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Old 01-09-2011, 04:58 PM
 
16,301 posts, read 24,244,521 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
By the way, the shooter that killed those people in AZ presents himself as an atheist.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antlered Chamataka View Post
I brought that up yesterday. Champs everywhere have been largely silent
The topic is the is the wacko's from Westboro, and the fact they represent themselves as christians. His motivation was political.

Timothy McVeigh was a self-professed christian.
Charles Manson was a scientologist

Common thread? Moderator cut: edit

Last edited by june 7th; 01-09-2011 at 11:14 PM..
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Old 01-09-2011, 10:00 PM
 
Location: 30-40°N 90-100°W
13,856 posts, read 22,251,762 times
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The Westboro people are really fringe in the Christian world. I don't want to disrespect Muslims, but going by what evidence I know even Osama Bin Laden is more respected/mainstream to Muslims than Phelps is for Christians. So if any atheist or agnostic is making hay on this it just doesn't work. Phelps is a publicity-hound lawyer in his own world with his little group. I don't think he says or represents anything about anything.
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Old 01-09-2011, 11:20 PM
 
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Would it not be true that there will always be extremist views (and thus, groups) in any religious ideology, independent of mainstream cultural, religiious perspecctives? It would seem to June that to identify such individuals as typifying their said religion would be doing a vast disservice to what their actual religion and beliefs are really all about....


Take gentle care,
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Old 01-09-2011, 11:34 PM
 
Location: Florida
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I would go so far as to say I believe that God can "use" Fred Phelps as an example of what believing wicked doctrines can do to a person. The label doesn't matter. His fruits speak for themselves for people to see. I suppose what I'd like to know is what do those of the ET camp do with men like Fred Phelps? He hates gays and claims that God is an angry monster. ETers have that in common with the man, as well as using the 'Christian' label. I'm always surprised when an Atheist feels that Fred Phelps is an argument that "proves" there is no god.

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Old 01-10-2011, 06:41 AM
 
Location: Wherever women are
19,022 posts, read 24,695,861 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asheville Native View Post
The topic is the is the wacko's from Westboro, and the fact they represent themselves as christians. His motivation was political.

Timothy McVeigh was a self-professed christian.
Charles Manson was a scientologist

Common thread? Moderator cut: edit
Oh yeah, that's right, Ashe, nice to see you go on the defensive. Like the shoe that went to the other foot. You're sounding like the Christians now?
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Old 01-10-2011, 08:50 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antlered Chamataka View Post
Oh yeah, that's right, Ashe, nice to see you go on the defensive. Like the shoe that went to the other foot. You're sounding like the Christians now?
The point is your assessment is driven by the hatred of atheists based on your perception not reason. My point was that McVeigh was a self professed christian, but the actions were politically motivated not religious, along with a serious level of (unmentionable in this thread ) illness.

(unmentionable ) illness is often a chemical imbalance in the brain, and the human mind, regardless of religious beliefs, is not immune. You choose to make the irrational assumption that the religious belief is the causation, not the chemical imbalance of the brain. Have your read anything about this fruit cake, this dude has a bunch of issues.

I'm not defensive, I'm pointing out the fallacy of your assumption, sorry you choose not to recognize or admit that, but nor does that surprise me.
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Old 01-10-2011, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asheville Native View Post
My point was that McVeigh was a self professed christian, but the actions were politically motivated not religious, along with a serious level of (unmentionable in this thread ) illness.
It seems that the "Christian" status of Timothy McVeigh has been a source of controversy for years:
McVeigh No Christian; Worshipped Himself; Said “Science Is My Religion”

Also, his last words were reported to be... "I am the master of my fate, the guardian of my soul..." Doesn't sound like something a Theist would say, and particularly not a Christian Theist.
Timothy McVeigh - Famous Last Words of Timothy McVeigh
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Old 01-10-2011, 03:02 PM
 
16,301 posts, read 24,244,521 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
It seems that the "Christian" status of Timothy McVeigh has been a source of controversy for years:
McVeigh No Christian; Worshipped Himself; Said “Science Is My Religion”

Also, his last words were reported to be... "I am the master of my fate, the guardian of my soul..." Doesn't sound like something a Theist would say, and particularly not a Christian Theist.
Timothy McVeigh - Famous Last Words of Timothy McVeigh
whatever......... the point is the actions of McVeigh and the AZ nut are political, they are making political statements not religious statements; albeit, a bit extreme, but an unmentionable condition caused by chemical imbalances in the brain likely contributed to the extreme consequences.

Fred Phelps and his gang of knuckle draggers, now that is religious motivated, not my speculation but according to Fred Phelps. Chemical imbalance in the brain? Unknown
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Old 01-10-2011, 04:56 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asheville Native View Post
Validation that hatred is a christian value.
Honestly, how can you say that when virtually every Christian outside of the Westboro Baptist Church is decrying these actions? I don't know of a single Christian who supports them. On the other hand, hating Christians does seem to be something you're quite proud of. Why is that? Most of us aren't anything at all like the people you want to lump us in with.
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Old 01-10-2011, 05:04 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,965 posts, read 5,571,687 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katzpur View Post
Honestly, how can you say that when virtually every Christian outside of the Westboro Baptist Church is decrying these actions? I don't know of a single Christian who supports them. On the other hand, hating Christians does seem to be something you're quite proud of. Why is that? Most of us aren't anything at all like the people you want to lump us in with.
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