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Old 01-13-2011, 10:13 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,252 posts, read 20,001,723 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
To URs everything is always about hell. That's why I said it is an obsession. The thread is about UR running on feeling as opposed to faith.
Feelings about what ? Exactly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 
Old 01-13-2011, 10:33 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,409,710 times
Reputation: 682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin View Post
I am sorry legoman you are starting to sound like that woman who went crazy and killed all her children.
There is no objective way to look at such evil thoughts..... you're trying to justify.
Who is to say that little girl if not for her life taken so young and tragically would have had a wonderful life serving God in many, many wonderful ways.....
Sorry, but I don't see your logic and reasoning....
You are putting more value on this physical life than on the life to come, which IMHO is strange.

Is it not better this soul be with God in heaven, than instead live out a life of pain and suffering (everyone - EVERYONE has some sort of pain and suffering in this life) and then possibly end up eternally separated from God (as you believe is a possibility)?

Everyone dies in this physical life. Do you think God has no control over when a person dies? Do you think God perhaps has a reason as to why this happened?

Psalm 139
13 For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my motherís womb.
14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.
15 My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place,
when I was woven together in the depths of the earth.
16 Your eyes saw my unformed body;
all the days ordained for me were written in your book
before one of them came to be.

God formed this 9 year old boy - knew all that would happen to him - and ordained all the days he would live. Now we know what happened to him. God already knew it when He knit him together in his mother's womb.

I'm a bit off tangent here, but certainly there is mercy in death - especially if it means you are moved directly into the presence of the love of the Lord.
 
Old 01-13-2011, 10:34 AM
 
Location: On a road heaven bound !
10,290 posts, read 8,046,369 times
Reputation: 17783
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post
You are putting more value on this physical life than on the life to come, which IMHO is strange.

Is it not better this soul be with God in heaven, than instead live out a life of pain and suffering (everyone - EVERYONE has some sort of pain and suffering in this life) and then possibly end up eternally separated from God (as you believe is a possibility)?

Everyone dies in this physical life. Do you think God has no control over when a person dies? Do you think God perhaps has a reason as to why this happened?

Psalm 139
13 For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my motherís womb.
14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.
15 My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place,
when I was woven together in the depths of the earth.
16 Your eyes saw my unformed body;
all the days ordained for me were written in your book
before one of them came to be.

God formed this 9 year old boy - knew all that would happen to him - and ordained all the days he would live. Now we know what happened to him. God already knew it when He knit him together in his mother's womb.

I'm a bit off tangent here, but certainly there is mercy in death - especially if it means you are moved directly into the presence of the love of the Lord.
 
Old 01-13-2011, 10:37 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,409,710 times
Reputation: 682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin View Post


I'm not sure what the issue is here. Which is more desirable:

1. to be directly in the presence of the Lord forever
2. to live in this physical existence of pain and suffering

Heck we see on here daily people wishing and hoping that the rapture will be "any day now" just so they can escape the painful existence of this world and be with the Lord.

Why should we not think any different in the case of this 9-year old boy who most would agree is certainly with the Lord.

Boggles my mind how illogical people are.
 
Old 01-13-2011, 10:39 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,686,793 times
Reputation: 639
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
To URs everything is always about hell. That's why I said it is an obsession. The thread is about UR running on feeling as opposed to faith.
Faith in what?
 
Old 01-13-2011, 10:43 AM
 
Location: On a road heaven bound !
10,290 posts, read 8,046,369 times
Reputation: 17783
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman View Post


I'm not sure what the issue is here. Which is more desirable:

1. to be directly in the presence of the Lord forever
2. to live in this physical existence of pain and suffering

Heck we see on here daily people wishing and hoping that the rapture will be "any day now" just so they can escape the painful existence of this world and be with the Lord.

Why should we not think any different in the case of this 9-year old boy who most would agree is certainly with the Lord.

Boggles my mind how illogical people are.
I pray if you have children of your own that nothing, nothing tragically, especially something like that ever happens.

That is all I have to say to you.....

I do HOPE you have a nice day !!
 
Old 01-13-2011, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,520 posts, read 31,917,431 times
Reputation: 9413
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Feelings about what ? Exactly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh, Paulie..... About spiritual matters of course.
 
Old 01-13-2011, 11:03 AM
 
6,221 posts, read 6,409,710 times
Reputation: 682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Munchkin View Post
I pray if you have children of your own that nothing, nothing tragically, especially something like that ever happens.

That is all I have to say to you.....

I do HOPE you have a nice day !!
Why are you trying to make this about me? We are talking about some deep topics here. It seems like we are talking about two different things. Never mind.



BTW I do have children and would never wish that anything terrible happens to them.
But if something did, something beyond my control, I would still have comfort that they are going to be with the Lord. (I think it was Heartsong who has personal experience with this - maybe see what she has said on the topic as well).

This whole thread of discussion started because Finn was saying how God destroyed entire populations of people through the flood; Sodom and Gomorrah destroyed by fire etc. Finn was trying to say because God did this that "His ways are higher than our ways" meaning it was proof that God would send people to eternal torment. Specifically this is what Finn said:

Quote:
You asked me why I don't do what God does. Well, why don't you? He already drowned them, and He already burned the people in Sodom and Gomorrah, yet you seem to insist He is not capable of such things after we die. Everyone here will die a physical death because of God. You may not find it fair, but it is God's will. You think He is capable of thses things on earth, but not after we die? You think God is another God once you die? No, He is the same God regardless of your status.
See even Finns says everyone will die a physical death because of God. And you go after me for whatever reason you think...

I just pointed out that in this death there could be mercy. Certainly when the flood came, many babies and children were killed. "God drowned them" as Finn says. So, did these babies and children go to hell? Did they go to heaven? If they went to heaven, then that is a merciful thing.

I understand these are difficult topics. If you don't want to talk about it- fine, but please don't try to make this about me. I would never hope that anyone lose a child. But it is a hard fact of life. This 9-year old boy was killed. It was a terrible thing. But He will be with the Lord now. That is a GOOD thing.

I hope you have a nice day too CyberLatte...
 
Old 01-13-2011, 11:09 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,686,793 times
Reputation: 639
Since the thread is supposed to be about UR's going by feeling rather than faith it then must be established what exactly should the UR's have faith in.

It is apparent that most UR's believe in Jesus Christ as Saviour, it is also apparent that UR's for the most part believe in Gods judgment on everyone. I think those varying views is a subject for a different thread.

The OP brought it up first not me, nor any other UR in this thread, this thread was started by a non universalist.

So exactly what does the OP think a universalist does not have faith in?

I think it has been established that there is faith in Jesus Christ by most UR's, so if a UR believes in Jesus Christ and that is belief based on feeling then I would suggest that the OP's belief in Jesus Christ is no different.

So the question remains.

According to the beliefs of the OP and to those who agree with the OP what else besides Jesus Christ must we have faith in to be saved?

The OP said

Quote:
Emotions declare, "Hell is evil". Faith declares, "it's the Word of God".
Does our disagreement with this statement from the OP Damn anyone? Please answer

Is the OP suggesting or declaring that a person must believe the above quoted statement to be saved?
 
Old 01-13-2011, 11:11 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,686,793 times
Reputation: 639
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Oh, Paulie..... About spiritual matters of course.

Yes, Faith in Jesus Christ is a spiritual matter, The OP thinks Faith in Jesus Christ is about feelings and says that people who believe in Jesus Christ are unbelievers, it is quite odd that you agree with the OP.
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