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Old 01-12-2011, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Somewhere
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Eternal Torment believers preach that sinners will go to Hell for the rest of eternity where they will be in torment and curse God.

Is the continuation of SIN forevermore supported in scripture?

 
Old 01-12-2011, 10:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
Eternal Torment believers preach that sinners will go to Hell for the rest of eternity where they will be in torment and curse God.

Is the continuation of SIN forevermore supported in scripture?
Yes it is supported in the scriptures.

But that's the problem. Are those Scriptures which suggest an eternal continuation of sin properly translated? Ah, that's the question.
 
Old 01-12-2011, 12:42 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,110,371 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
Eternal Torment believers preach that sinners will go to Hell for the rest of eternity where they will be in torment and curse God.

Is the continuation of SIN forevermore supported in scripture?
No.

Sin came by the Law, and the Law was nailed to the cross. Sin has been put away by Jesus Christ who was the Last Adam. Just as all have died in Adam, all will be made alive in Christ Jesus. ("For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself." Heb. 9.26)

Mankind has been justified and put into Life. Now we are waiting for God to reveal His salvation to the rest of mankind, since justification is the "foundation" but salvation is the "completion."

Sin was part of the plan that God has for mankind. He knew what would happen to Adam 1 in the garden of Eden, and that is why Jesus was crucified before the world began. He is our "safety net."

Without God's grace and mercy, we would have been hopelessly "lost."

Aisi..

Blessings!
Brian
 
Old 01-12-2011, 01:04 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
6,370 posts, read 5,630,103 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
No.

Sin came by the Law, and the Law was nailed to the cross. Sin has been put away by Jesus Christ who was the Last Adam. Just as all have died in Adam, all will be made alive in Christ Jesus. ("For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself." Heb. 9.26)

Mankind has been justified and put into Life. Now we are waiting for God to reveal His salvation to the rest of mankind, since justification is the "foundation" but salvation is the "completion."

Sin was part of the plan that God has for mankind. He knew what would happen to Adam 1 in the garden of Eden, and that is why Jesus was crucified before the world began. He is our "safety net."

Without God's grace and mercy, we would have been hopelessly "lost."

Aisi..

Blessings!
Brian
So there is no such thing as a sinner at this time present time?
 
Old 01-12-2011, 01:09 PM
 
Location: Canada
6,643 posts, read 3,994,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
No.

Sin came by the Law, and the Law was nailed to the cross. Sin has been put away by Jesus Christ who was the Last Adam. Just as all have died in Adam, all will be made alive in Christ Jesus. ("For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself." Heb. 9.26)

Mankind has been justified and put into Life. Now we are waiting for God to reveal His salvation to the rest of mankind, since justification is the "foundation" but salvation is the "completion."

Sin was part of the plan that God has for mankind. He knew what would happen to Adam 1 in the garden of Eden, and that is why Jesus was crucified before the world began. He is our "safety net."

Without God's grace and mercy, we would have been hopelessly "lost."

Aisi..

Blessings!
Brian
Brian, sin did NOT come by way of the law, sin was in the world BEFORE the law but was not imputed unto men until the law
 
Old 01-12-2011, 01:19 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,110,371 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
So there is no such thing as a sinner at this time present time?
Yes and no. Let me attempt to explain:

God made man to be condemned through Adam 1. That means no choice on our part, it was His "decree."

But that was not the end. God then made man to be Justified and made Alive thought Adam 2. That also means no choice on our part, it was His decree. (Eph. 2 describes what God did to man while he was still in sin.)

We read that all things have been put under Jesus' feet, but we don't see things that way (yet). God has not imparted faith to all mankind yet, even though all are justified. But when the word is preached, He mixes it with faith in those He chooses at that moment.

So the "acts" of sin still exist, yes. But the power, extent and reign of sin has been cancelled in Jesus Christ. The difference between believers and unbelievers is this, that one knows that they are justified, the others not yet.

We also read that no man can call Jesus "Lord" except by the influence of the Holy Ghost. So here too, we see that it must be God who changes man's understanding of who He is (and who he himself is too) through His Spirit. It is all God's work, none of ours. That's why it's called "grace."

I hope this helps...

Blessings,
brian
 
Old 01-12-2011, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,110,371 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pneuma View Post
Brian, sin did NOT come by way of the law, sin was in the world BEFORE the law but was not imputed unto men until the law
You're right! I was thinking of how the Law "revived" sin (Romans 7), but you are right, sin was there all along.
Thanks for correcting me!

Blessings pneuma!
Brian
 
Old 01-12-2011, 01:36 PM
 
Location: Canada
6,643 posts, read 3,994,791 times
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Quote:
God made man to be condemned through Adam 1.
Brian where do you find this in scripture?

God never made man to be condemned, He made man to be in His image and likeness, man is not there yet, but that does not mean God made man to first be condemned.

Disobediance is what condemned man
 
Old 01-12-2011, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,110,371 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pneuma View Post
Brian where do you find this in scripture?

God never made man to be condemned, He made man to be in His image and likeness, man is not there yet, but that does not mean God made man to first be condemned.

Disobediance is what condemned man
What I meant is that God made a specific decision to condemn all mankind. The "cause" of this was Adam's disobedience.

But I believe God condemned all mankind in order to do the opposite, and save man again: the one act of obedience (Jesus Christ) justified all mankind. Jesus "reversed the curse."

Blessings,
Brian
 
Old 01-12-2011, 02:06 PM
 
Location: Canada
6,643 posts, read 3,994,791 times
Reputation: 386
Quote:
What I meant is that God made a specific decision to condemn all mankind. The "cause" of this was Adam's disobedience.


Godonly did this AFTER Adams disobedience, God just gave them over to what they desired.

Quote:
But I believe God condemned all mankind in order to do the opposite, and save man again: the one act of obedience (Jesus Christ) justified all mankind. Jesus "reversed the curse."


amen
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