Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
It's called the Trinity, but you don't believe it.
More specifically it is called the "Holy Trinity", but the problem with such a doctrine is that nowhere in Scripture from where we are to get our doctrine for reproof and correction and instruction in righteousness so that the man of Yahweh may be perfect and thoroughly furnished unto all righteous works is such a foolish, false, deceptive and demonic doctrine taught.
We also can become one with FATHER Yahweh and His SON Yahshua, but this does not make us "God" or FATHER Yahweh's SON Yahshua. Note what Yahshua said in communication ["prayer"] to his and our FATHER Yahweh WHO IS IN HEAVEN when he himself WAS HERE ON EARTH:
And the esteem which You gave me I have given them; that they may be one, EVEN AS WE ARE ONE: I in them, and You in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that You have sent me, and has loved them, as You have loved me (Yahchanan [John] 17: 22-23).
Yahshua here was speaking of our being united in agreement as one, not that he and our FATHER Yahweh are "one and the same being" as many of the Christian religion foolishly, falsely, and deceptively teach.
Note also in this verse Yahshua says that FATHER Yahweh had given him esteem. Yahshua did not give himself esteem! Yahshua also makes it known that his and our FATHER Yahweh sent him into the world. Yahshua did not send himself into the world. Yahshua also makes it known that FATHER has loved them, as FATHER Yahweh has loved His SON Yahshua. Yahshua was not saying that he loved himself! Yahshua also did not anoint himself as King and did not raise or redeem himself from the dead.
We also can become one with FATHER Yahweh and His SON Yahshua, but this does not make us "God" or FATHER Yahweh's SON Yahshua. Note what Yahshua said in communication ["prayer"] to his and our FATHER Yahweh WHO IS IN HEAVEN when he himself WAS HERE ON EARTH:
And the esteem which You gave me I have given them; that they may be one, EVEN AS WE ARE ONE: I in them, and You in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that You have sent me, and has loved them, as You have loved me (Yahchanan [John] 17: 22-23).
Yahshua here was speaking of our being united in agreement as one, not that they were "one and the same being" as many of the Christian religion foolishly, falsely, and deceptively teach.
Back this claim up with the Word. You need to do better than that.
Back this claim up with the Word. You need to do better than that.
I just did back this claim up with the word which is better than what you did with the foolish, false, deceptive, and demonic claim that you made, which you also in turn failed to back up with FATHER Yahweh's inspired prophetic word!
Luke 18: 18-19
Why do you call me good? That title only belongs to God (in other words, I am NOT God). Could Jesus have been any clearer? I don't think so...
Perhaps the reason Christ asked him that is because if he where to say that only because he saw Christ as a mere man then He would be wrong. Jesus is good as was evident and therefor God because only God is good.
The Jews knew full well that Jesus declared Himself to be God and therefor wanted to stone Him.
JN 10:33 "The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone You not; but for blasphemy; and because that You, being a man, make yourself God." He did say,
JN 8:58 "Before Abraham was, I am". A title only given to God.
Perhaps the reason Christ asked him that is because if he where to say that only because he saw Christ as a mere man then He would be wrong. Jesus is good as was evident and therefor God because only God is good.
The Jews knew full well that Jesus declared Himself to be God and therefor wanted to stone Him.
JN 10:33 "The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone You not; but for blasphemy; and because that You, being a man, make yourself God." He did say,
JN 8:58 "Before Abraham was, I am". A title only given to God.
Perhaps the reason Christ asked him that is because if he where to say that only because he saw Christ as a mere man then He would be wrong. Jesus is good as was evident and therefor God because only God is good.
The Jews knew full well that Jesus declared Himself to be God and therefor wanted to stone Him.
JN 10:33 "The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone You not; but for blasphemy; and because that You, being a man, make yourself God." He did say,
JN 8:58 "Before Abraham was, I am". A title only given to God.
In reference to what Yeshua said next quoting Psa. 82:6:
1. (plural) a. rulers, judges b. divine ones c. angels d. gods 2. (plural intensive - singular meaning) a. god, goddess b. godlike one c. works or special possessions of God d. the (true) God e. God
Theos also means magistrates or judges not just gods or God...Do you really think HaShem was calling them "gods" or was He calling them "judges or rulers"?...
Perhaps the reason Christ asked him that is because if he where to say that only because he saw Christ as a mere man then He would be wrong. Jesus is good as was evident and therefor God because only God is good.
The Jews knew full well that Jesus declared Himself to be God and therefor wanted to stone Him.
JN 10:33 "The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone You not; but for blasphemy; and because that You, being a man, make yourself God." He did say,
JN 8:58 "Before Abraham was, I am". A title only given to God.
No, not only Yahweh is righteous. FATHER Yahweh Himself proclaimed that others were righteous including His SON Yahshua:
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of Yahweh, you may receive what was promised. But THE RIGHTEOUS will live by faith. If he shrinks back, My soul has no pleasure in him (Hebrews 10:36-37).
Job and Yahshua the Messiah were both righteous suffering servants of Father Yahweh.
In the land of Uz there lived a man whose name was Job [Afflicted or Attacked]. This man was blameless and upright; he feared Yahweh and shunned evil (Job 1:1).
This is why "it was credited to him [Moshe] as righteousness" (Romans 4:22).
All Scripture is given by inspiration of Yahweh, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of Yahweh may be perfect, THROUGHLY FURNISHED unto all righteous works (2 Timothy 3:16-17).
Come now, and let us reason together, says Yahweh: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be [white] as wool. IF you are willing and obedient, you shall eat of the righteousness of the land: But if you refuse and rebel, you shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of Yahweh has spoken it (Isayah 1:18-20).
When one is washed clean of past sins by way of Yahshua's sacrifice, and by their turning in obedince to Father Yahweh's instruction [torah, "law"], they in turn are without sin. This is a great position to be in! One must heed the following warning if they choose to turn back to sin [being disobedient to Father Yahweh - 1 Yahchanan [John 3:4)]:
For if we sin [disobey Father Yahweh's instruction {torah, "law"}] WILFULLY after we have received the knowledge of the truth, THERE REMAINS NO MORE SACRIFICE FOR SIN, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the ADVERSARIES (Hebrews 10:26-27).
When one disobeys Father Yahweh's instruction [sins] after receiving the knowledge of the truth they are placed in the same position that Satan the ADVERSARY is placed in "because he knows that his time is short” (Revelation 12:12) and he has sinned from the very beginning.
He that commits sin IS OF THE DEVIL; for the devil sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the son of Yahweh was made known, that he might destroy the works of the devil {1 Yahchanan [John] 3:8}.
If one turns back to being in disobedience to Father Yahweh's instruction [torah, "law"], they in turn are letting Satan again take control of their lives by giving into the temptation of sin and they will be destroyed by fire with Satan.
As for the Jews knowing "full well that Jesus declared Himself to be God and therefor wanted to stone Him.", this is not true. TTheir agenda was to entrap Yahshua is his words so that they might arrest him. Their agenda was not to understand Yahshua. In fact, it is quite clear from their conversations with him that they had no understanding whatsoever of what he was saying.
The fact is, they falsely accused Yahshua of blasphemy by making himself out to be "God" just as they had falsely accused him of breaking the Sabbath. Yahshua never once proclaimed to them that he was "God"! What it was that he did proclaim to them is that he was the SON of FATHER Yahweh.
When Yahshua said "Before Abraham was, I am." he was not proclaiming to be "God" or that he pre-existed his birth as many Christian religions falsely proclaim. He was answering their question "Are you greater than our father Abraham?" He was simply proclaiming his pre-eminence over Abraham and all orther prophets. When Yahshua said "I am" he was referring to himself just as anyone else would say "I am ..." in reference to themselves.
Last edited by Frank4YAHWEH; 08-30-2013 at 08:26 AM..
For whatever reason (??) some insist on challenging every core position of scripture, ... while also trying the claim that THEY have and know the truth. --- One of those core positions is the deity of Christ --- in which God's Word is consistent throughout. A FEW examples are:
Jesus Reveals Himself and the Father as One John 14:6-10 -- 6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. 7 “If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him.” 8 Philip said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.”
9 Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works.
The fullness of the Godhead in Christ Col. 2:8-10 -- Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ. 9 For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily; 10 and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power.
Jesus declares Himself to be Messiah and Christ John 4:23-26 -- But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. 24 God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”
25 The woman said to Him, “I know that Messiah is coming” (who is called Christ). “When He comes, He will tell us all things.”
26 Jesus said to her, “I who speak to you am He.”
Jesus and God are One John 1:1-4 & John 1:14 -- 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. 4 In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend[a] it.
John 1:14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
Even Jesus' enemies knew he was declaring Himself to be equal with God John 5:17-19 -- 17 But Jesus answered them, “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.”
18 Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God. 19 Then Jesus answered and said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, but what He sees the Father do; for whatever He does, the Son also does in like manner.
The liar denies Jesus is the Christ ... and, as such, denies both the Father and the Son I John 2:21-23 -- I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. 22 Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist—denying the Father and the Son. 23 No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
