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Latching on to one meaning for one biblical symbol is flawed scholarship since context varies and context determines how any specific symbol is being used at the particular time it was written.
To be honest, such a flagrantly flawed modus-operandi always conveys a low opinion that the interpreter of the symbol has for what he is reading or else a mental laziness or lack of interest caused by that low opinion.
After all, if one considers what one reads essentially drivel-then of course why should one care how any particular symbol varies in meaning? Just give it one meaning that fits in with the obsessive denigrating agenda and voila! Ready to go!
BTW
The above is in reference to those attempting to see fire as indicative of the tortures of a hell all the time.
Originally Posted by Eusebius Being perished is necessary to salvation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150
More, strange UR teachings? A trick to negate what Jesus stated in John 3:16 about having eternal life instead of perishing?
Not what my Bible says.
How about it? Explain.
Dear Mr5150, do you believe Jesus? I trust you do and trust you would not want to dishonor Him in any way.
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost G622 sheep of the house of Israel.
G622
apollumi
ap-ol'-loo-mee
From G575 and the base of G3639; to destroy fully (reflexively to perish, or lose), literally or figuratively: - destroy, die, lose, mar, perish.
Strong's Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries
The same Greek word is used for "lost" and "destroy" and "perish". So Jesus was sent unto the "lost" or "perished" or "destroyed" sheep of the house of Israel to seek and to save them.
Luk_15:4 What man of you, having a hundred sheep, and losing one of them, is not leaving the ninety-nine in the wilderness and is going after the lost G622 one, till he may be finding it?
Luk 15:6 ". . . 'Rejoice together with me that I found my sheep that was lost G622!'"
Mat_10:6 Yet be going rather to the lost G622 sheep of the house of Israel.
So being destroyed, or perished is necessary to being saved.
Dear Mr5150, do you believe Jesus? I trust you do and trust you would not want to dishonor Him in any way.
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost G622 sheep of the house of Israel.
G622
apollumi
ap-ol'-loo-mee
From G575 and the base of G3639; to destroy fully (reflexively to perish, or lose), literally or figuratively: - destroy, die, lose, mar, perish.
Strong's Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries
The same Greek word is used for "lost" and "destroy" and "perish". So Jesus was sent unto the "lost" or "perished" or "destroyed" sheep of the house of Israel to seek and to save them.
Luk_15:4 What man of you, having a hundred sheep, and losing one of them, is not leaving the ninety-nine in the wilderness and is going after the lost G622 one, till he may be finding it?
Luk 15:6 ". . . 'Rejoice together with me that I found my sheep that was lost G622!'"
Mat_10:6 Yet be going rather to the lost G622 sheep of the house of Israel.
So being destroyed, or perished is necessary to being saved.
The KJV New Testament Greek Lexicon
Strong's Number: 622 Original WordWord Originajpovllumifrom (575) and the base of (3639)Transliterated WordTDNT EntryApollumi1:394,67Phonetic SpellingParts of Speechap-ol'-loo-mee Verb Definition
to destroy
to put out of the way entirely, abolish, put an end to ruin
render useless
to kill
to declare that one must be put to death
metaph. to devote or give over to eternal misery in hell
to perish, to be lost, ruined, destroyed
to destroy
to lose
King James Word Usage - Total: 92: perish 33, destroy 26, lose 22, be lost 5, lost 4, miscellaneous 2
Eus... How do you reconcile the OP with what Paul said in Hebrews 9:28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.
If Christ has not returned... How is anyone saved yet?
katjonjj
Heb 9:28 thus Christ also, being offered once for the bearing of the sins of many, will be seen a
second time, by those awaiting Him, apart from sin, for salvation, through faith."
He will be seen a second time. Those **Hebrews** that that letter was
written to will be the ones awaiting for Him while in the future great
tribulation A.K.A. Jacob's sorrow. Within that tribulation He will return and
save them from that persecution.
Strong's Number: 622 Original WordWord Originajpovllumifrom (575) and the base of (3639)Transliterated WordTDNT EntryApollumi1:394,67Phonetic SpellingParts of Speechap-ol'-loo-mee Verb Definition
to destroy
to put out of the way entirely, abolish, put an end to ruin
render useless
to kill
to declare that one must be put to death
metaph. to devote or give over to eternal misery in hell
to perish, to be lost, ruined, destroyed
to destroy
to lose
King James Word Usage - Total: 92: perish 33, destroy 26, lose 22, be lost 5, lost 4, miscellaneous 2
But you said that if one does not believe in Jesus they will "perish." You even quoted a verse as to that and the Greek word behind "perish" is apollumi. Both "perish" and "destroy" use apollumi. So the same root idea in inherrent in both words.
And since Jesus came to save the destroyed sheep of the house of Israel, no one can be so destroyed that they cannot be saved. Do you understand this concept?
Even Jesus told the disciples that if they *destroyed* their souls they would get them back. So destruction is a necessary precursor to salvation just as being a sinner is necessary to being saved. One cannot be saved from sin and death if one is not a sinner. One cannot be saved from destruction if one is not destroyed. You dig?
But you said that if one does not believe in Jesus they will "perish." You even quoted a verse as to that and the Greek word behind "perish" is apollumi. Both "perish" and "destroy" use apollumi. So the same root idea in inherrent in both words.
And since Jesus came to save the destroyed sheep of the house of Israel, no one can be so destroyed that they cannot be saved. Do you understand this concept?
Even Jesus told the disciples that if they *destroyed* their souls they would get them back. So destruction is a necessary precursor to salvation just as being a sinner is necessary to being saved. One cannot be saved from sin and death if one is not a sinner. One cannot be saved from destruction if one is not destroyed. You dig?
I'll play.
But it doesn't negate the fact that one must accept Jesus to be saved.
*******************
that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
that whoever believes in Him should not be destroyed but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not be destroyed but have everlasting life.
that whoever believes in Him should not be lost but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not lost but have everlasting life.
**************
No matter how you slice it or mistranslated it the fact remains you either get eternal life thru Jesus or you end up lost, destroyed and/or perished. You don't get saved by being lost, perished or destroyed. you get lost, perished or destroyed if you don't believe in Jesus.
katjonjj
Heb 9:28 thus Christ also, being offered once for the bearing of the sins of many, will be seen a
second time, by those awaiting Him, apart from sin, for salvation, through faith."
He will be seen a second time. Those **Hebrews** that that letter was
written to will be the ones awaiting for Him while in the future great
tribulation A.K.A. Jacob's sorrow. Within that tribulation He will return and
save them from that persecution.
Those **Hebrews** are all long dead.... What exactly do you mean?
I'm looking forward to the continuation of having the dross removed.
In other words, "to hell with me".
He is a refiner, and I trust Him.
I know that He loves me, and His judgements of me will be rooted in love.
I have absolute trust in HIM. He created me. He subjected me to this contrast of love and non-love for a reason. I know He will do the right thing and see me through...
God is love.
LOVE created me.
What a thought...!
peace,
sparrow
Absolutely, .sparrow. For those who seek to be 100% stain-free before the Lord, if they are carrying some baggage into the next world (and if we retain our memories of the former life, it seems we could since no one escapes this life unscathed) then being tried by fire to rid us of the remaining dross would be a small price to pay in comparison with what Jesus endured for us.
One of the worst ways to offend a "Christian" is to tell him that everyone is going to heaven. No way! That's not "fair!" Then what's the use of being a Christian?!?
But the scriptures are clear: Jesus is the Last ADAM. All mankind was put into Adam 1's sin. NOW, A-L-L mankind has been put into Adam 2's righteousness! (read Romans 5)
This is the basis for salvation.
Not that we did anything of our own; but when we were without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
There is no way to be Godly outside of Christ! Can you believe that? Can you believe that there is NOTHING you can do to go to heaven??
So, if you can believe that, then you must understand that the gift of salvation is TO ALL MEN. We have borne the earthly image (adam 1), and so we shall all also bear the heavenly image (adam 2, Christ!).
All mankind into Adam's sin.
All mankind into Christ's righteousness.
Plain as paper.
Blessings to all, in Christ our Lord!
Brian
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More, strange UR teachings? A trick to negate what Jesus stated in John 3:16 about having eternal life instead of perishing?
That's not "fair!" 
