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Old 02-05-2011, 05:14 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
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This is happening on B16's home turf

143 theologians call for women's ordination, end of mandatory celibacy | National Catholic Reporter
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Old 02-05-2011, 05:34 PM
 
335 posts, read 187,114 times
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"...also call for the ordination of women, and for the Church's acceptance of homosexual partners. They also demand participation of the faithful in the nomination of bishops and an end to the "moral rigidity" of the Church"

All of this in the name of saving something which is contrary to scripture.

1 Cor. 14:34,35 "The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says. If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church."

Before the women on the board go postal on me, remember, these are not my words. There are a number of historical bible commentaries which show this not to be an ambiguous issue- 1 Corinthians 14:34 Bible Commentary

And, 1 Cor. 6:9,10 "Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God."

I don't think Jesus taught to "appease moral deviations" to ensure the pews stay full.
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Old 02-05-2011, 05:59 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
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The Vatican's Pontifical Biblical Commission in 1976 concluded that there is nothing to prohibit women's ordination in the bible
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Old 02-05-2011, 06:06 PM
 
335 posts, read 187,114 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
The Vatican's Pontifical Biblical Commission in 1976 concluded that there is nothing to prohibit women's ordination in the bible
Does the "Vatican's Pontifical Biblical Commission" trump scripture?
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Old 02-05-2011, 06:10 PM
 
23,193 posts, read 11,421,093 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Driftwood2011 View Post
1 Cor. 14:34,35 "The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says. If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church."

Before the women on the board go postal on me, remember, these are not my words. There are a number of historical bible commentaries which show this not to be an ambiguous issue- 1 Corinthians 14:34 Bible Commentary
This tenacious ancient cultural ignorance is a disgrace to any civilized society. The inability to correctly divide the scriptures from the "letter" to the Spirit" has been allowed to corrupt and distort the Good News for 2000+ years. It is an intellectual and moral travesty for which there will undoubtedly be much remorseful "weeping and gnashing of teeth."
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Old 02-05-2011, 06:30 PM
 
335 posts, read 187,114 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
This tenacious ancient cultural ignorance is a disgrace to any civilized society. The inability to correctly divide the scriptures from the "letter" to the Spirit" has been allowed to corrupt and distort the Good News for 2000+ years. It is an intellectual and moral travesty for which there will undoubtedly be much remorseful "weeping and gnashing of teeth."
I understand that was the Jewish culture, as to the period in which this issue was addressed, but this thread was pointing to authority from the Catholic Church which claims Apostolic succession. They claim a continuation of that 1st century congregation and what was represented then. If there was a need to change this direction, wouldn't it come from God?

Jesus surely did condemn personal behavior by those who were hypocritical and unloving. (letter vs. spirit)

I don't believe selective application, or dismissal, of scripture is approved by God based on time or human committees. Changes made contrary to the Mosaic Law were explained by Jesus.

I don't have a church so I don't care what religions do. If they claim that their teachings are in harmony with scripture, or that they represent God, it is easy enough to prove out.
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Old 02-07-2011, 06:37 AM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,235 posts, read 2,493,464 times
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Originally Posted by Driftwood2011 View Post
"...also [u]I don't think Jesus taught to "appease moral deviations" to ensure the pews stay full.
But where does it say women can't be priests?
Also where does it say Jesus ordained any male priests.

The bible also says slaves should be obedient to their owners, should we bring slavery back?

All of our founding fathers were male, all the presidents have been male, I guess we should not allow female presidents.
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Old 02-07-2011, 08:52 AM
 
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God made us, men, women in His image and equal so that one would not rule over the other or consider one favored in the eyes of God and in the "Bride of Christ".

Personally I think we (men and women) are called the Bride for a very good reason. It is called equality..Puts us all in the same boat in the same position with all eyes on the Good Captain leading us through this storm of life.
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Old 02-07-2011, 09:15 AM
 
5,925 posts, read 3,505,556 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Driftwood2011 View Post

Before the women on the board go postal on me, remember, these are not my words.
of course they are, they are your words because you have agreed with others concerning what that scripture means.

The problem is that it is stupid theology that leads one to believe that a women should not speak in church.

That passage is about the type of speaking.

1C 14:33 For God is not for turbulence, but peace, as in all the ecclesias of the saints.

Evidently there was a problem with women causing trouble in the ecclesia. In fact as you read the whole passage it was to everyone to stop the nonsense of trouble making and to focus upon the lord.
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Old 02-07-2011, 10:59 AM
 
335 posts, read 187,114 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
But where does it say women can't be priests?
Rev. 20:6 says "they will be priests for a thousand years." It didn't specify gender. So what religions do before that, is in line with men's provisions, not God's.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
Also where does it say Jesus ordained any male priests.
It doesn't. But there are numerous mentions of appointing men as apostles, teachers, etc. The scripture is not ambiguos as to women keeping silent in the congregation. If you have contention with this, I say you take it up with God, not me.

Men were also appointed as elders in the congregation. This can be seen when Jesus addresses the seven congregations in Revelation.

If you want to see appointments for men: Tim. chapter 3. Women are not mentioned here in these assignments. This is either God's direction, or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
The bible also says slaves should be obedient to their owners, should we bring slavery back?
If you can't determine how this is completely irrelevant, then I don't know why you bother replying, unless you are a Jew and even they do not currently adhere to the dictates of the Mosaic Law.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
All of our founding fathers were male, all the presidents have been male, I guess we should not allow female presidents.
The scriptures say nothing about this. Again, irrelevant and not about the topic.

It is one thing to whitewash unspecific scriptures for personal sake, it is another to change something which is specific.

1 Cor. 14:34,35 "The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says. If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church."

If you have a bone to pick over this, I suggest you take it up with God. It was his arrangement. Religions make their own rules. If you want to do things your way, then just pick one that does that. Most people do.
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