christ to say that this manifestation spoken of would be made only to those who should be spiritually susceptible of it, implying that it would be entirely a spiritual manifestation. John 14.
John 15:10 If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love.
You will either die a wicked, willfull sinner...who will be resurrected only to be sent to your destruction, forever dead...your soul annhililated...or...you will die a repentant, born-again, changed, filled with the Spirit of Christ, child of the living God...who will rise to judgement for deeds done...and dwell in the House of the Lord forever. It is written.
Your choice...before you die.
In Christ's love...and prayerfully in His truth,
Verna.
Fortunatly I will die a wicked sinner, but this is only based upon your judgment of me.
I will gladly die a wicked sinner in YOUR eyes because that means I have not been lured into believing what you do.
And yes, it is in YOUR eyes because you only post scripture to reinforce how you see others.
Just remember, according to you I do not keep the Sabbath, but it is only your idea of the Sabbath that I reject. The Pharasees said the same thing of Jesus because he did not act as they said he should.,
Thankfully I reject the doctrine of pharasees, one day you will too.
Ilene, I was very fortunate, as were my 9 other brothers and 3 sisters, to have had a very loving, forgiving earthly father.
One day in my dad's elderly age I told him, "Dad, do you remember that verse that says the pure in heart shall see God"? He said, "yes." I said, well I think I finally figured out what it means. He said "Oh?" I said "Yes, when I see you I see God." I saw God's love and grace in my dad.
By the way, my dad was raised Presbyterian in his younger years. I told him exactly how I believed about God saving all and he said that was what he was taught in church.
YES indeed you were very fortunate to have a loving, forgiving father. That's wonderful and I would give just about anything to have the same. I haven't spoken to my father in 9 years because he is so toxic and damaging to my psyche. But I took the high road and wrote him a letter saying that I hold no resentment (and I don't) and I would take care of him if he needed me to. I may have to stuff a rag in his mouth and hog tie him but I WILL take care of him in his old age!!!
It's all good, through Christ I have learned to love him in spite of himself but I have to do it from a distance. And through Christ and the fact that UR's are willing to share their belief I have come to understand the truth about God, even though God was portrayed as a monster for so many years. Your Dad was Presbyterian and they taught UR at his church?? I think I need to find that church!! It would be great to be able to find a group of Christian Universalists to share with in person. It makes me real happy that you had such a wonderful father Eusebius, it's a very precious thing to have.
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This view is so incredibly myopic and ego-centric when viewed against the infinite majesty of existence and the glory of our almighty God. You would make of Him a petty egotistical megalomaniac.
It makes me real happy that you had such a wonderful father Eusebius, it's a very precious thing to have.
