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Old 01-26-2011, 09:27 AM
 
30 posts, read 29,286 times
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To begin, let's consider three verses:

1Cor 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

1Cor 15:26 The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.


2Tim 1:10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:


It is through the death and resurrection of Christ that death itself will be destroyed.

Now another verse:

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.


Here we read that death will be destroyed in the lake of fire. Do we then have a contradiction between this verse that says that death will be destroyed in fire and the others that say that death will be destroyed via the death and resurrection of Christ? No, for the fire and the Cross are one and the same:

"I came to send fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled!
"But I have a baptism to be baptized with, and how distressed I am till it is accomplished!
(Luke 12:49-50).

By way of parallelism, Jesus identifies his death on the Cross as His baptism (Matt. 20:22) of fire. John the Baptist, you'll recall, prophesied of the coming fiery baptism in terms of judgment upon sin (Matt. 3:10-12). It is the baptismal fire of Christ that consumes all that is not fit for the Kingdom of God. The Cross accomplishes exactly the same thing, for Jesus bore the sin of the world in judgment, and it is through Christ's death that sin will be done away with.

The Lake of the Fire is the Cross; the second death is the death of the second Adam, in which we must partake in order to die to the flesh and be raised incorruptible.

 
Old 01-26-2011, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,610 posts, read 3,962,766 times
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By the way, who wrote Corinthians?
 
Old 01-26-2011, 10:50 AM
 
30 posts, read 29,286 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
By the way, who wrote Corinthians?
Was it not Paul?
 
Old 01-26-2011, 12:53 PM
 
30 posts, read 29,286 times
Reputation: 22
Was my OP unclear? If so, I'll clarify.

I was hoping to get some feedback.
 
Old 01-26-2011, 01:05 PM
 
Location: RV Park
7,543 posts, read 11,557,405 times
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Spot on Cripps - great post.

If any man come after Me, let him take up his cross and follow.

What is a cross, but an instrument for putting to death the bearer? The need to be conformed into His image is through suffering, that we can experience resurrection in our daily lives - there is no glory without suffering, and there is no resurrection without death.

Last edited by june 7th; 01-26-2011 at 07:28 PM.. Reason: Please you any other color than 'red' as it is reserved for "mod cuts' and moderator actions. ~Thanks!
 
Old 01-26-2011, 01:07 PM
 
3,577 posts, read 454,899 times
Reputation: 385
Quote:
Originally Posted by samuel cripps View Post
To begin, let's consider three verses:

1Cor 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

1Cor 15:26 The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.


2Tim 1:10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:


It is through the death and resurrection of Christ that death itself will be destroyed.

Now another verse:

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.


Here we read that death will be destroyed in the lake of fire. Do we then have a contradiction between this verse that says that death will be destroyed in fire and the others that say that death will be destroyed via the death and resurrection of Christ? No, for the fire and the Cross are one and the same:

"I came to send fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled!
"But I have a baptism to be baptized with, and how distressed I am till it is accomplished!
(Luke 12:49-50).

By way of parallelism, Jesus identifies his death on the Cross as His baptism (Matt. 20:22) of fire. John the Baptist, you'll recall, prophesied of the coming fiery baptism in terms of judgment upon sin (Matt. 3:10-12). It is the baptismal fire of Christ that consumes all that is not fit for the Kingdom of God. The Cross accomplishes exactly the same thing, for Jesus bore the sin of the world in judgment, and it is through Christ's death that sin will be done away with.

The Lake of the Fire is the Cross; the second death is the death of the second Adam, in which we must partake in order to die to the flesh and be raised incorruptible.
Hi Samuel, I agree --- and that is why it says here that they are tormented in the presence of the Lamb
Rev 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
 
Old 01-26-2011, 01:15 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,288,619 times
Reputation: 420
The Lake of Fire and Christ are not the same.
You haven't proved anything but mere eisegesis and word proofed imposition. The Lake of Fire is purely a covenantal place of destruction of death, Hell (Sheol) for the covenant people. Those not found written in the book of life (covenant people who transgressed the law and died in their sins) were cast along with Death and Hell, exterminated forever.

Pantelism

Satan and his minions are the only ones tormenting there for ever and ever.
Maybe my sometimes accused of UR friend, David, can bring you closer to being consistent with the scripture. And if you want to deal with him head on, I chat with him regularly.

Last edited by sciotamicks; 01-26-2011 at 01:25 PM..
 
Old 01-26-2011, 01:31 PM
 
30 posts, read 29,286 times
Reputation: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
The Lake of Fire and Christ are not the same.
You haven't proved anything but mere eisegesis and word proofed imposition. The Lake of Fire is purely a covenantal place of destruction of death, Hell (Sheol) for the covenant people. Those not found written in the book of life (covenant people who transgressed the law and died in their sins) were cast along with Death and Hell, exterminated forever.

Pantelism

Satan and his minions are the only ones tormenting there for ever and ever.
Maybe my sometimes accused of UR friend, David, can bring you closer to being consistent with the scripture. And if you want to deal with him head on, I chat with him regularly.
Sciota,

I'd love to chat with your friend David..

Why do you say that my case is based on eisegesis and "word-proofed imposition"?

Why don't we get our hands dirty and see if I'm not taking things out of context.
 
Old 01-26-2011, 01:32 PM
 
3,577 posts, read 454,899 times
Reputation: 385
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
The Lake of Fire and Christ are not the same.
You haven't proved anything but mere eisegesis and word proofed imposition. The Lake of Fire is purely a covenantal place of destruction of death, Hell (Sheol) for the covenant people. Those not found written in the book of life (covenant people who transgressed the law and died in their sins) were cast along with Death and Hell, exterminated forever.

Pantelism

Satan and his minions are the only ones tormenting there for ever and ever.
Maybe my sometimes accused of UR friend, David, can bring you closer to being consistent with the scripture. And if you want to deal with him head on, I chat with him regularly.
He did not say that the lake of fire is Christ, he said that it is the same as his Cross.
 
Old 01-26-2011, 01:35 PM
 
30 posts, read 29,286 times
Reputation: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
He did not say that the lake of fire is Christ, he said that it is the same as his Cross.
I do believe that the fire itself is God the consuming/refining fire.
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