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Old 01-04-2011, 10:02 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 1,720,734 times
Reputation: 263

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Quote:
Originally Posted by .sparrow. View Post
That is so beautiful to think about.

Y'know, it makes me realize that what helped me to forgive, was those who showed me love and forgiveness. Those who "kept no record of my wrongs" and forgave ME.
Love truly is the MOST powerful thing..
Love Conquers All.
God IS Love.

I guess it really takes seeing it in action to truly start to grasp the concept. Perhaps that is why so many don't believe in the power of love. Perhaps that is why there are so many that don't yet see it. That's why we are to love our neighbor as ourselves.
The more people see love in action, the more they will BELIEVE in it.
Amen, sis?

love ya,
sparrow
Amen! And love you, too!
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Old 01-04-2011, 10:41 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,263 posts, read 20,865,688 times
Reputation: 9950
Ditchlights, I'm just wondering why you believe you might be destined for Hell (if you weren't going to be annihilated instead, that is). Unless you are a mass-murderer in disguise, I'm honestly baffled as to what you think you might have done to make God want to punish you forever.
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Old 01-04-2011, 10:52 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,379,961 times
Reputation: 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
Ditchlights, I'm just wondering why you believe you might be destined for Hell (if you weren't going to be annihilated instead, that is). Unless you are a mass-murderer in disguise, I'm honestly baffled as to what you think you might have done to make God want to punish you forever.
Kazpur, I know you asked Ditchlights the question. But I can't shake that feeling that I deserve to be punished forever; I also feel very unworthy of love. I just can't get rid of it. I'm wondering if that feeling will ever go away. I'm almost positive it has something to do with the way I was brought up in the church and the doctrine of being burnt forever. I'm almost positive. On top of a highly conflicted upbringing.

(somewhere, in one of these post around here, somebody said even the Pope isn't sure he is saved~~darn religion).

I really think many churches engrain that kind of thinking into their members.
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Old 01-04-2011, 11:53 PM
 
5,733 posts, read 4,580,552 times
Reputation: 4148
Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Kazpur, I know you asked Ditchlights the question. But I can't shake that feeling that I deserve to be punished forever; I also feel very unworthy of love. I just can't get rid of it. I'm wondering if that feeling will ever go away. I'm almost positive it has something to do with the way I was brought up in the church and the doctrine of being burnt forever. I'm almost positive. On top of a highly conflicted upbringing.

(somewhere, in one of these post around here, somebody said even the Pope isn't sure he is saved~~darn religion).

I really think many churches engrain that kind of thinking into their members.

herefornow,
You are beautiful and you are loved.
Believe it.

Proverbs12:18 There is one whose rash words are like sword thrusts, but the tongue of the wise brings healing.

Think of which voice within you is like a sword thrust.
And think of the voice within which brings healing.

Which is truth?

peace sister,
sparrow
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:07 AM
 
5,733 posts, read 4,580,552 times
Reputation: 4148
Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Kazpur, I know you asked Ditchlights the question. But I can't shake that feeling that I deserve to be punished forever; I also feel very unworthy of love. I just can't get rid of it. I'm wondering if that feeling will ever go away. I'm almost positive it has something to do with the way I was brought up in the church and the doctrine of being burnt forever. I'm almost positive. On top of a highly conflicted upbringing.

(somewhere, in one of these post around here, somebody said even the Pope isn't sure he is saved~~darn religion).

I really think many churches engrain that kind of thinking into their members.

Man, I had to come back to this. Because I know that feeling.
STARVE that feeling.
That feeling IS ingrained into a LOT of people and I can bet it is the reason for a lot of alcohol and drug addictions and self-loathing, and every other manner of self-destruction and lashing out. And those that are supposed to be teaching "truth" are part of the problem. They teach that we are vile, disgusting, worthless sinners who should be groveling face down, asking God to please don't torture us forever, even though we DESERVE it!!!

All because what? Because we were BORN??


HE subjected US.
We didn't subject HIM
HE, GOD subjected US.

HE is responsible for His creation.
And He will not let any of us down.

All that feeling is, is FEAR.
STARVE it.

Perfect love casts out all fear.
He knows the number of hairs on your head.
Not so he knows how many he has to pluck out one by one to torture you, but because He loves you and He is trying to tell you how intimately He knows you. He knows you better than you KNOW YOURSELF. Do YOU personally know how many hairs you have on your head??
I sure don't.

Take that passion and turn it inwards towards that feeling you have hidden down deep. Take that beautiful passion of yours and you STOMP OUT THAT FEELING. Because you KNOW, DEEPER down that it's not true.
Listen to His voice.
Take all of those other voices (confused man blathering on about nonsense that got ingrained in you) and kick them to the curb.
Listen to the voice that BRINGS HEALING. It's there.
It's deeper down than those other voices. It is THERE.
Those other stupid voices are in the way.
Kick them out.

To think of you having that feeling within you... wow. It blows my mind because you are such a strong fighter for love. And to see your passion despite the struggle within yourself to FEEL that love for YOURSELF. That is just something. Talk about inspirational. Herefornow... I hope this feeling is destroyed really soon for you. You so deserve to KNOW that you are loved.
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:27 AM
 
17,689 posts, read 8,866,529 times
Reputation: 1485
Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
But I can't shake that feeling that I deserve to be punished forever; I also feel very unworthy of love.
Not a chance of that happening; and UR LOVED!

XOXO
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:29 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,379,961 times
Reputation: 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by .sparrow. View Post
Man, I had to come back to this. Because I know that feeling.
STARVE that feeling.
That feeling IS ingrained into a LOT of people and I can bet it is the reason for a lot of alcohol and drug addictions and self-loathing, and every other manner of self-destruction and lashing out. And those that are supposed to be teaching "truth" are part of the problem. They teach that we are vile, disgusting, worthless sinners who should be groveling face down, asking God to please don't torture us forever, even though we DESERVE it!!!

All because what? Because we were BORN??


HE subjected US.
We didn't subject HIM
HE, GOD subjected US.

HE is responsible for His creation.
And He will not let any of us down.

All that feeling is, is FEAR.
STARVE it.

Perfect love casts out all fear.
He knows the number of hairs on your head.
Not so he knows how many he has to pluck out one by one to torture you, but because He loves you and He is trying to tell you how intimately He knows you. He knows you better than you KNOW YOURSELF. Do YOU personally know how many hairs you have on your head??
I sure don't.

Take that passion and turn it inwards towards that feeling you have hidden down deep. Take that beautiful passion of yours and you STOMP OUT THAT FEELING. Because you KNOW, DEEPER down that it's not true.
Listen to His voice.
Take all of those other voices (confused man blathering on about nonsense that got ingrained in you) and kick them to the curb.
Listen to the voice that BRINGS HEALING. It's there.
It's deeper down than those other voices. It is THERE.
Those other stupid voices are in the way.
Kick them out.

To think of you having that feeling within you... wow. It blows my mind because you are such a strong fighter for love. And to see your passion despite the struggle within yourself to FEEL that love for YOURSELF. That is just something. Talk about inspirational. Herefornow... I hope this feeling is destroyed really soon for you. You so deserve to KNOW that you are loved.
Sparrow, I don't even really have a response. You left me speechless. That's hard to do. Thank you so much.
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Old 01-05-2011, 12:48 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,379,961 times
Reputation: 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
Not a chance of that happening; and UR LOVED!

XOXO



You guys are awesome. Thank you, again.
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Old 01-05-2011, 03:01 AM
 
Location: Southern Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,453 posts, read 7,553,239 times
Reputation: 12117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
Ditchlights, I'm just wondering why you believe you might be destined for Hell (if you weren't going to be annihilated instead, that is). Unless you are a mass-murderer in disguise, I'm honestly baffled as to what you think you might have done to make God want to punish you forever.
I just want to say, Thank You ALL for your heartfelt contributions to this thread. I'm so sorry I have not been more active to answer everybody. I'm so busy with school right now that it is somewhat overwhelming. I read ALL the posts, but replying takes a lot more effort and time. This thread took off in a way I couldn't imagine! LOL!

Katz, I struggle so badly. I love the things of this world. I do not break mans law, but I sure as heck do not please God with my lifestyle. I love secular music, I cuss like a sailor, I enjoy porn, I drink regularly, I lust after women everyday, and I blame God for just about everything that goes wrong in my life. I have said the sinners prayer so many times to accept him into my heart in the hopes for a transformation, yet I lack the power to change by myself. I was raised in an ET church, and am scared to death of going to hell, but I don't know what to do. The way of the world is so powerful. I don't see myself as a bad person, yet I feel I am worthy of hell for eternity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Kazpur, I know you asked Ditchlights the question. But I can't shake that feeling that I deserve to be punished forever; I also feel very unworthy of love. I just can't get rid of it. I'm wondering if that feeling will ever go away. I'm almost positive it has something to do with the way I was brought up in the church and the doctrine of being burnt forever. I'm almost positive. On top of a highly conflicted upbringing.

(somewhere, in one of these post around here, somebody said even the Pope isn't sure he is saved~~darn religion).

I really think many churches engrain that kind of thinking into their members.
Yes, those churches do. It is the ultimate recruitment tool. That's why they hate the concept of UR. It renders their doctrine useless. I feel for, and agree with, just about every word you just said.
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Old 01-05-2011, 07:32 AM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 9,746,380 times
Reputation: 58197
Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchlights View Post
I just want to say, Thank You ALL for your heartfelt contributions to this thread. I'm so sorry I have not been more active to answer everybody. I'm so busy with school right now that it is somewhat overwhelming. I read ALL the posts, but replying takes a lot more effort and time. This thread took off in a way I couldn't imagine! LOL!

Katz, I struggle so badly. I love the things of this world. I do not break mans law, but I sure as heck do not please God with my lifestyle. I love secular music, I cuss like a sailor, I enjoy porn, I drink regularly, I lust after women everyday, and I blame God for just about everything that goes wrong in my life. I have said the sinners prayer so many times to accept him into my heart in the hopes for a transformation, yet I lack the power to change by myself. I was raised in an ET church, and am scared to death of going to hell, but I don't know what to do. The way of the world is so powerful. I don't see myself as a bad person, yet I feel I am worthy of hell for eternity.



Yes, those churches do. It is the ultimate recruitment tool. That's why they hate the concept of UR. It renders their doctrine useless. I feel for, and agree with, just about every word you just said.
Ah ditchlights, you're not any more worthy of this fictional hell than any of the rest of us. I struggle daily too, and I fail miserably, especially here lately. You and Herefornow still have the same fears inside of you that I have and it has EVERYTHING to do with what we were taught.....or I should say brainwashed with. I don't blame my parents or grandparents, they were brainwashed too and thought they were doing the right thing.

Fear is a very powerful thing and is nearly impossible to overcome. But now that I know the truth of UR after letting go of most of the fear and stubbornness it's so much more pleasant to think about God and all that He has planned for us. We know we're not worthy, but Jesus Christ died for us to MAKE us worthy. I know you're struggling to believe UR ditchlights but look into it and study it some more....it will slowly win out over the horrific teachings of hell or even annihilation.
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