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Old 01-30-2011, 04:04 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,824 posts, read 9,816,901 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
What is this, a balance sheet or statement predicated on gains and losses?
Is the business in a position to expand?
Or should it take immediate precautions to bolster cash reserves?

"Come on, Twin, have a little more heart and trust Christ."
Well Jerwade I only repeat what God revealed... that is how scripture teaches it.

Faith comes by hearing and hearing the word. Romans 10:17

Predestination Ephesians 1:11

Christ's word is found in the written word (the Bible)
  • John 20:31
    But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
BTW ... I do trust Christ
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Old 01-30-2011, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Gaston, North Carolina
4,213 posts, read 4,902,173 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by june 7th View Post
Not that June would really know, but it would seem to her that any "relational" God that has been spoken of in this thread, especially by those who describe God as love, would have compassion for the fact that he knows he made each individual vulnerable to 'sin.' --Perhaps he sees it as an opportunity to draw people to himself...

Just a "just June" thought...
I think you might be on the right track
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Old 01-30-2011, 08:07 PM
 
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Again, thank you all for all of your replies. I want to respond to many of the replies, but I don't think I can bring any new or concurring incite to that train of thought, yet.

But I realized I didn't give my answer to what a "Relational God" is to me. This thread is the first time I've seen the term used directly, but I've heard Christians state (and I'm sure I'm paraphrasing) "I don't follow a religion, I'm in a relationship with God."

I think for the Christian being in a relationship with God, oppose to practicing a religion, is a way to move away from the tradition involved in being a person practicing a religion.
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Old 01-30-2011, 08:21 PM
 
Location: Redding, Ca
1,240 posts, read 1,022,847 times
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Quote:
If sin keeps man from God, as well as God from man, how can a relationship be established between the two?>>>jchance3
Gods love is unmerited for the purpose of our souls.
Our behavior however is not, unless there is repentance.

As a father of six, I love my kids unconditionally, yet, if they misbehave my favor is some what diminished but not lost.

God is our creator and knows absolutely the human potential under the circumstances He placed us in.

That is why this verse explains Gods unconditional love for us: Rom 8:20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,

All Gods doing there.

Now, if we draw close to God, He promises to draw close to us, as in a relationship.

It's up to us as to the degree.

Blessings, AJ
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Old 01-30-2011, 09:06 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinD69 View Post
I think you might be on the right track


(Robin, surely you jest!)....
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Old 01-30-2011, 09:22 PM
 
Location: Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
Hi June,

God is alive. We are alive. He cares about us, teaches us, guides us, helps us, disciplines us. He's for us. We are all in relation to Him, simply because He made us.

He loves us and has given His eternal Life to us. May we all come to know it and enjoy it, as any child would!

Blessings,
brian
I like the way you put that, Brian

"Certainly, we live, move, and exist because of him. As some of your poets have said, 'We are God's children."Acts 17:28


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5k2y...7D1028C9085147
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Old 01-30-2011, 09:33 PM
 
Location: Florida
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June,

I have not read this entire thread, in fact, I only read Brian's reply so far, and while looking for a song to post in reply to his answer, I found another video/song on Youtube that reminded me that our relationship to God is in finding and appreciating all the glory and beauty and love present in the Creation and celebrating that with one another. Reminding one another how glorious that our Heavenly Father is - that is what it's all about. God is Spirit.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul6Ez...eature=related
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Old 01-30-2011, 10:32 PM
 
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This is long. Sorry.

This question reminds me of my boat scenario I wrote awhile back. It probably won't make much sense, but it makes sense to me.

When a loved one dies... your love for them becomes so overwhelming in your heart. When separation happens (this temporary separation)... you are stepping back from your loved one and are understanding just WHO they are, just what they meant to you. Grief can be overwhelming... there is just something you cannot totally, completely feel until you are separated. It's like death removes some sort of veil. It's strange. But I think that, in a sense, the opposite scenario is happening with us, with God.


Here is what I mean...we are here now, separated from God. We are getting to know him almost in the reverse way we get to know our loved ones. It's like imagine we were all on some island. We keep getting messages in bottles washing ashore. These are the slow, persistent ways we start to understand this being, are through these persistent messages in a bottle from a different island. While this is happening, one by one our loved ones fashion boats and start sailing away to this other island.

We knew our loved ones up close and personal and now that they have sailed away, our love for them just overwhelms us. Because we look back at what we HAD. We realize just how much we love them! Meanwhile these bottles are still washing up on shore... and we are starting to develop love for this being that we never even truly layed eyes on.
One day, it will be our little boat that leaves the shore and while we are saying goodbye to the ones still left on the island, we are setting sail for that other island where we are anxious to meet our loved ones whom we have been separated from and anxious to FINALLY TRULY MEET this being whom created us! And all the while knowing that those we left on that other shore will soon be coming home as well....


I know that the "bottles washing ashore" for me are not going to be the same bottles that someone else recieves. We're all unique and I believe that God's plan is perfect, that each person's relationship with Him is perhaps the way it ought to be at the time. Even if they don't feel they have a relationship. I know that for years, I'd pray or try to talk to God and it was like just talking to air. Nothingness. I honestly did not feel anything. It was just a brick wall. (a relationship? I don't think so. Whoever He was, He wasn't taking my calls for some reason. Or perhaps He was too busy talking to all those televangelists on tv, who knows? They all seemed to be talking to Him all the time "God told me...")

However, I got those bottles, those "feelings". They weren't all filled with profound messages. They weren't all earth-shattering revelations. Something about when I was a little kid, and looking into the sun rays. Everytime I would feel compassion in my heart for another, feeling that literal ache in my heart. Not just emotional, but actual physical heaviness. Some of the bottles were just things in His creation, looking at a flower really close up. Standing outside in the rain. Studying Science of any kind is like all kinds of little bottles all washing ashore at once (to me, anyway).

I remember a huge bottle that washed ashore... I was 14 and crying uncontrollably one night, over a fear. A fear that my mom would die. I don't know why, the thought crept into my mind (this was a few months or so before we even knew she had cancer) and all night I cried into my pillow (so she wouldn't hear me and wake up) and I was just so totally overwhelmed with grief and fear, after hours of this I suddenly felt a warm pressure on my back like someone put the palm of their hand on me. and all of a sudden I completely relaxed, felt peaceful and the thought "everything is going to be ok" just wrapped all around me like a warm blanket. I felt so.. at peace. I know I thought "was this God??" but didn't question it too much and just held onto that feeling. While I was going through my mom's illness with her, I held onto it. It gave me strength. It truly did. Everything is going to be ok.

But... 2 years later, she died.
I picked up that huge bottle (in my mind) and smashed it as hard as I could against the nearest wall and I told God to go to hell.

Many years later... here I am, and that big bottle has been all glued back together. Because although my mom isn't here, everything IS ok. It would take forever to explain why I'm saying that everything is ok, and I've talked long enough. But everything IS ok.

After so many years of feeling like God was "nothingness", and "air"... I can now "hear" his voice. and looking back I know that He was truly with me the whole time. While I believed in Him and while I didn't believe in Him. It never had anything to do with that. There are so many different types of bottles. Some are huge (like the thing when I was 14). Some are very small. I think nowadays, the ones I look for and value the most are the ones that have to do with synchronicity and the meaning of love.

I kind of have this feeling that perhaps, one day, we'll all spend a lot of time, going through thousands and thousands of bottles we never knew we received. (and maybe throwing out a lot we thought were from him, but it was our own handwriting...lol.) I know for most of my life, I didn't really feel God. But now I know that He was there. So I wonder... what was in the bottles I never picked up, never saw? Perhaps it was all part of His plan for me. To miss out on so many bottles for most of my life? I don't know... probably. But, if so, then there was a reason for it. I trust that.



peace,
sparrow
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Old 01-30-2011, 11:17 PM
 
Location: SC Foothills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .sparrow. View Post
I know that the "bottles washing ashore" for me are not going to be the same bottles that someone else recieves. We're all unique and I believe that God's plan is perfect, that each person's relationship with Him is perhaps the way it ought to be at the time. Even if they don't feel they have a relationship. I know that for years, I'd pray or try to talk to God and it was like just talking to air. Nothingness. I honestly did not feel anything. It was just a brick wall. (a relationship? I don't think so. Whoever He was, He wasn't taking my calls for some reason. Or perhaps He was too busy talking to all those televangelists on tv, who knows? They all seemed to be talking to Him all the time "God told me...")
This resonated with me Sparrow, because this is how I'm feeling at the moment. I believe God's plan is perfect also, but for years now I pray and try to talk to God and it's like talking to air....nothingness. He's not taking my calls for some reason. I even prayed for my cat to stop passing blood and even that has not gotten better. The vet found nothing wrong with him, so I thought I would lay my hand on him and pray that it would stop, but it hasn't. Nothing I pray for seems to come to pass, nothing at all. It's very frustrating and I figure what's the point? Why pray at all? But I still do, I haven't lost my faith. My cat is laying right beside me as I type purring up a storm so he seems healthy enough. Maybe our prayers are actually being answered, we just can see it, feel it, touch it. I just don't know, it eludes me but I still pray, I still keep the faith.

Thank you for sharing this Sparrow, it really touched my heart.
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Old 01-30-2011, 11:18 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,965 posts, read 5,571,687 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jchance3 View Post
Thank you all for your replies. All the posts were encouraging, though I am still perplexed.

See, my question isn't based on my own personal relationship with God, but Christianity (and the world) as a whole. It distresses me to look at the collective after I read bible verses like Romans 8:7 and reading John 3.

So, the question is, how is it that a sinner cut off from God and "is enmity against God" get to the point where they want a relationship with God? More so, how does one go from enmity against God to asking for a relationship with Him?
As I see it, God the Father is the Great Gardener and has already planted his seed in every man (Christ is the light that lights every man that comes into the world). Therefore, because his seed is already planted, it will not return to him void. However, some plants are growing more vigorously than others (for many varying reasons). Even a dead plant still has the seed in it, but it doesn't do much good for anything - doesn't bear fruit, etc... There is pollution in the world that keeps the plants from thriving. But the seed is still present - even in the rocky soil and the thorny and dry ground. It looks like the seed there is dormant. But God's seed has eternal life in it. Our God is a consuming fire. Who shall dwell with the devouring fire? His seed, that's who.
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