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Old 01-06-2011, 05:18 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
That was funny. I laughed.
Couldn't help it.....
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Old 01-06-2011, 05:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Twin, that's weak. Plato (and others) used "aidios" for eternal. I've tried numerous times to explain this, but nobody (in the traditional camp) seems to care.
Actually, Plato and others who used aidios, that word was translated into English as "eternal" but that does not prove Plato and others meant "eternal" when they used the word aidios.
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Old 01-06-2011, 05:40 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Actually, Plato and others who used aidios, that word was translated into English as "eternal" but that does not prove Plato and others meant "eternal" when they used the word aidios.

When Plato referred to the immortal gods he used aidios. The Greek Jews used aidios for "eternal." I can't imagine why the writers of the New Testament wouldn't have used aidios if that was the word being used for eternal back then. And it was being used. Plato was confused by his own philosphies, and he couldn't care less what was written in the Old Testament, so we don't have to use him for our examples, but I find it kind of strange that theologians do rely on him for their teachings instead of the teachings of the OT.
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Old 01-06-2011, 05:50 PM
 
Location: On a road heaven bound !
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
Plato never used Aion or Aionios for Eternal

So your point is that if Plato never used the word "toilet paper" that people couldn't possibly wipe .... even though there are different words describing it ?
Yup, its been different every since Mr Whipple died (RIP)
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Old 01-06-2011, 06:17 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,295,475 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
But the soul, as you point out at the end of your post above is the result of body and spirit coming together and then man becomes a living soul.
....in the new testament....as I stated....benefactors by their faith in Christ...hermeneutics...or did you stray from the theme so quick?
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Old 01-06-2011, 06:20 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
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AIONIOS is an adjective...not a noun BTW....lol
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Old 01-06-2011, 06:25 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
When Plato referred to the immortal gods he used aidios. The Greek Jews used aidios for "eternal." I can't imagine why the writers of the New Testament wouldn't have used aidios if that was the word being used for eternal back then. And it was being used. Plato was confused by his own philosphies, and he couldn't care less what was written in the Old Testament, so we don't have to use him for our examples, but I find it kind of strange that theologians do rely on him for their teachings instead of the teachings of the OT.
Actually, when Plato referred to the imperceptible gods he used aidios.

The Greek Jews used aidios for "imperceptible."

The 'a' in aidios means "un" or "not" and idios is "perceived" giving us "Imperceptible."

Just like the 'a' in "atheist" means "no" and "theos" is "God."
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Old 01-06-2011, 06:39 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Actually, when Plato referred to the imperceptible gods he used aidios.

The Greek Jews used aidios for "imperceptible."

The 'a' in aidios means "un" or "not" and idios is "perceived" giving us "Imperceptible."

Just like the 'a' in "atheist" means "no" and "theos" is "God."

Eusebius, I know what "a" means, for Pete's sake, but I don't get what you are trying to say. Endless duration. That's how they used the word "aidios" back when the NT was written.

It's only used twice in the NT and it means endless duration.

Strong's Greek: 126. €ΐδιο‚ (aidios) -- everlasting

(and idios means imperceptible??)
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Old 01-06-2011, 07:27 PM
 
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Not really.
The Concordant Literal New Testament has it thus:

(Rom 1:20) For His invisible attributes are descried from the creation of the world, being
apprehended by His achievements, besides His imperceptible power and divinity, for them to be
defenseless,

(Jud 1:6) Besides, messengers who keep not their own sovereignty, but leave their own habitation,
He has kept in imperceptible bonds under gloom for the judging of the great day."


Those messengers can't be held in "eternal" bonds as you suggest since they are kept in them "for the judging" which surely is not eternal.

Some translations say "till the great day" or "until the great day"
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Old 01-06-2011, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Not really.
The Concordant Literal New Testament has it thus:

(Rom 1:20) For His invisible attributes are descried from the creation of the world, being
apprehended by His achievements, besides His imperceptible power and divinity, for them to be
defenseless,

(Jud 1:6) Besides, messengers who keep not their own sovereignty, but leave their own habitation,
He has kept in imperceptible bonds under gloom for the judging of the great day."


Those messengers can't be held in "eternal" bonds as you suggest since they are kept in them "for the judging" which surely is not eternal.

Some translations say "till the great day" or "until the great day"
"Eternal" in both these verses is "aidios" and has nothing to do with "imperceptible." Invisible (or imperceptible) was translated from "aorata." Nothing whatsoever to do with "aidios."

I know Jude can't mean "eternal" but it is used in this verse as eternal. The "deep gloom" or imperceptible here is translated from "zophon."

Jude 1:6 Bible Lexicon
Romans 1:20 Bible Lexicon
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