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Old 01-07-2011, 12:42 PM
 
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No, many say He is LORD, but He does not know them and commands them to depart from Him, in that Day.
This is now:
Quote:
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

The Greek "can/dynamai" say, is power, for the authority by the Holy Spirit of regeneration to say that Jesus is their LORD.
Without having the power of the Spirit of regeneration, there is no saying He is their LORD.


dynamai 1) to be able, have power whether by virtue of one's own ability and resources, or of a state of mind, or through favourable circumstances, or by permission of law or custom
2) to be able to do something
3) to be capable, strong and powerful
- the word "dynamite" is from "dynamai"
Paul said:
Quote:
Phl 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of [things] in heaven, and [things] in earth, and [things] under the earth;
Phl 2:11 And [that] every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ [is] Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
This is why Paul said that -by the authority of the writing of Enoch the prophet, the seventh from Adam:


Quote:
62:
8And the Congregation of the elect and holy shall be sown.
And all the elect shall stand before him on that day.
9And all the kings and the mighty and the exalted and those who rule the earth
Shall fall down before him on their faces,
And worship and set their hope upon that Son of Man,
And petition him and supplicate for mercy at his hands.
10Nevertheless that Lord of Spirits will so press them
That they shall hastily go forth from His presence,
And their faces shall be filled with shame,
And the darkness grow deeper on their faces.
11And He will deliver them to the angels for punishment,
To execute vengeance on them because they have oppressed His children and His elect
12And they shall be a spectacle for the righteous and for His elect:
They shall rejoice over them,
Because the wrath of the Lord of Spirits resteth upon them,
And His sword is drunk with their blood.
13And the righteous and elect shall be saved on that day,
And they shall never thenceforward see the face of the sinners and unrighteous.
14And the Lord of Spirits will abide over them,
And with that Son of Man shall they eat
And lie down and rise up for ever and ever.
15And the righteous and elect shall have risen from the earth,
And ceased to be of downcast countenance.
Garments of Glory
And they shall have been clothed with garments of glory,
16And these shall be the garments of life from the Lord of Spirits:
And your garments shall not grow old,
Nor your glory pass away before the Lord of Spirits.
Every Knee Shall Bow, Every Tongue Confess
63 In those days shall the mighty and the kings who possess the earth implore Him to grant them a little respite from His angels of punishment to whom they were delivered, that they might fall down and worship before the Lord of Spirits, and confess their sins before Him. 2And they shall bless and glorify the Lord of Spirits, and say:
"Blessed is the Lord of Spirits and the Lord of kings,
And the Lord of the mighty and the Lord of the rich,
And the Lord of glory and the Lord of wisdom,
3And splendid in every secret thing is Thy power from generation to generation,
And Thy glory for ever and ever:
Deep are all Thy secrets and innumerable,
And Thy righteousness is beyond reckoning.
4We have now learnt that we should glorify
And bless the Lord of kings and Him who is king over all kings."
5And they shall say:
"Would that we had rest to glorify and give thanks
And confess our faith before His glory!
6And now we long for a little rest but find it not:
We follow hard upon and obtain it not:
And light has vanished from before us,
And darkness is our dwelling-place for ever and ever:
7For we have not believed before Him
Nor glorified the name of the Lord of Spirits, nor glorified our Lord
But our hope was in the sceptre of our kingdom,
And in our glory.
8And in the day of our suffering and tribulation He saves us not,
And we find no respite for confession
That our Lord is true in all His works, and in His judgements and His justice,
And His judgements have no respect of persons.
9And we pass away from before His face on account of our works,
And all our sins are reckoned up in righteousness."
10Now they shall say unto themselves: "Our souls are full of unrighteous gain, but it does not prevent us from descending from the midst thereof into the burden of Sheol."
11And after that their faces shall be filled with darkness
And shame before that Son of Man,
And they shall be driven from his presence,
And the sword shall abide before his face in their midst.
12Thus spake the Lord of Spirits: "This is the ordinance and judgement with respect to the mighty and the kings and the exalted and those who possess the earth before the Lord of Spirits."

Last edited by yeshuasavedme; 01-07-2011 at 12:52 PM..
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Old 01-07-2011, 01:19 PM
 
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Philippians 2:8-11 is based on Christ's death for all in vs. 8.

They are bowing their knee IN THE NAME OF JESUS (Jesus meaning Saviour). He is their Saviour at that point in time.
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Old 01-07-2011, 02:15 PM
 
2,981 posts, read 4,304,986 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Philippians 2:8-11 is based on Christ's death for all in vs. 8.

They are bowing their knee IN THE NAME OF JESUS (Jesus meaning Saviour). He is their Saviour at that point in time.
The translation is correct in that "at" the name of Jesus every knee will bow and every tongue will confess. They are not "in Christ" who are "made ashamed" at His coming, and descend into the darkness of Sheol.

Paul only knew this because he read it in Enoch.
Quote:
Every Knee Shall Bow, Every Tongue Confess
63 In those days shall the mighty and the kings who possess the earth implore Him to grant them a little respite from His angels of punishment to whom they were delivered, that they might fall down and worship before the Lord of Spirits, and confess their sins before Him.
2And they shall bless and glorify the Lord of Spirits, and say:
"Blessed is the Lord of Spirits and the Lord of kings,
And the Lord of the mighty and the Lord of the rich,
And the Lord of glory and the Lord of wisdom,
3And splendid in every secret thing is Thy power from generation to generation,
And Thy glory for ever and ever:

Deep are all Thy secrets and innumerable,
And Thy righteousness is beyond reckoning.
4We have now learnt that we should glorify
And bless the Lord of kings and Him who is king over all kings."
5And they shall say:

"Would that we had rest to glorify and give thanks
And confess our faith before His glory!
6And now we long for a little rest but find it not:
We follow hard upon and obtain it not:
And light has vanished from before us,
And darkness is our dwelling-place for ever and ever:
7For we have not believed before Him
Nor glorified the name of the Lord of Spirits, nor glorified our Lord
But our hope was in the sceptre of our kingdom,
And in our glory.
8And in the day of our suffering and tribulation He saves us not,
And we find no respite for confession
That our Lord is true in all His works, and in His judgements and His justice,
And His judgements have no respect of persons.
9And we pass away from before His face on account of our works,
And all our sins are reckoned up in righteousness."
10Now they shall say unto themselves: "Our souls are full of unrighteous gain, but it does not prevent us from descending from the midst thereof into the burden of Sheol."
11And after that their faces shall be filled with darkness
And shame before that Son of Man,
And they shall be driven from his presence,

And the sword shall abide before his face in their midst.
12Thus spake the Lord of Spirits: "This is the ordinance and judgement with respect to the mighty and the kings and the exalted and those who possess the earth before the Lord of Spirits."
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Old 01-07-2011, 02:26 PM
 
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False. The Greek word is "EN" which is "in" in English. They really are bowing the knee IN THE NAME OF JESUS.

ινα (that) εν (in) τω (the) ονοματι (name of) ιησου (Jesus)

You can't prove Paul read Enoch.
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Old 01-07-2011, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,380,473 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
False. The Greek word is "EN" which is "in" in English. They really are bowing the knee IN THE NAME OF JESUS.

ινα (that) εν (in) τω (the) ονοματι (name of) ιησου (Jesus)

You can't prove Paul read Enoch.

I seriously doubt Paul read Enoch, too. Enoch contradicts hundreds of OT verses, and it was probably part of the Jewish fables that we were warned about. Not to mention that it has spawned so much confusion and fear that Coast to Coast, Chuck Missler, and so many others who are benefiting (and I can imagine sometimes laughing behind foolish backs) from these stories are having a heyday. They make their living off of this stuff.

Since the fruits of the Spirit are love, joy, and peace I can hardly imagine the disciples sitting around listening to these shows and spreading this kind of weirdness around.

When we give into these stories because our ears our itching for stories about the "supernatural," the focus is no longer on God and his power and light; our focus is on evil, mayhem, distortion, paranoia, and darkness.
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Old 01-07-2011, 04:19 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
I seriously doubt Paul read Enoch, too. Enoch contradicts hundreds of OT verses, and it was probably part of the Jewish fables that we were warned about.
Paul read and commented on the Gospel which he had, from Enoch.

You have spoken that which is not true, and which can be proven to be not true.
Enoch contradicts not one OT doctrine, neither does it contradict any NT doctrine, and is the foundation for understanding the doctrines of the Bible which are not relaid in Moses or the NT, but are only commented on as truth, from that writing, which all the descendants of Noah came off the Ark with.

Enoch is not Jewish. There is not one Jewish fable in Enoch, which is a "Christian" book, about Christ, whom Enoch alone saw in heaven, as a secret, who was hidden in God [with God], and who was God, and who was to come, and in whose name the "elect" -whosoever will choose the elect life- would be saved -and so on and so forth.
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Old 01-07-2011, 05:49 PM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,430,337 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
I seriously doubt Paul read Enoch, too. Enoch contradicts hundreds of OT verses, and it was probably part of the Jewish fables that we were warned about. Not to mention that it has spawned so much confusion and fear that Coast to Coast, Chuck Missler, and so many others who are benefiting (and I can imagine sometimes laughing behind foolish backs) from these stories are having a heyday. They make their living off of this stuff.

Since the fruits of the Spirit are love, joy, and peace I can hardly imagine the disciples sitting around listening to these shows and spreading this kind of weirdness around.

When we give into these stories because our ears our itching for stories about the "supernatural," the focus is no longer on God and his power and light; our focus is on evil, mayhem, distortion, paranoia, and darkness.
Right.
Also, the only way he could know if Paul read Enoch he would have to ask Paul if he did or see evidence where Paul wrote that he was a reader of Enoch. Neither of which can he prove.
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Old 01-07-2011, 06:18 PM
 
2,981 posts, read 4,304,986 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
Paul read and commented on the Gospel which he had, from Enoch.

You have spoken that which is not true, and which can be proven to be not true.
Enoch contradicts not one OT doctrine, neither does it contradict any NT doctrine, and is the foundation for understanding the doctrines of the Bible which are not relaid in Moses or the NT, but are only commented on as truth, from that writing, which all the descendants of Noah came off the Ark with.

Enoch is not Jewish. There is not one Jewish fable in Enoch, which is a "Christian" book, about Christ, whom Enoch alone saw in heaven, as a secret, who was hidden in God [with God], and who was God, and who was to come, and in whose name the "elect" -whosoever will choose the elect life- would be saved -and so on and so forth.
Paul said this, from reading Enoch, which Jesus calls "The Wisdom of God", in one place:
1Cr 2:6 Howbeit [we] speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

1Cr 2:7 But/alla [we] speak//laleō wisdom/sophia God/theos in/en mystery/mystērion hidden/apokryptō, which/hos God/theos ordained before the world unto our glory:
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Old 01-07-2011, 06:35 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yeshuasavedme View Post
Paul said this, from reading Enoch, which Jesus calls "The Wisdom of God", in one place:
1Cr 2:6 Howbeit [we] speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

1Cr 2:7 But/alla [we] speak//laleō wisdom/sophia God/theos in/en mystery/mystērion hidden/apokryptō, which/hos God/theos ordained before the world unto our glory:

Wow, thats a stretch. I gotta say that i think you're grasping at straws there buddy ...
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Old 01-07-2011, 09:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776 View Post
Wow, thats a stretch. I gotta say that i think you're grasping at straws there buddy ...
Paul was a student of the prophet, Enoch, who was the seventh from Adam, as many Jews were, in NT times. Paul knew that only in Enoch was Jesus Christ the Son of Man who was the Wisdom, hidden in God, with God, who was God, who was ordained by God, from the beginning, for our Glory. That Gospel is given first, in Enoch, about the Son of Man who was in heaven, hidden, in God, who was God, and who was to come, and who was seen by Enoch as God the Word -even the very Oath, Himself- who made all things and upholds all things.
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