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If eating locusts is being vegetarian then I'm at a loss for words.
Matthew 3:4 says "His meat was locust"
This is the same word in Greek for the insect that eats vegetation as in Exodus 10:4 that the locusts were to swarm Egypt and eat the rest of the crops that were left.
These are the same locusts that come out of the ground in the book of Revelation and fly.
Locust trees don't fly nor eat vegetation.
John the Baptist was not a vegetarian.
Meat = food, does not mean the flesh he ate is locust. I clarified for you that he ate locust bean, common in Jerusalem at that time. This truth, has been revealed by the Holy Spirit.
If we assume that he ate locust, then it must be impractical for him to daily seek locust to catch in order to have a meal. Locust swams you mention do not happen regularly. They happen once in many many years. If John was to wait for a locust swarm, he would stay hungry.
On this note, let me assure you that I am not yet a vegetarian. But then i realize that this is the correct way to live, as it shows love for all of God's creation. That was what God asked of man at the beginning. As we march back to the garden of eden, the practices and ways of God are more evident. Man know thyself!
You keep saying that, but what do you mean by it? Revealed to whom? How?
The Holy Spirit is now on earth physically. Please read Isaiah 2; 1-5, also read John 14 to John chapter 16. Open a thread on the arrival of the Holy Spirit and we will meet there.
Paul had said that in his time he saw through a glass darkly and looked forward to a time he will see face to face. That time is now. All my posts are from Him, I have no knowledge of my own.
Originally Posted by Eusebius If eating locusts is being vegetarian then I'm at a loss for words.
Matthew 3:4 says "His meat was locust"
This is the same word in Greek for the insect that eats vegetation as in Exodus 10:4 that the locusts were to swarm Egypt and eat the rest of the crops that were left.
These are the same locusts that come out of the ground in the book of Revelation and fly.
Locust trees don't fly nor eat vegetation.
John the Baptist was not a vegetarian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlbron
Meat = food, does not mean the flesh he ate is locust. I clarified for you that he ate locust bean, common in Jerusalem at that time. This truth, has been revealed by the Holy Spirit.
If we assume that he ate locust, then it must be impractical for him to daily seek locust to catch in order to have a meal. Locust swams you mention do not happen regularly. They happen once in many many years. If John was to wait for a locust swarm, he would stay hungry.
On this note, let me assure you that I am not yet a vegetarian. But then i realize that this is the correct way to live, as it shows love for all of God's creation. That was what God asked of man at the beginning. As we march back to the garden of eden, the practices and ways of God are more evident. Man know thyself!
Marlbron,
Let's look at the facts:
Exo 10:4 For if you refuse to dismiss My people, behold Me bringing the locusts swarm tomorrow into your boundary,
Exo 10:4 ἐὰν δὲ μὴ θέλῃς σὺ ἐξαποστεῖλαι τὸν λαόν μου, ἰδοὺ ἐγὼ ἐπάγω ταύτην τὴν ὥραν αὔριον ἀκρίδα πολλὴν ἐπὶ πάντα τὰ ὅριά σου,
Sorry, but locust trees don't attack people and devour their crops.
Neither do locust treed fly like Leviticus 11:21-22 show a bug:
Lev 11:21-22 Only this one you may eat of every swarmer of the flyers, the one going on all fours which has shanks above its feet to hop with them on the land. (22) These of them may you eat: the locust, all of its kind, the bald locust, all of its kind, the cricket, all of its kind, and the grasshopper, all of its kind.
Mat 3:4 Now he, John, had his apparel of camel's hair and a leather girdle about his loins. Now his nourishment was locusts and wild honey.
Mat 3:4 αυτος δε ο ιωαννης ειχεν το ενδυμα αυτου απο τριχων καμηλου και ζωνην δερματινην περι την οσφυν αυτου η δε τροφη αυτου ην ακριδες και μελι αγριον
Rev 9:3 And out of the fumes came out locusts into the earth, and license was granted them as the scorpions of the earth have license."
Rev 9:7 And the likenesses of the locusts are like horses made ready for battle, and on their heads are as it were wreaths like gold, and their faces are as it were human faces,
Rev 9:3 και εκ του καπνου εξηλθον ακριδες εις την γην και εδοθη αυταις εξουσια ως εχουσιν εξουσιαν οι σκορπιοι της γης
Rev 9:7 και τα ομοιωματα των ακριδων ομοια ιπποις ητοιμασμενοις εις πολεμον και επι τας κεφαλας αυτων ως στεφανοι ομοιοι χρυσω και τα προσωπα αυτων ως προσωπα ανθρωπων
Notice the exact same word in the Greek is used of the locust bugs that attacked Egypt, the same Greek word is used of the bug the Hebrew people were allowed to eat, the same Greek word used of the bug John the baptist ate, the same Greek word used of the locusts that, in the future, will come out of the earth in Revelation.
It was not a tree or a bean of a tree that was said they could eat but a BUG. A bean did not attack the Egyptians. A bean will not attack mankind in the future as Revelation says. John the baptist did not eat a bean.
"His meat was locusts - His food. These constituted the food of the common people. Among the Greeks the vilest of the people used to eat them; and the fact that John made his food of them is significant of his great poverty and humble life. The Jews were allowed to eat them, Lev_11:22. Locusts are flying insects, and are of various kinds. The green locusts are about 2 inches in length and about the thickness of a man’s finger. The common brown locust is about 3 inches long. The general form and appearance of the locust is not unlike the grasshopper. They were one of the plagues of Egypt Exo. 10. In Eastern countries they are very numerous. They appear in such quantities as to darken the sky, and devour in a short time every green thing. The whole earth is sometimes covered with them for many leagues, Joe_1:4; Isa_33:4-5. “Some species of the locust are eaten until this day in Eastern countries, and are even esteemed as a delicacy when properly cooked. After tearing off the legs and wings, and taking out the entrails, they stick them in long rows upon wooden spits, roast them at the fire, and then proceed to devour them with great zest. There are also other ways of preparing them. For example: they cook them and dress them in oil; or, having dried them, they pulverize them, and, when other food is scarce, make bread of the meal. The Bedouins pack them with salt in close masses, which they carry in their leather sacks. From these they cut slices as they may need them. It is singular that even learned men have suffered themselves to hesitate about understanding these passages of the literal locust, when the fact that these are eaten by the Orientals is so abundantly proved by the concurrent testimony of travelers.
"One of them says they are brought to market on strings in all the cities of Arabia, and that he saw an Arab on Mount Sumara who had collected a sackful of them. They are prepared in different ways. An Arab in Egypt, of whom he requested that he would immediately eat locusts in his presence, threw them upon the glowing coals; and after he supposed they were roasted enough, he took them by the legs and head, and devoured the remainder at one mouthful. When the Arabs have them in quantities they roast or dry them in an oven, or boil them and eat them with salt. The Arabs in the kingdom of Morocco boil the locusts; and the Bedouins eat locusts, which are collected in great quantities in the beginning of April, when they are easily caught. After having been roasted a little upon the iron plate on which bread is baked, they are dried in the sun, and then put into large sacks, with the mixture of a little salt.
"They are never served up as a dish, but every one takes a handful of them when hungry” (Un. Bib. Dic.). Burckhardt, one of the most trustworthy of travelers, says: “All the Bedouins of Arabia and the inhabitants of towns in Nejd and Hedjaz are accustomed to eat locusts.” “I have seen at Medina and Tayf locust-shops, where these animals were sold by measure. In Egypt and Nubia they are only eaten by the poorest beggars The Land and the Book, ii. 107). “Locusts,” says Dr. Thomson (The Land and the Book, ii. 108), “are not eaten in Syria by any but the Bedouin on the extreme frontiers, and it is always spoken of as an inferior article of food, and regarded by most with disgust and loathing tolerated only by the very poorest people. John the Baptist, however, was of this class either from necessity or election.” It is remarkable that not only in respect to his food, but also in other respects, the peculiarities in John’s mode of life have their counterparts in the present habits of the same class of persons. “The coat or mantle of camel’s hair is seen still on the shoulders of the Arab who escorts the traveler through the desert, or of the shepherd who tends his flocks on the hills of Judea or in the valley of the Jordan. It is made of the thin, coarse hair of the camel, and not of the fine hair, which is manufactured into a species of rich cloth. I was told that both kinds of raiment are made on a large scale at Nablus, the ancient Shechem. The ‘leathern girdle’ may be seen around the body of the common laborer, when fully dressed, almost anywhere; whereas men of wealth take special pride in displaying a rich sash of silk or some other costly fabric” (Hackett’s Illustrations of Scripture, p. 104)." (Albert Barnes' Notes on the Bible).
Meat = food, does not mean the flesh he ate is locust. I clarified for you that he ate locust bean, common in Jerusalem at that time. This truth, has been revealed by the Holy Spirit.
If we assume that he ate locust, then it must be impractical for him to daily seek locust to catch in order to have a meal. Locust swams you mention do not happen regularly. They happen once in many many years. If John was to wait for a locust swarm, he would stay hungry.
On this note, let me assure you that I am not yet a vegetarian. But then i realize that this is the correct way to live, as it shows love for all of God's creation. That was what God asked of man at the beginning. As we march back to the garden of eden, the practices and ways of God are more evident. Man know thyself!
To the Op:
Marlbron, you are onto something - no doubt. But when people can't find morality without reading it out of a book then they haven't found it. Your point about JTB may be valid (or not) but in the end - it really doesn't really matter.
Just like Luke 7:47“And that slave who knew his master’s will and did not get ready or act in accord with his will, will receive many lashes, 48but the one who did not know it, and committed deeds worthy of a flogging, will receive but few".
When abolitionists were making their case back in the day this scripture was thrown in their faces as "proof" that their anti-slavery stance was against God's ways.
To quote Eusebius:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius
The abuse of animals is no excuse to disobey what God said that it is now O.K. to eat animals.
One can always find farmers who treat animals humanely,
The quote back then could have been: "The abuse of slaves is no excuse to disobey what God said that it is now O.K. to have slaves.
One can always find slave-owners who treat slaves humanely"
Seems silly now, right? But back then - if YOU were the one strung up, it wasn't silly at all.
NOT TO MENTION that when some suggested that stringing someone up and beating them bloody was NOT an acceptable practice (not "cruel" or "unusual") the same verse could be brought up to support the practice.
So, bottom line, when people can't find morality without reading it out of a book then they haven't found it at all. Trying to prove a certain morality from a book when someone takes that book as God's literal words is fruitless. Genocide is condoned in the OT. And elaborate schools of "apologetics" exist to try and explain how it's all good. But (of course) it's not all good.
So my humble advice is - follow your conviction and rely on God given conscience to do the rest. Expose reality, and for goodness sakes man, stop being a part of what you know is cruel today, right now.
A vegan diet is an amazing and tasty adventure. And no conscious living creature has to be strung up and dismembered alive (to mention just one of a many many horrible abuses) for you to enjoy it.
Firstborn888, how can you possibly eat vegetables!?!
Just look how they abuse those vegetables! and how they abuse bugs that abuse vegetables!
Don't you see what they do? They take these huge machines and tear at the earth ripping apart just to plant seeds. How many bugs, worms, etc. do they destroy as they tear and rip at the earth to plant those seeds?
Look at all the original plants, and trees they destroyed to plant those vegies! Then they spray and spray and spray to kill and keep bugs, bugs God created, from attacking those plants! They spray fixed nitrogen onto the fields which gets into the drinking water, streams, lakes and oceans! They spray all sorts of weed killers, bug sprays that get into our drinking water, streams, lakes and oceans. They fill those machines that rip and tear at the earth with fuels raped from the earth as well. Not to mention the metals that make those machines! all raped from the earth!
How dare you eat those vegies! And if that's not bad enough now the commercial seed makers are genetically modifying those seeds. Just look what you are doing! By purchasing those vegies you are supporting the rapers, the destroyers of this planet. You are a slave of their slick advertising! You are enslaved body, soul and spirit to the machine!
So don't tell me about slavery, about harming of animals. Shame on you! If I were you I wouldn't eat any meat, fruit or vegies! And no milk either or eggs or Turkey for Thanksgiving! No ice cream or apple pie! No beer either. They enslave yeast for God knows how long to get it drunk on sugar to form the alcohol just so you can enjoy your enebriation!
Repent of your vegie eating! Repent of being enslaved to the agri machine!
Firstborn888, how can you possibly eat vegetables!?!
Just look how they abuse those vegetables! and how they abuse bugs that abuse vegetables!
Don't you see what they do? They take these huge machines and tear at the earth ripping apart just to plant seeds. How many bugs, worms, etc. do they destroy as they tear and rip at the earth to plant those seeds?
Look at all the original plants, and trees they destroyed to plant those vegies! Then they spray and spray and spray to kill and keep bugs, bugs God created, from attacking those plants! They spray fixed nitrogen onto the fields which gets into the drinking water, streams, lakes and oceans! They spray all sorts of weed killers, bug sprays that get into our drinking water, streams, lakes and oceans. They fill those machines that rip and tear at the earth with fuels raped from the earth as well. Not to mention the metals that make those machines! all raped from the earth!
How dare you eat those vegies! And if that's not bad enough now the commercial seed makers are genetically modifying those seeds. Just look what you are doing! By purchasing those vegies you are supporting the rapers, the destroyers of this planet. You are a slave of their slick advertising! You are enslaved body, soul and spirit to the machine!
So don't tell me about slavery, about harming of animals. Shame on you! If I were you I wouldn't eat any meat, fruit or vegies! And no milk either or eggs or Turkey for Thanksgiving! No ice cream or apple pie! No beer either. They enslave yeast for God knows how long to get it drunk on sugar to form the alcohol just so you can enjoy your enebriation!
Repent of your vegie eating! Repent of being enslaved to the agri machine!
Yours is a typical response. If you can't tell the difference between cutting your grass on a Saturday morning and this:
I was once as blind, so cannot judge - just inform.
In the mean time please seek out farmers who do their killing as humanely as possible (if you haven't already), since you sited that as a cure for abuse.
If you can't tell the difference between cutting your grass on a Saturday morning and this:
Brutality, ruthlessness, barbarity, inhumanity, an atrocity.
"Deliberate infliction of pain or suffering ruins the appetite."
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