Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I know this might be hard for one who admits being on the wrong side of the truth to understand....
But from the approx time that occurred in heaven between Genesis 1:31 when "all is good" and "the war in heaven" Revelation 12:7-8... God's demeanor changed toward those who question God's sovereignty.
Hell was not a product originally created out of love.
Physical death is not a result of love.
Being Satan is a spirit..spiritual death is not result of love.
Being that human is physical and has a soul... physical and spiritual death is not a product of love.
So unlike your master words...mine said: Matthew 10:28
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
Amen !! I knew you would come through.....
No, in all seriousness God is faithful in giving the righteous His wisdom and the courage to always speak lovingly the truth to shine LIFE upon the darkness, exposing the lie of the anti-christ message !!
It is always the anti-christ messenger who comes to kill, steal, and destroy the message of God's truth, diverting the truth using instruments of darkness such as sarcasms, bashing, ridiculing people like we see so often...... by which is a big RED FLAG that the messenger is not of God or the truth !!
Amen !! I knew you would come through.....
No, in all seriousness God is faithful in giving the righteous His wisdom and the courage to always speak lovingly the truth to shine LIFE upon the darkness, exposing the lie of the anti-christ message !!
It is always the anti-christ messenger who comes to kill, steal, and destroy the message of God's truth, diverting the truth using instruments of darkness such as sarcasms, bashing, ridiculing people like we see so often...... by which is a big RED FLAG that the messenger is not of God or the truth !!
It's getting intellectually embarrassing when people resort to sarcasm by claiming that I have followers or I'm the absolute truth... when all I do is repeat the words spoken by The absolute truth.
Their frustration is our power... God's Holy Word.
God's word is a double edge sword for a reason. John 3:16, John 3:36
It's getting intellectually embarrassing when people resort to sarcasm by claiming that I have followers or I'm the absolute truth... when all I do is repeat the words spoken by The absolute truth.
Their frustration is our power... God's Holy Word.
God's word is a double edge sword for a reason. John 3:16, John 3:36
I'd be embarrassed too if I needed someone else to take 4 or 5 paragraphs to explain the statement you made.....
"Sin changed Gods nature" to mean that Gods nature did not change.
1Jn 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
Mal 3:6 For I [am] the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
If God is LOVE, and he changes not, then he has always been love and no interpetation can really alter this idea. However you want to look at what God has had to do to man or for man or whatever his plans are, whether they can be altered by man or not. The nature of God does not change.
Dt 7:7 The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye [were] the fewest of all people:
If there is an absolute truth to LOVE, then God is that absolute truth, even in old testament, there are many instances of LOVE by God. If that LOVE is absolute in truth, then there was NO CHANGE in the nature of it, or it could not be absolute.
It's getting intellectually embarrassing when people resort to sarcasm by claiming that I have followers or I'm the absolute truth... when all I do is repeat the words spoken by The absolute truth.
Their frustration is our power... God's Holy Word.
God's word is a double edge sword for a reason. John 3:16, John 3:36
Actually, the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword.
Piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit.
And able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
But there are those who do not get it – missing the whole point.
Man’s beliefs are Syncretistic, just ask those who believe others are suffering in Hades without them even having a thought!
Romans 3:13 There throat is an open grave, with their tongues they keep deceiving; and the poison of Asps (snakes) is under their lips.
Speaking of that....
I've heard of ETers who say no one is in hell but only sleeping, but for those who believe resurrection takes place immediately, how do you cope with millions of people burning eternally right now.
The thought of it makes me cringe. I would give my one soul for those millions not to suffer... Can I? I don't know but that is what Jesus is said to accomplish yet still millions are suffering in hell according to ETers.
If a human burning forever doesn't make you feel sympathy, if not empathy, for those people then one has to wonder... That's not love.
No greater love is it than to give your life for another.. Yet in a poll on this very forum Christians said they wouldn't give up their time with god to save humans in hell.
I find that Antichrist as christ is said to have given his life (greatest show of love) so that others could have life more abundant.
So if Jesus carried the sins of all people, why do some (unbelievers) still have sin to carry?
What is so special about professing a specific belief?
How is that honorable over the other belief?
Christ preached love over sacrifice, love over law, loving like children. if not, wrath (70AD Destruction of the Temple) would come to them.
Love is the part of Christ that resonated and was one with god.
Love one another as I have loved you.
Antichrist messages tell others that if you love, you don't know god. That if you don't love yet say a few words, you know god...
I've heard of ETers who say no one is in hell but only sleeping, but for those who believe resurrection takes place immediately, how do you cope with millions of people burning eternally right now.
The thought of it makes me cringe. I would give my one soul for those millions not to suffer... Can I? I don't know but that is what Jesus is said to accomplish yet still millions are suffering in hell according to ETers.
If a human burning forever doesn't make you feel sympathy, if not empathy, for those people then one has to wonder... That's not love.
No greater love is it than to give your life for another.. Yet in a poll on this very forum Christians said they wouldn't give up their time with god to save humans in hell.
I find that Antichrist as christ is said to have given his life (greatest show of love) so that others could have life more abundant.
So if Jesus carried the sins of all people, why do some (unbelievers) still have sin to carry?
What is so special about professing a specific belief?
How is that honorable over the other belief?
Christ preached love over sacrifice, love over law, loving like children. if not, wrath (70AD Destruction of the Temple) would come to them.
Love is the part of Christ that resonated and was one with god.
Love one another as I have loved you.
Antichrist messages tell others that if you love, you don't know god. That if you don't love yet say a few words, you know god...
That is Anti-Christ.
Of course. The true gospel is NOT something we must hide from children until they are "old enough" to deal with it mentally. ET is by far the most Satanic doctrine ever created by man. I think that the Revelation and Explosion of UR teaching and preaching is the ultimate war on TERROR. That's what I believe.
that there was the war in heaven Rev 12:7-8
Satan was thrown down to earth Rev 12:9
Satan leads the whole world astray Rev 12:9
"woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has gone down to you! He is filled with fury" Rev 12:12
Who's perspective was correct when Satan said “You will not surely die"
What do you think the word "woe" means? ..... you think it was a slang "woe ... I really love this and that!"
Psalm 32:10Many are the woes of the wicked, but the LORD’s unfailing love surrounds the man who trusts in him
Isaiah 5:11Woe to those who rise early in the morning to run after their drinks, who stay up late at night till they are inflamed with wine.
So what "woe" will face those in Isaiah 5:11 "The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God." Galatians 5:19
Proof is that God doesn't say
all who live like this will inherit ..eventually. Woe...I really love how people live like this, I'll show those fundies just how duped they are....they'll inherit anyway. hahahahaha !!!
Twin, all any of that is proof of is something on which we all agree. That God does not smile and ignore sin/non-LOVE and pretend it's not there. When we do not act in ways that are in line with LOVE, with God's nature, we are out of harmony with the One who is the very fabric of our existence and there are natural consequences that are anything but pleasant: woe.
Because God IS LOVE and can never be changed by sin, nor by us, God continues to be LOVE and how could LOVE, which never fails, ever be content to see those whom he loves stuck forever in NON-love? The only way that could happen is if God doesn't have the power to do anything about it ... do you think that is the case?!!
And if you read my posts at all, you know that I have already addressed the idea of "inheriting the kingdom". No URist says anyone who is practicing non-LOVE is going to inherit the kingdom. So, in that regard, we all agree. Can you see that?
Quote:
God is no human parent...he is a just God that is very angry about sin and those who reject his plan. He will not tolerate alternative plans or exceptions. That is why he is just and does tolerate people making exceptions to his justness or to what pleases him.
ABSOLUTELY, NO ALTERNATIVE PLANS. God's plan is that ALL will be reconciled to LOVE/HIMSELF through Christ. Nobody would be left to wallow in sin and non-love forever. GOD would never tolerate it. It's unconscionable to even THINK that the God who IS LOVE (and just) would make ANY EXCEPTIONS! If he did, that would mean that his nature had changed, and we know that God doesn't change.
Quote:
It's really does sadden me that you believe that when Jesus speaks to those on his left (after being gathered and separated by the angels per God's loud command) that you actually fallen for the anti-christ alternative that unbelieving people (some of those people mentioned in Galatians 5:19) will have the power to move to the right of Jesus.
It's too bad that you have fallen for the perspective argument that those on the left of Jesus will not obey the command to depart from him.
Twin, there's no reason for you to be sad about something I do NOT believe. I believe that NO ONE has the power to "move to the right" except by the Spirit of Christ. Not you nor I, nor anyone else. Wouldn't you agree?
I do not ignore it..... it's the end clause in their proclamation of the truth of God's word..... that ALL will be saved.... especially the part after they die factor in that they will go through this punishing, refining period till they turn to God..... that is a lie from the pit of hell !
For the simple reason....The Holy Spirit reveals.....
"For there is no mention of You in death; in Sheol who will give You thanks?(Ps.6:5)....
"The heavens are the heavens of the LORD, but the earth He has given to the sons of men. The dead do not praise the LORD, nor do any who go down into silence; but as for us, we will bless the LORD from this time forth and forever. Praise the LORD ! (Ps.115:16-18)
We continue AS the Holy Spirit of God is manifesting His truth that......
“Sheol cannot thank You, death cannot praise You; those who go down to the pit cannot hope for Your faithfulness.“ It is the living who give thanks to You.(Ps.38:18-19)....
Ah, the dead can not communicate, nor can they praise the Lord, nor see His faithfulness, nor thank Him, there is no hope in Sheol for the salvation through Jesus Christ.... yet, the false teachers are saying there is salvation after death.....
No, people this is not truth..... for the dead can not speak, nor hear, therefore the dead can not seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness after death.... !!
It is so important to hear and listen how God is revealing to YOU today, do not hardened your heart against Him, as It is written...
"now once at the consummation of the ages Jesus has been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment, so Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time for salvation without reference to sin, to those who eagerly await Him." (Heb.9:26-28)
God is warning the brethren also.....
"Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God. But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end,(Heb.3:12-14)
IPeter 4:17-19 17 For it is time for judgment to begin with the household of God; and if it begins with us first, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God? 18 AND IF IT IS WITH DIFFICULTY THAT THE RIGHTEOUS IS SAVED, WHAT WILL BECOME OF THE GODLESS MAN AND THE SINNER? 19 Therefore, those also who suffer according to the will of God shall entrust their souls to a faithful Creator in doing what is right.
IIThess.1:4-12
4 Therefore, we ourselves speak proudly of you among the churches of God for your perseverance and faith in the midst of all your persecutions and afflictions which you endure.
5 This is a plain indication of God’s righteous judgment so that you will be considered worthy of the kingdom of God, for which indeed you are suffering.
6 For after all it is only just for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you,
7 and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8 dealing out retribution(justice) to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day, and to be marveled at among all who have believed—for our testimony to you was believed.
11 To this end also we pray for you always, that our God will count you worthy of your calling, and fulfill every desire for goodness and the work of faith with power,
12 so that the name of our Lord Jesus will be glorified in you, and you in Him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.
2 Peter 3:7 But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
And YES, people do need to be changed/repent from sin/darkness NOW in this life to Life through Christ, He is the ONLY way, truth and life and no ONE comes to the Father but through Him ONLY !!
Once one dies it is over, done with, no turning back, can't change.....
The heart/life is set for it's destiny at death.... then the judgment comes, the options now are choosing eternal life or eternal damnation, what will it be ???
PS, no cotton in the ear's.... I hear, TRUTH is facing and living in God's reality, trusting God no matter what my flesh wants or says and I have been given the reality to live in His truth which shines the light on the darkness exposing those who would bring a different gospel, different Jesus, you know that old lie "eat, you will not die" of the false teachers been around along time !!!
Sad, though many are falling for it !!!
Cyber, I appreciate the time you took to craft your response. But you do realize that absolutely nothing you said answered the question which I asked you nor refutes the statement I made, right? Read it again:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pleroo
Why is it that you ignore the fact that Christian Universalists agree that sin needs a remedy? No CU says people don't need to be changed through Christ. They just believe it WILL happen for all, while you do not.
Christian Universalists agree that sin needs a remedy and that people must be changed through Christ. Do you understand that?
The CU believes that God promises that this WILL happen for all, while what you posted simply confirms that YOU DO NOT believe it. So, you can stop making the claim that CU's ignore the problem of sin, because it is not true and when you continue to say it is it simply shows you either are not paying attention (you have cotton in your ears ) or you are being disingenuous.
And then you can focus on arguing the real crux of your issue with CU (which you touched on in your post): why you believe that OUR physical death prevents God from accomplishing complete victory over sin and death for all, and why God will only accomplish a partial victory by overcoming those things for a small fraction of humanity.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
) or you are being disingenuous. 
