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Old 03-17-2011, 05:57 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
8,368 posts, read 9,094,262 times
Reputation: 12995

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Consequences.

Somewhere in the Bible it says that we will be held accountable if we teach that which is not true. But what of those who believe the false teaching and apply it to their lives?

Personally, I try to be careful about what I tell others about God, Christ and the consequences of not choosing Christ in this life. But what if I am wrong about my view that to say no to God and Christ in this lifeModerator cut: edit

What if the UR folk are right?

If my teaching has caused some to turn away from God out of rejecting Him. Rejecting a God who would cast those who say no thanks into a very bad place. What will be their (those who said no to God) fate? Well UR theology says they will be fine in the end-being reconcilled to God and all.

So I was wrong. Hey, no harm no fowl.

**********

Now let's say that one teaches that UR is true and if one says no thanks to Christ in this life, Moderator cut: Per Sticky, "hell" has been suspended temporarily All will be fine in time, regardless.

So due to UR teaching some will say: I can put off saying yes to Christ in this life (or at this time), because in the end I will be fine. No pressing need to become "saved" before I die. So the person dies before saying yes to Jesus.

Now what if UR theology is wrong. What will be the fate of those who failed to say yes to Christ in this life, because of what a UR person told them was the truth of the matter?

Makes me shudder to think.
***************
Now the questions to consider:

What do you think God will say to the ET guy for being wrong and teaching other so?

What do you think God will say to the UR guy for being wrong and teaching others so?

Food for thought.

Last edited by june 7th; 03-18-2011 at 07:37 AM..
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Old 03-17-2011, 06:20 PM
 
Location: Katonah, NY
21,199 posts, read 20,929,086 times
Reputation: 22134
The thing is - everyone seems to be fighting about the fate of the non-believers -as if you all have a say in whether or not we believe or not. I think that some of you think that the only reason that we don't believe is because we are afraid of the bad place, or we are afraid to change our lives - and that UR gives us an out and makes us feel better.

The fact is - those of us that do not believe - well, we just don't believe. I'm not an unbeliever because I think I'll eventually wind up with God in the end so it really doesn't matter anyway. I'm not an unbeliever because I love sinning so much and don't want to stop. I'm not an unbeliever because I don't want to believe in the bad place. I'm an unbeliever because I don't believe in the Biblical God. I don't believe in the Biblical heaven. I don't believe in the Biblical bad place. I don't believe the Bible is the truth. So - it really makes no difference what I hear - that I'm going to the bad place or that I'm going to the good place. It's sort of like me trying to tell you that if you don't accept the god of Heather and live by her rules in her book that you will have eternal pain and suffering after you die. Or that even if you don't accept the god Heather and live by his rules in her book - you will still be reunited with Heather. Does your decision to believe or not to believe in the god of Heather and the book of Heather stem from what people are telling you will happen to you after you die - or do you simply just not believe in the god of Heather - so it really doesn't matter.

You guys can fight like you want to all day long about who is right and who is wrong. Well, most unbelievers believe that you are both wrong. So what does it really matter?
As to what your God will say to you after you die - well, only your God knows. Maybe he'd just be happy if you quit judging each other and telling each other that your wrong. Maybe he'd be mad at all of you.
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Old 03-17-2011, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Florida
62,727 posts, read 34,194,977 times
Reputation: 10410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewdrop93 View Post
The thing is - everyone seems to be fighting about the fate of the non-believers -as if you all have a say in whether or not we believe or not. I think that some of you think that the only reason that we don't believe is because we are afraid of the bad place, or we are afraid to change our lives - and that UR gives us an out and makes us feel better.

The fact is - those of us that do not believe - well, we just don't believe. I'm not an unbeliever because I think I'll eventually wind up with God in the end so it really doesn't matter anyway. I'm not an unbeliever because I love sinning so much and don't want to stop. I'm not an unbeliever because I don't want to believe in the bad place. I'm an unbeliever because I don't believe in the Biblical God. I don't believe in the Biblical heaven. I don't believe in the Biblical bad place. I don't believe the Bible is the truth. So - it really makes no difference what I hear - that I'm going to the bad place or that I'm going to the good place. It's sort of like me trying to tell you that if you don't accept the god of Heather and live by her rules in her book that you will have eternal pain and suffering after you die. Or that even if you don't accept the god Heather and live by his rules in her book - you will still be reunited with Heather. Does your decision to believe or not to believe in the god of Heather and the book of Heather stem from what people are telling you will happen to you after you die - or do you simply just not believe in the god of Heather - so it really doesn't matter.

You guys can fight like you want to all day long about who is right and who is wrong. Well, most unbelievers believe that you are both wrong. So what does it really matter?
As to what your God will say to you after you die - well, only your God knows. Maybe he'd just be happy if you quit judging each other and telling each other that your wrong. Maybe he'd be mad at all of you.
You personally may not believe in God at all, but there are millions unsaved people who do believe that God exists, but simply have not come to Christ yet.
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Old 03-17-2011, 06:59 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
8,368 posts, read 9,094,262 times
Reputation: 12995
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewdrop93 View Post
You guys can fight like you want to all day long about who is right and who is wrong. Well, most unbelievers believe that you are both wrong. So what does it really matter?
1. If there is a God it matters

2. If there is no God it doesn't matter.

Thanks for your input.

Me? I don't visit the atheist section.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:03 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,826 posts, read 10,146,092 times
Reputation: 1306
Mr5150 ...God tells us

Ezekiel 3:18
When I say to a wicked man, ‘You will surely die,’ and you do not warn him or speak out to dissuade him from his evil ways in order to save his life, that wicked man will die for his sin, and I will hold you accountable for his blood."
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:10 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
6,370 posts, read 5,804,162 times
Reputation: 581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
Consequences.

Somewhere in the Bible it says that we will be held accountable if we teach that which is not true. But what of those who believe the false teaching and apply it to their lives?

Personally, I try to be careful about what I tell others about God, Christ and the consequences of not choosing Christ in this life. But what if I am wrong about my view that to say no to God and Christ in this life Moderator cut: orphaned

What if the UR folk are right?

If my teaching has caused some to turn away from God out of rejecting Him. Rejecting a God who would cast those who say no thanks into a very bad place. What will be their (those who said no to God) fate? Well UR theology says they will be fine in the end-being reconcilled to God and all.

So I was wrong. Hey, no harm no fowl.

**********

Now let's say that one teaches that UR is true and if one says no thanks to Christ in this life, Moderator cut: orphaned All will be fine in time, regardless.

So due to UR teaching some will say: I can put off saying yes to Christ in this life (or at this time), because in the end I will be fine. No pressing need to become "saved" before I die. So the person dies before saying yes to Jesus.

Now what if UR theology is wrong. What will be the fate of those who failed to say yes to Christ in this life, because of what a UR person told them was the truth of the matter?

Makes me shudder to think.
***************
Now the questions to consider:

What do you think God will say to the ET guy for being wrong and teaching other so?

What do you think God will say to the UR guy for being wrong and teaching others so?

Food for thought.
Good food for thought Mr5150. I believe God will eventually save everyone.

But consider this? If the Father can do nothing in vain then everyone He draws to His Son shall be saved. Now if nobody can come to the Son to be saved unless the Father draw them and we know that His drawing will not be in vain then the only way someone could really not be saved is if the Father never draws one to be saved.

Last edited by june 7th; 03-18-2011 at 07:40 AM..
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:19 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,415,421 times
Reputation: 807
I will agree with Dew here in that there is an awful lot of fighting about who is right like anyone can even know for sure. G-d is the only one who knows, not man. Those of us who have a faith tradition that is not Christian have been able to chose our way not out of fear but out of where our spiritual center is.

You lump all together in one group like a huge monolith and call us all the same thing. Not all of us are unbelievers we just are not Christian. But make no mistake we worship the same G-d you do.

The world is not full of folks that need to be harvested to your belief. We have seen the harm historically of the violence that comes from that mentality.

It would be such a peaceful world if Christians could just be happy in what they believe and let others follow their faith tradition. Let the world have their belief or non belief.

I really believe that anyone wanting to learn about Christianity would not be convinced by reading anything in this forum. I know when I read here it just makes me really happy that I am not Christian.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:25 PM
 
5,804 posts, read 4,776,111 times
Reputation: 4301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
What do you think God will say to the UR guy for being wrong and teaching others so?
In my opinion, He would have to say, "I'm sorry you thought so highly of me. I'm sorry that you believed love conquers all and that love never ends and that out of faith, hope and love, that love was the most important and that you believed that *I* was love. I'm sorry you believed those things but they were not actually true. I am sorry."

Dew... I'm not here talking about the "fate of non-believers" for the benefit of non-believers, I'm here for those who are trapped in Christianity and are hurting because they think that God is a being who would eternally torture His beings that He Himself created. You may not understand this torturous, sad, fear-filled reality that many many people live in as christians or those who are seeking God and are deathly afraid of Him. But it IS a reality. THOSE are the folks I think about when I'm posting.


I am not interested at ALL in "converting" "non-believers" (meaning those who reject the idea of a God). I think a lot of "non-believers" don't need any help at all. Many are following a beautiful path of love and I think they'll be pleasantly surprised someday. I think that one day, they will realize that all of the love in their heart ends up connecting to the source of it. As I've said before I don't believe God looks at labels, he looks at the heart. We're all His children. One day, we will all unite. And I believe people are on their own paths for a reason. We're learning. And I think one day we'll come together. Every life lived will teach us ALL something.

I'm only here for those who are hurting and looking for the way out of the maze. I'm trying to love my neighbor by reaching out and trying to show them there is another way. You don't have to be afraid of God. You don't have to think about your dead loved one and think that she is being tortured by the one who created us. Fear is the opposite of love. Fear leads to suffering. I don't like to see people suffer.

"Not all who wander are lost"
In other words, I don't sit around and worry about you or June, for example. You will know them by their fruit. You guys are pretty fruity. lol.

I do worry about those trapped in the web of fear and intimidation.

The OP actually doesn't make sense to me because I don't see this life as just some "choice of eternities" Life is far more complex and interesting and has a much higher purpose than something as neanderthalistic as that. (I'm pretty sure I made up that word.)


Peace,
sparrow
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:26 PM
 
Location: Somewhere
6,370 posts, read 5,804,162 times
Reputation: 581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
I will agree with Dew here in that there is an awful lot of fighting about who is right like anyone can even know for sure. G-d is the only one who knows, not man. Those of us who have a faith tradition that is not Christian have been able to chose our way not out of fear but out of where our spiritual center is.

You lump all together in one group like a huge monolith and call us all the same thing. Not all of us are unbelievers we just are not Christian. But make no mistake we worship the same G-d you do.

The world is not full of folks that need to be harvested to your belief. We have seen the harm historically of the violence that comes from that mentality.

It would be such a peaceful world if Christians could just be happy in what they believe and let others follow their faith tradition. Let the world have their belief or non belief.

I really believe that anyone wanting to learn about Christianity would not be convinced by reading anything in this forum. I know when I read here it just makes me really happy that I am not Christian.
I have been convinced in this forum about Christian doctrines or teachings of Christ. This forum does more than you think it does.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:32 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,415,421 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep View Post
I have been convinced in this forum about Christian doctrines or teachings of Christ. This forum does more than you think it does.
This forum has made me see for the first time how divided and hateful some Christians can be. My hope is that all who come here will turn and go the other direction and find a place to be spiritual that does not have the narrow view of spirituality that is found within Christianity. There is not just one way to G-d and those not following Jesus are not lost.
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