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SO IT'S BACK TO THE "OUR GREEK SCHOLARS VERSUS YOURS" STALEMATE
Fifteen literally translated (not interpretively translated) Bibles that reveal what God will do with the sinners in Matthew 25:41&46
Concordant Literal, Young’s literal, Wilson’s Emphatic Diaglott, Rotherham’s Emphasized, Scarlett’s, J.W. Hanson’s New Covenant, Twentieth Century, Ferrar Fenton, The Western New Testament, Weymouth’s (unedited), Clementson’s, The New Testament of our Lord and Savior Jesus Anointed, The Restoration of Original Sacred Name Bible, Bullinger’s Companion Bible margins, Jonathan Mitchell’s translation (2010)
Greek scholar William Barclay wrote concerning kolasis aionion (age-during corrective chastisement) in Matthew 25:41&46
"The Greek word for punishment is kolasis, which was not originally an ethical word at all. It originally meant the pruning of trees to make them grow better. There is no instance in Greek secular literature where kolasis does not mean remedial punishment. It is a simple fact that in Greek kolasis always means remedial punishment. God's punishment is always for man's cure."
See what other Greek scholars say about it too. Chapter Eleven
This is from Young's Literal translation:
Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also to those on the left hand, Go ye from me, the cursed, to the fire, the age-during, that hath been prepared for the Devil and his messengers;
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life age-during.'
So, I guess you are saying that even the devil and his angels are going to be saved and return to heaven?....AND we are not to receive eternal life, rather it is for a short time?....
G166
αιώνιος
aiōnios
ahee-o'-nee-os
From G165; perpetual (also used of past time, or past and future as well): - eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began).
G165
αιών
aiōn
ahee-ohn'
From the same as G104; properly an age; by extension perpetuity (also past);
Now here is the modern greek:
αιών = Centuries (relitive brief time periods)
αιώνιος = Everlasting (perpetual, never ending)
Next you are going to tell me that YOUR GREEK SCHOLARS know the Greek language better than the natives, aren't you?...
the reason there are two different words coming from the same root of time expression is because there are two different meanings to the two words, otherwise the same word would have been used...
κόλασις = Hell in modern Greek
κολάζω = To Chasten in modern Greek
G3811
παιδεύω
paideuō
pahee-dyoo'-o
From G3816; to train up a child, that is, educate, or (by implication) discipline (by punishment): - chasten (-ise), instruct, learn, teach.
παίδευση = to punish in modern Greek
If it is the fact for punishment to be for an age as you say then why is the Greek word παιδεύω or κολάζω not used instead of κόλασις?
Last edited by Richard1965; 09-11-2011 at 08:44 AM..
Do you believe God has the power to save everyone?
Do you believe God created some people for the very purpose to eternally torment them?
Rom 9:22 But if God, desiring to demonstrate His wrath, and to make His power known, endured in much long-suffering vessels of wrath having been fitted out for destruction,
Rom 9:23 and that He make known the riches of His glory on vessels of mercy which He before prepared for glory,
Rom 9:24 whom He also called, not only us, of Jews, but also out of nations.
Mat 10:28 AndG2532 fearG5399 notG3361 (G575) them which killG615 theG3588 body,G4983 butG1161 are notG3361 ableG1410 to killG615 theG3588 soul:G5590 butG1161 ratherG3123 fearG5399 him which is ableG1410 to destroyG622 bothG2532 soulG5590 andG2532 bodyG4983 inG1722 hell.G1067
G5399
φοβέω
phobeō
fob-eh'-o
From G5401; to frighten, that is, (passively) to be alarmed; by analogy to be in awe of, that is, revere: - be (+ sore) afraid, fear (exceedingly), reverence.
G622
ἀπόλλυμι
apollumi
ap-ol'-loo-mee
From G575 and the base of G3639; to destroy fully (reflexively to perish, or lose), literally or figuratively: - destroy, die, lose, mar, perish.
G5590
ψυχή
psuchē
psoo-khay'
From G5594; breath, that is, (by implication) spirit, abstractly or concretely (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from G4151, which is the rational and immortal soul; and on the other from G2222, which is mere vitality, even of plants: these terms thus exactly correspond respectively to the Hebrew [H5315], [H7307] and [H2416]: - heart (+ -ily), life, mind, soul, + us, + you.
G4983
σῶμα
sōma
so'-mah
From G4982; the body (as a sound whole), used in a very wide application, literally or figuratively: - bodily, body, slave.
G1067
γέεννα
geenna
gheh'-en-nah
Of Hebrew origin ([H1516] and [H2011]); valley of (the son of) Hinnom; gehenna (or Ge-Hinnom), a valley of Jerusalem, used (figuratively) as a name for the place (or state) of everlasting punishment: - hell.
Quoting Strongs is useless. All it does is record how words were translated in the KJV.
Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
You are wrong Richard. This is from Young's Literal translation:
Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into the fire age-during, prepared for the devil and his angels:
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into punishment age-during: but the righteous into life age-during.
While the first fruits of election, the remnant chosen by grace out of each generation are enjoying age-during (eonian) life, the unrighteous will experience age-during corrective chastisement (kolasis aionion).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965
So, I guess you are saying that even the devil and his angels are going to be saved and return to heaven?....
Yes, that is correct. Col. 1:20
En excellent Biblical exposition on that subject can be read here. RECONCILIATION IN THE HEAVENS Reconciliation in the Heavens
Rom 9:22 But if God, desiring to demonstrate His wrath, and to make His power known, endured in much long-suffering vessels of wrath having been fitted out for destruction,
Rom 9:23 and that He make known the riches of His glory on vessels of mercy which He before prepared for glory,
Rom 9:24 whom He also called, not only us, of Jews, but also out of nations.
Many don’t realize the very ones Christ came to save are the destroyed ones!
“For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was apollumi.” Lu. 19:10
Popular theology claims that God is able to do all things except restore the destroyed for whom Christ died.
Whenever you see Jesus use a word such as “perish” or “destroy,” the original word is “apollumi.” The Greek word “apollumi” means to “to lose, or to be lost.
Everyone will stay in a lost condition until Jesus rescues them. And sooner or later He will rescue them all, for God will have all men to be saved, each one in their own order.
Like I said, my Greek scholars versus yours.
That is why the ET/UR debate will never be resolved.
Fifteen literally translated (not interpretively translated) Bibles that reveal what God will do with the sinners in Matthew 25:41&46
Concordant Literal, Young’s literal, Wilson’s Emphatic Diaglott, Rotherham’s Emphasized, Scarlett’s, J.W. Hanson’s New Covenant, Twentieth Century, Ferrar Fenton, The Western New Testament, Weymouth’s (unedited), Clementson’s, The New Testament of our Lord and Savior Jesus Anointed, The Restoration of Original Sacred Name Bible, Bullinger’s Companion Bible margins, Jonathan Mitchell’s translation (2010).
Greek scholar William Barclay wrote concerning kolasis aionion (age-during corrective chastisement) in Matthew 25:41&46
"The Greek word for punishment is kolasis, which was not originally an ethical word at all. It originally meant the pruning of trees to make them grow better. There is no instance in Greek secular literature where kolasis does not mean remedial punishment. It is a simple fact that in Greek kolasis always means remedial punishment. God's punishment is always for man's cure."
See what other Greek scholars say about it too. AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS Chapter Eleven
'By your words you'll be forgiven or by your words you'll be condemned".
'Not everyone who cries Lord ,Lord to me will be saved but only those that do the will of my heavenly Father."
No one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born from above.
Truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you. If anyone hears my words and does not keep them, I do not condemn him, for I did not come to condemn the world but to save it. Whoever rejects me and does not accept my words he already has his judge namely the words I‘ve spoken that’s what will condemn him on the last day, because I did not speak on my own, but the Lord who sent me commanded me what to say and speak. And since I know that his commandment means eternal life. What I say is spoken just as he instructed me.
I know the lord and I keep His word.
Last edited by Miss Blue; 09-11-2011 at 01:39 PM..
Reason: sorry red font is reserved for moderation
Sooner or later everyone will do the will of our heavenly Father.
Sonner or later everyone will be born from above.
Sooner or later everyone will have life within them.
Sooner or later everyone will keep the words of Jesus.
But some will be condemned to kolasis aionion (age-during corrective chastisement) after which everyone will be saved.
We know this because "God will have all men to be saved." 1Tim. 2:4
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Quoting Strongs is useless.
This is from Young's Literal translation
Literal translation – age-during corrective chastisement
