Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I'm having a little trouble sleeping so I thought I would post a thread about what is near and dear to my heart. There's been a lot of problems between the fundies and UR's and it's just not right....in the sense that one side is showing hatred and the other nothing but love. That speaks volumes to me and I'd like to post something that I shared in another thread:
I'd like to take a moment and clarify my beliefs. It's been a long, hard road to come to the belief of Universalism and as I type I cry. Universalism is not the enemy here, we are our own enemies. Satan is not the enemy, we are. How in the world could anyone think something as wonderful as the good news of universal reconciliation is bad news? Really think about it people, what exactly are you holding onto? Is it truth? Or is it the worst lie ever told? Really think before you react.
Now and then, when it's convenient, people express love on this board. That's what it's all about, LOVE. I don't care if you call me a hippie because I say that.....then you're calling God Himself a hippie because Jesus Christ said it, not me. He said to love God and each other. People who are steeped in religious garbage, bogged down by years of wrong teaching, can't see it. They can't feel it. They can't touch it. They can't smell it. They can't hear it. It eludes them. I know, I've been where they are. Can I make a suggestion?
Please, please, please go to a place where you can be close to God and nature, with no people around. Sit there and meditate, meditate on God and your surroundings. There's nothing wrong with meditating either. Don't try to hand me that it's some kind of new age stuff. It's been around for centuries and it's called being still and knowing that He is God...directly from the pages of the Bible. I don't think enough people actually do this, they're so caught up in their everyday lives and afraid to be alone and go anywhere by themselves. Just hop in the car and go. Don't tell anyone where you're going, you've got a cell phone don't you?
Look, the little trip I took to a mountaintop all by myself is what started me on the journey to the truth. It's out there, but you'll never find it clinging to ancient beliefs that bruise the mind and soul. It's truly a good thing to clear your mind and sit in silence in the presence of God's beauty. It will do wonders for anyone spiritually and you might come away with a clear and open mind. At least open enough to stop all this condemning of fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.
Where is the hatred? I myself do not adhere to either side, ET or UR, and I am not totally convinced of anything but Eternal Seperation. But when I see people condemning others for adhereing to a primative book written by ignorant men, I see that as hatred. But when I see another warn someone of coming punishment, even if it doesnt last very long or forever I see love. ET and UR are just theories so I reject them and you Ilene know that I love everyone even if I hate what they do or believe just as the Lord does.
Where is the hatred? I myself do not adhere to either side, ET or UR, and I am not totally convinced of anything but Eternal Seperation. But when I see people condemning others for adhereing to a primative book written by ignorant men, I see that as hatred. But when I see another warn someone of coming punishment, even if it doesnt last very long or forever I see love. ET and UR are just theories so I reject them and you Ilene know that I love everyone even if I hate what they do or believe just as the Lord does.
That (loving the person even as you hate their works) is a Godly quality, imo - and I respect that.
Where is the hatred? I myself do not adhere to either side, ET or UR, and I am not totally convinced of anything but Eternal Seperation. But when I see people condemning others for adhereing to a primative book written by ignorant men, I see that as hatred. But when I see another warn someone of coming punishment, even if it doesnt last very long or forever I see love. ET and UR are just theories so I reject them and you Ilene know that I love everyone even if I hate what they do or believe just as the Lord does.
I thought that was pretty dishonest too. I am not saying the Christians here are perfect, because no one is, but to say URs show nothing by love is simply not true. I have received more disrespect and judgment from the urs here than you can imagine.
I have been looking for a thread to post a special story in and I think this one is a good fit.
This past weekend I witnessed one of the best loving “God” type moments where his Love completely filled a Church and his Love touched upon many, some who were even unbelievers.
One of my sons had a close friend in highschool who became pregnant out of wedlock at age 19. This young lady happens to also be my pastor’s daughter. She is the 4th of their 5 children. They had that perfect Christian family until this situation arose. The pastor’s daughter is a very beautiful young lady inside and out and I know her quite well. I had many discussions with her during her early pregnancy as she was undecided on whether to keep her baby or give it up for adoption.
Her Father, the pastor, handled the situation quite well. He shared in Church yesterday about the initial anger he felt for his daughter upon hearing the news and the anger he felt towards the man (who was 6 yrs older than his daughter) that she had met at their very own church and had relations with (relationship did not proceed from here with the man). The pastor said that he was so angry he felt like he could have easily caused a lot more damage but prayed to God for guidance. The message he received from God was “Forgiveness” and he had to walk through that door. He stood by his daughter through her pregnancy; he let the people of their church know about her situation. The members of the church also united stood by her, loved her and supported her.
She is a woman of great faith being brought up in a Christian family and she was very remorseful of the mistake she had made and felt extremely bad for the “scandal” (her words) that she felt she had caused for her Father in their Church. She said that during her pregnancy she prayed to God for his redemption and Love more than she ever has in her life.
She gave birth to a beautiful baby girl in December of 2009. She decided fairly early in her pregnancy that she would keep the baby. I have babysat for her on occasion and have also witnessed what a loving, dedicated Mother she has turned out to be. She gave up her social life almost completely too devout to motherhood. She often discussed with me that she was worried now that it would be hard to find love as most young men would shy away from her being now 20 years old with a young baby.
I told her to trust in God, that he had a plan for her and when the time was right he would bring to her a man that would love both her and her daughter. I also told her that she should not “settle” but only marry if she was really in love and not just for protection and support.
God works in mysterious ways. She met a wonderful Christian young man that she had met many years ago (he had played basketball with one of her older brothers). She met him when the baby was about 5 months old. A wonderful young man that I have met on many occasions – they adore each other and were married this past Saturday.
The Church ceremony was beautiful and the pastor (not the bride’s Father but the pastor of the groom’s church) even had to stop a few times during the ceremony as he was so emotional.
He talked of how he never ever witnessed such evidence of God’s redeeming grace and love as he witnessed with this story. He talked about how God Loves us more than we could ever imagine and if we can just trust in him and open the door to a relationship with him we can truly all have the opportunity to partake of his Love. After the couple was married, a small communion was performed and then the little baby girl, who just started walking on her first birthday in December walked down the aisle into the arms of her new daddy who had written a beautiful letter to her telling her how he had fallen in love also with her when he fell in love with her Mother and then he placed a medallion around her neck, held her and in tears he promised to Love her as his own. There was not a dry eye in this Church. The pastor felt that this couple’s story would be a testimony of God’s unending Love for his children and show many people that we are all sinners and that God forgives.
The master of ceremonies later at the reception spoke that he was not a man of God, that he was not brought up with religion but watching his friend (the bride) go through what she did and the whole pastor’s daughter scenario and how he has witnessed her family, her church and the Love that he said he could feel vibrating in that church early in the day, that he had felt God’s unending Love for the very first time earlier that day.
I truly believed that the Pastor (bride’s father) has been taught a lesson or two by being directly involved with this story. I do not know how he feels down deep about UR or ET – Hell is never discussed at our church. I am sure though that he did a full circle with his daughter and that he was angry with her, he forgave her and something very beautiful came from something that was initially so wrong. God's Love healed and touched this entire congregation and more unbelievers who witnessed this story. I personally cried such tears of joy through our entire church services yesterday. I too felt his Love so much this past few days that my faith has strengthened to a point now where to me there is absolutely no doubt that our God is a God of Love and forgiveness and that he loves us so much more than even our own Father's love us. He will not let one single one of us suffer for all eternity. I do not think he could bear it. I know it in my heart.
God is also a God of Wisdom; and His plans for the redemption and salvation of mankind are the only plans that can be adopted for men to try to follow, in order that they may receive this salvation. He is also a God of Power and in the days to come, when He sees fit to carry out and perfect His plans in their full fruition, He will through the working of His Spirit, which is perfect in its working, destroy all sin and error in His Universe, and perfect harmony will reign and man will be at peace and happiness.
So God is everything in nature and attributes which will not only redeem men from their sins, but will make them lovers of one another and brothers in the true sense of the word. I witness this to a very high degree this weekend – the love that was felt by all and the way this church came together and loved one another. We all are sinners.
It is hard to write the full emotions that were felt. Sorry this is so long – perhaps too long for many of you to read, but this is a story of God’s unending Love that I had to put to paper.
God is so Good and I love him so very much!
Thank you God for being there. AMEN~!
Last edited by SisterKat; 01-24-2011 at 09:28 AM..
...oh dear...Illene...how do I say this as sensitively as possible...without hurting your feelings...because I do not want to do that to you........but I personally have been on the receiving end of your "loving-words-of-affection," and I know all too well the unloving...mocking...scornfull...mean...and insinsitive statements you have made to me alone...and all since you have become a UR...not unlike how you spoke to those who didn't agree with you before you became a UR. Still the same person...with basically the same reactions and attitudes...just a different path being traveled upon.
Keep climbing that mountain...there's a long way to go before you reach the valley on the other side...and a lot of crevaces and stones ahead in your path on the way that should cause you pause...look inward...inside yourself...and find what it is you can change about yourself.
I have been looking for a thread to post a special story in and I think this one is a good fit.
This past weekend I witnessed one of the best loving “God” type moments where his Love completely filled a Church and his Love touched upon many, some who were even unbelievers.
One of my sons had a close friend in highschool who became pregnant out of wedlock at age 19. This young lady happens to also be my pastor’s daughter. She is the 4th of their 5 children. They had that perfect Christian family until this situation arose. The pastor’s daughter is a very beautiful young lady inside and out and I know her quite well. I had many discussions with her during her early pregnancy as she was undecided on whether to keep her baby or give it up for adoption.
Her Father, the pastor, handled the situation quite well. He shared in Church yesterday about the initial anger he felt for his daughter upon hearing the news and the anger he felt towards the man (who was 6 yrs older than his daughter) that she had met at their very own church and had relations with (relationship did not proceed from here with the man). The pastor said that he was so angry he felt like he could have easily caused a lot more damage but prayed to God for guidance. The message he received from God was “Forgiveness” and he had to walk through that door. He stood by his daughter through her pregnancy; he let the people of their church know about her situation. The members of the church also united stood by her, loved her and supported her.
She is a woman of great faith being brought up in a Christian family and she was very remorseful of the mistake she had made and felt extremely bad for the “scandal” (her words) that she felt she had caused for her Father in their Church. She said that during her pregnancy she prayed to God for his redemption and Love more than she ever has in her life.
She gave birth to a beautiful baby girl in December of 2009. She decided fairly early in her pregnancy that she would keep the baby. I have babysat for her on occasion and have also witnessed what a loving, dedicated Mother she has turned out to be. She gave up her social life almost completely too devout to motherhood. She often discussed with me that she was worried now that it would be hard to find love as most young men would shy away from her being now 20 years old with a young baby.
I told her to trust in God, that he had a plan for her and when the time was right he would bring to her a man that would love both her and her daughter. I also told her that she should not “settle” but only marry if she was really in love and not just for protection and support.
God works in mysterious ways. She met a wonderful Christian young man that she had met many years ago (he had played basketball with one of her older brothers). She met him when the baby was about 5 months old. A wonderful young man that I have met on many occasions – they adore each other and were married this past Saturday.
The Church ceremony was beautiful and the pastor (not the bride’s Father but the pastor of the groom’s church) even had to stop a few times during the ceremony as he was so emotional.
He talked of how he never ever witnessed such evidence of God’s redeeming grace and love as he witnessed with this story. He talked about how God Loves us more than we could ever imagine and if we can just trust in him and open the door to a relationship with him we can truly all have the opportunity to partake of his Love. After the couple was married, a small communion was performed and then the little baby girl, who just started walking on her first birthday in December walked down the aisle into the arms of her new daddy who had written a beautiful letter to her telling her how he had fallen in love also with her when he fell in love with her Mother and then he placed a medallion around her neck, held her and in tears he promised to Love her as his own. There was not a dry eye in this Church. The pastor felt that this couple’s story would be a testimony of God’s unending Love for his children and show many people that we are all sinners and that God forgives.
The master of ceremonies later at the reception spoke that he was not a man of God, that he was not brought up with religion but watching his friend (the bride) go through what she did and the whole pastor’s daughter scenario and how he has witnessed her family, her church and the Love that he said he could feel vibrating in that church early in the day, that he had felt God’s unending Love for the very first time earlier that day.
I truly believed that the Pastor (bride’s father) has been taught a lesson or two by being directly involved with this story. I do not know how he feels down deep about UR or ET – Hell is never discussed at our church. I am sure though that he did a full circle with his daughter and that he was angry with her, he forgave her and something very beautiful came from something that was initially so wrong. God's Love healed and touched this entire congregation and more unbelievers who witnessed this story. I personally cried such tears of joy through our entire church services yesterday. I too felt his Love so much this past few days that my faith has strengthened to a point now where to me there is absolutely no doubt that our God is a God of Love and forgiveness and that he loves us so much more than even our own Father's love us. He will not let one single one of us suffer for all eternity. I do not think he could bear it. I know it in my heart.
God is also a God of Wisdom; and His plans for the redemption and salvation of mankind are the only plans that can be adopted for men to try to follow, in order that they may receive this salvation. He is also a God of Power and in the days to come, when He sees fit to carry out and perfect His plans in their full fruition, He will through the working of His Spirit, which is perfect in its working, destroy all sin and error in His Universe, and perfect harmony will reign and man will be at peace and happiness.
So God is everything in nature and attributes which will not only redeem men from their sins, but will make them lovers of one another and brothers in the true sense of the word. I witness this to a very high degree this weekend – the love that was felt by all and the way this church came together and loved one another. We all are sinners.
It is hard to write the full emotions that were felt. Sorry this is so long – perhaps too long for many of you to read, but this is a story of God’s unending Love that I had to put to paper.
God is so Good and I love him so very much!
Thank you God for being there. AMEN~!
Good story of keeping the faith and repentance. Yes, we slip, and if we repent like the young lady in the story did, the Lord will always forgive us and take us back.
Good story of keeping the faith and repentance. Yes, we slip, and if we repent like the young lady in the story did, the Lord will always forgive us and take us back.
...oh dear...Illene...how do I say this as sensitively as possible...without hurting your feelings...because I do not want to do that to you........but I personally have been on the receiving end of your "loving-words-of-affection," and I know all too well the unloving...mocking...scornfull...mean...and insinsitive statements you have made to me alone...and all since you have become a UR...not unlike how you spoke to those who didn't agree with you before you became a UR. Still the same person...with basically the same reactions and attitudes...just a different path being traveled upon.
Keep climbing that mountain...there's a long way to go before you reach the valley on the other side...and a lot of crevaces and stones ahead in your path on the way that should cause you pause...look inward...inside yourself...and find what it is you can change about yourself.
God Bless you.
Wow, Verna - well, I think we can safely say that most of the folks around here have been on the receiving end of your "words of affection" as well. What is that scripture about love not keeping a record of wrongs? I'm sure you can find it.
Good story of keeping the faith and repentance. Yes, we slip, and if we repent like the young lady in the story did, the Lord will always forgive us and take us back.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The Pastor's Daughter - A Long But Loving Story
