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Old 01-07-2011, 10:32 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
"kill the body" - in both verses, meaning killing the physical body.

"unable to kill the soul" / "after that have no more that they can do" - this is the same thing, those who kill the body are unable to kill the soul - i.e., there is no more that they can do to you once the body is dead.

Souls exist eternally either in heaven or is cast into hell (by the One whom we should fear according to those two verses).
You assume they are the same thing. "Nothing left they can do could" could refer to throwing the dead body into Gehenna as was the common tradition of the Israelites.

The scriptures do not teach that the soul exists for eternity, the scriptures teach that every soul that sins dies.


Ezekiel 18:20
The soul that sins, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be on him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be on him.


So when the body dies the soul dies(or at least enters a death like sleep) as well. As the scriptures clearly teach their is no thought or memory or any thing after one dies and are laid to rest in the grave ...


Psalm 6:5
No one remembers you when he is dead. Who praises you from the grave?

Ecclesiastes 9:5
For the living know they will die; but the dead do not know anything, nor have they any longer a reward, for their memory is forgotten.
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Old 01-07-2011, 11:48 AM
 
351 posts, read 283,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776 View Post
The above translation shows the two verses to be just as different as the Young's translation which i used in my Original Post, the only difference is the use of the word hell in place of Gehenna, and so your post does in no way change the facts.

The word soul is not even mentioned in that verse in Luke 12:4-5. Did Christ actually mention the soul in the sermon or not?

If Luke is true, then Jesus in truth said nothing about the soul in that sermon, but if Matthew is true, then Jesus did in fact mention the soul and Luke is thus erroneous. They cannot both be an accurate testimony of what Jesus actually said, plain and simple.
Ironman are you trying to be cute? We both know that these are parables. Notice in Matthew it is do not fear he who can KILL the body but, then it says but fear Him who can DESTROY the body and soul in gehenna. In the parable Jesus used Gehenna fire as the cleansing fire of God. In Luke even though the soul was not used it is implied. So they are both saying the same thing.

Don't fear anyone who can kill your body but not touch your soul which goes to Sheol but do fear(hold in awe) He(God) who can destroy(burn out your carnality) body and soul in gehenna fire. Differnt words do not change the meaning on the verses They are spiritual
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Old 01-07-2011, 02:32 PM
 
7,374 posts, read 7,196,917 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sschulz View Post
Ironman are you trying to be cute? We both know that these are parables. Notice in Matthew it is do not fear he who can KILL the body but, then it says but fear Him who can DESTROY the body and soul in gehenna. In the parable Jesus used Gehenna fire as the cleansing fire of God. In Luke even though the soul was not used it is implied. So they are both saying the same thing.

Don't fear anyone who can kill your body but not touch your soul which goes to Sheol but do fear(hold in awe) He(God) who can destroy(burn out your carnality) body and soul in gehenna fire. Differnt words do not change the meaning on the verses They are spiritual
No, i'm not trying to be cute ... There are quite a few things in Matthew i doubt if they really happened, like the order from Herod to murder all the children, or the wise men visiting Christ from the east.

So i question what did Christ really say, as the difference is significant.
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Old 01-07-2011, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776 View Post
No, i'm not trying to be cute ... There are quite a few things in Matthew i doubt if they really happened, like the order from Herod to murder all the children, or the wise men visiting Christ from the east.

So i question what did Christ really say, as the difference is significant.

I believe it is, as well. And, like I said, Luke doesn't contradict the OT.
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Old 01-09-2011, 04:38 AM
 
Location: Buxton, England
7,032 posts, read 8,372,655 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stillkit View Post
Au contraire! Life WITH Christ is exciting, challenging, fulfilling and loads of fun.

Life without Him is just an endless series of amusements with little purpose.

In your opinion. Which would happen to be wrong by the way. Plenty of non Christian people have fulfilling lives without this nonsense and have happy relationships, fulfilled lives, and activities/ambitions/careers with much meaningful purpose, and which contribute to the good of society in many ways. Get over yourself.
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