U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-06-2011, 07:04 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
6,370 posts, read 5,627,358 times
Reputation: 575

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
I see a misuse of the terms...if we aren't applying them hermeneutically, then sure, by all means, they can mean anything we want them to, but if we are to apply soul and spirit hermeneutically....then there are standards we must go by. The "soul" is the person. The spirit, is a gift, only via faith in Christ. There is no such thing as an "immortal" soul, as it never was, since all beings are finite, bound by the laws of nature, but it is the sprit which is what a person is blessed with, so that they inherit immortality. In the New testament, when pneuma refers to the human "spirit" it is that which makes the human being a living person (Luke 8:55). Death results in the release of the "spirit" to God (Matthew 27:50; Acts 7:59). The pneuma represents an individual’s deepest thoughts and emotions (Mark 2:8; John 11:33; 1 Corinthians 2:11). The "spirit," in conjunction with the "body" (soma, 1 Corinthians 7:34), the flesh (sarx, 2 Corinthians 7:1) and "soul" (psuche, 1 Thessalonians 5:23) represents the whole person.
soul = spirit + body.

We read in God's Word that a body without a spirit is dead. Therefore, a soul is a living being.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-07-2011, 05:25 AM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,427,722 times
Reputation: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
"Eternal" in both these verses is "aidios" and has nothing to do with "imperceptible." Invisible (or imperceptible) was translated from "aorata." Nothing whatsoever to do with "aidios."

I know Jude can't mean "eternal" but it is used in this verse as eternal. The "deep gloom" or imperceptible here is translated from "zophon."

Jude 1:6 Bible Lexicon
Romans 1:20 Bible Lexicon
Of course it has everything to do with imperceptible. When's the last time you saw the bonds and gloom of those messengers?

Those bonds can't be eternal because they will be one day released from them to stand before Jesus Christ.

I think you meant above that you know Jude can't mean "eternal" but it was improperly translated as "eternal" in some per-versions of the bible.

Nathaniel Scarlett on Jude 1:6 "unseen chains" . . .
"Most Lexicon writers derive the word aidios from aei, ever or always: but
it may have the same etemology as [h]ades, which they derive from a
negative, and idein, to see; and therefore it signifies invisible,
unseen, or unknown. In Romans 1:20 where it is applied to the power of
the Deity, it means unknown; because we see or know only a very small
part of God's power.

" The word is used in a limited sense by the Greeks:
thus Thucydides has this phrase--othen (whence clv) aidion
(imperceptible) misthophoran uparchein (to be belonging clv), from
whence he expected a perpetual salary." But this could only be a salary
during his life: therefore the word here in Thucydides means a period
unknown; though it will certainly end." (Above quote taken from The New Testament by Nathaniel Scarlett 1798).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-07-2011, 05:36 AM
 
Location: Germany
1,647 posts, read 1,706,819 times
Reputation: 842
Quote:
The Greek Jews used aidios for "imperceptible."

The 'a' in aidios means "un" or "not" and idios is "perceived" giving us "Imperceptible."
it might be true, see this word, aidês

however I think there is little controversy that aidios was used in the sense of "everlasting", I would not challenge it; I am familiar with the quote of Thucydides, but is there any reference in which work this phrase is found, I was not able yet to confirm it
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2011, 10:05 PM
 
Location: NC
11,918 posts, read 13,814,338 times
Reputation: 1323
Great topic, Eusebius. Thanks!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2011, 10:47 PM
 
17,689 posts, read 8,866,529 times
Reputation: 1485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Not really.
(Jud 1:6) Besides, messengers who keep not their own sovereignty, but leave their own habitation,
He has kept in imperceptible bonds under gloom for the judging of the great day."


Those messengers can't be held in "eternal" bonds as you suggest since they are kept in them "for the judging" which surely is not eternal.

Some translations say "till the great day" or "until the great day"
Could it be that they were held in imperceptible darkness without the light of Christ, until the day of their judgment?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2011, 10:48 PM
 
3,576 posts, read 452,553 times
Reputation: 385
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShanaBrown View Post
Great topic, Eusebius. Thanks!
Hey Shana I have missed you!!! so good to "see" you
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2011, 10:55 PM
 
Location: NC
11,918 posts, read 13,814,338 times
Reputation: 1323
Thank you, Meerkat! It is good to see you too Hope you are doing well!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2011, 11:08 PM
 
5,733 posts, read 4,580,552 times
Reputation: 4148
SHANA!!!!!!!!!

I'm sothrilled to see you!!!!!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2011, 11:11 PM
 
Location: NC
11,918 posts, read 13,814,338 times
Reputation: 1323
You too, .Sparrow. I missed you!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2011, 11:26 PM
 
5,733 posts, read 4,580,552 times
Reputation: 4148
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top