Why do we believe God is not able to save all those that are lost (history, Old Testament)

[Mike555]

Originally Posted by .sparrow.

I just read this somewhere and thought it was an interesting way to word it:

The FIRST death = Death IN Adam.
The SECOND death = Death TO Adam [our carnal nature].



It's a very deep and complex and beautiful thing if you ponder and meditate on it with the understanding of the magnificent power of God's love.

If it speaks to you, it speaks to you...
if it doesn't, it doesn't.
I'm confident it will speak to someone out there, though.

Just some thoughts,
peace,
sparrow

You would do better to read what God says the second death is.

Revelation 20:11 And I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. 12] And I saw the dead, the great and the small (all who died never having believed in Christ) standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. 13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds. 14] And death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15] And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

That is the second death. Being thrown into the lake of fire where those who rejected Christ will spend the eternal future in conscious torment both internal and external, in utter ruin and uselessness.

That is the word of God speaking. Why will you not listen to what God says?

[.sparrow.]

Originally Posted by Mike555

You would do better to read what God says the second death is.

Revelation 20:11 And I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. 12] And I saw the dead, the great and the small (all who died never having believed in Christ) standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. 13] And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds. 14] And death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15] And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

That is the second death. Being thrown into the lake of fire where those who rejected Christ will spend the eternal future in conscious torment both internal and external, in utter ruin and uselessness.

That is the word of God speaking. Why will you not listen to what God says?

What I posted and those bible verses go perfectly well together, as far as I see it. What I posted was something I thought was interesting. If you don't think so, move along and stop accusing others of not listening to God. God speaks to us in many ways and shows us things in many ways. Perhaps God is showing me something you never even thought of, Mike. Stop stifling conversations and growth.

Good bye.

[Mike555]

Originally Posted by .sparrow.

What I posted and those bible verses go perfectly well together, as far as I see it. What I posted was something I thought was interesting. If you don't think so, move along and stop accusing others of not listening to God. God speaks to us in many ways and shows us things in many ways. Perhaps God is showing me something you never even thought of, Mike. Stop stifling conversations and growth.

Good bye.

If you believe that the second death is anything other than eternity in the lake of fire, then you are not listening to God. That is not an accusation. That is fact. The fact that you don't like being told that is irrelevant. And now that I've said it, I Will move along.

[.sparrow.]

Originally Posted by Mike555

If you believe that the second death is anything other than eternity in the lake of fire, then you are not listening to God. That is not an accusation. That is fact. The fact that you don't like being told that is irrelevant. And now that I've said it, I Will move along.

You said:

"the fact that you don't like being told that...."

You claim to state facts in all of your posts... I don't think you understand what is FACT and what is OPINION.

Learn the difference, Mike.

[RobinD69]

Read the book of Jude, then read it again, and again and you might realize that there are some that are not of mankind. They are animals living by emotion and instinct and can pretend rather well.

Jude 1:6 What are their darkness and chains?

Read and see it is not what you think it is far much more, open your eyes to the light and free yourself from self imposed chains. They chose their chains and darkness and they want more to join them. They are never satisfied and never will be. Are you going to join them or are you going to break the chains and enter the light?

Read the words of Christ and stop twisting and turning to satisfy the flesh.

Yes all will be saved but not all are man and they trap man in false chains and lead man into false darkness.

[Ilene Wright]

Originally Posted by RobinD69

Yes all will be saved but not all are man and they trap man in false chains and lead man into false darkness.

You'll have to explain this Robin, the whole statement doesn't make any sense to me. Are you now saying you believe all mankind will be saved?

[RobinD69]

Originally Posted by Ilene Wright

You'll have to explain this Robin, the whole statement doesn't make any sense to me. Are you now saying you believe all mankind will be saved?

Yes and no. All will be saved but not all are mankind. Powers and principalities, Nephilem, they are among us and look just like you and I and they pervert everything while acting like they are holy or knowledgable, they know the word of God better than any human even the scholars.

[Jerwade]

If man had eternal life that would make him God; having no beginning or end.
In other words, you would be eternal and immortal for "surely you will not die."

It is impossible to quench the fire that consumes, unmeritorious pride.

[sschulz]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

Thats not what my Bible tells us. Daniel 12:2

And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

EVERLASTING CONTEMPT- Does not allow much room for being cleansed, repenting, or change.

Hey Campbell34 The correct translation is to life, age-during, and some to shame and contempt, age-during. It is during the reign of Jesus that this occurred and at the end when Jesus turns everything over to God who will be all in all everyone else will be judged, repent, and cleansed and made into the image of God.

People will always argue about eternal versus age-during, in these types of versus but I believe age-during is proper for many reasons that make eternal not fit, quick example, "forever and ever" if forever is forever what is the second ever?

[sschulz]

Originally Posted by Mike555

If you believe that the second death is anything other than eternity in the lake of fire, then you are not listening to God. That is not an accusation. That is fact. The fact that you don't like being told that is irrelevant. And now that I've said it, I Will move along.

Hey Mike

Did not read the whole thing between you and .sparrow but I agree the lake of fire is the second death but remember Christ will defeat the last enemy which is death. So if the lake of fire is the second death, and it is, that it can not last forever or Christ never defeats it so he can't turn it over to the Father to be all in all. The lake of fire will serve its purpose and when all the fuel( carnality) is gone it will go out. (spirit)