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Old 10-12-2011, 07:19 PM
 
Location: On the Edge of the Fringe
7,571 posts, read 6,029,378 times
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To the OP Yes the "truth" has set me free. Free from the Bondage of religions, of superstitions, of all levels of garbage that cloud the mind and bring about all types of distress.
I have found true knowledge (gnosis) that does not need to be packaged and sold, that does not require a ritual or a justification. It simply is.
I am free from the mythology of heaven and hell, for these are not real places. I guess when I learned the "truth" about these man-made concepts , I started feeling a lot more free. I am free of the myth of sin for as a human being I can see that this too is a man made religious concept which I choose not to endorse.
I am free from bondage of some old book, one that was never written by some diety as some claimed. For I know better than that too.
I can embrace reality, I can focus on happiness and living this life to the fullest. I can be morally superior without religious doctrine, out of reason and enlightenment. Is that freedom enough ?

ChristyGirl pointed out
True individual freedom is achieved, in my opinion, when we can accept this, be compassionate, be tolerant, be loving, and allow other individuals to find their own truth without ramming our truth down their throats and condemning them for not believing in it.

Good point. I cannot give anyone, religious or otherwise, any freedom or truth other than what I can place into language. By language, I am limited. But I am saying to look at my example, and see that as a loving and tolerant person I am also free from the illusion of sin, free from the bondage of superstition, and grounded , hopefully, in the reality of the here and now, which, last time I checked, was real. That is measurable and definite.

In an X FACTOR type of mentality, saying "The truth is out there" I ask , truth about what? If one talks about spiritual freedom, the clearly the Gnostic Christian and Buddhist paths can allow someone to gain that sense of a spiritual knowledge, but only after much soul searching and years of practice. That is not something that can be packaged and sold though. To find a packaged religion, a book of answers for example, one is only taking secondhand teaching which may or may not be useful. Fine if someone wants to live through someone else's concept of truth, but true knowledge, the kind that "sets you free" from the bondage of myth and superstition, so that one can live life to the fullest extent, comes only from personal growth and insight.
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Old 10-12-2011, 08:23 PM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,153 posts, read 3,387,835 times
Reputation: 259
Post I probably would have chosen agnosticism

Had it not been for the fact that all the people in my life that I looked up to to guide me to the truth during my childhood, teenage, and early adult years were ETers who said they believed that the Bible is the word of God, and imposed fear of ET upon me with disastrous results --- had not that been my experience, I probably would have chosen an agnostic path similar to that of LargeKingCat, and lived out my life by THE GOLDEN RULE hoping for the best in the afterlife.

I was never able to shake the idea that the Bible was the word of God, but what I did discover is that there is evidence that the Bible correctly (literally not interpretively) translated, does not teach that God will let anyone suffer forever, and having discovered that evidence, I love to share it with others in the hope that it might help them in the same way that it helped me.

In reference to the OP and the truth that sets us free, John Essex put it this way in
THE PLACE OF HUMANITY IN GOD’S PURPOSE – JOHN H. ESSEX

The freedom we now enjoy in spirit will ultimately be enjoyed by the whole creation when it is reconciled to God, and this includes the whole of humanity, for God wills all mankind to be saved and to come into a realization of the truth (1Tim.2:4). When His purpose is accomplished, there will be no vessels of indignation left.

When the reconciliation of all is complete the joy of the universe will be full. When the purpose of the All-sufficient God has reached its consummation, and He is All in all, every heart will be filled with the true laughter which accompanies the praise and adoration of Him Who is Supreme and Whose name is Love.”
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Old 10-12-2011, 09:11 PM
 
63,461 posts, read 39,726,177 times
Reputation: 7792
Quote:
Originally Posted by saved33 View Post
This is why the Great Commission must still be adhered to by those who are his true disciples.
It is impossible for someone to believe in ET and be a true disciple of Christ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright Hope for Tomorrow View Post
The great commission is to spread the gospel which means "good news." What really set me free was knowing the good news is TRULY good and not a good news/bad news scenario.
Amen!

Quote:
Originally Posted by saved33 View Post
Well, unfortunately there is bad news along with the good news, for those who do not totally understand and believe, in Truth, the good news.
The bad news was the OT news and it is no more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Yes, that is what Christ wants us to to. Some will be offended by it (as can be seen even on this thread), but some will listen.
Pray you do not convince too many to believe in ET, Finn . . . each soul we convince becomes part of our responsibility and must be accounted for.
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Old 10-12-2011, 09:50 PM
 
1,897 posts, read 2,102,328 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LargeKingCat View Post
I am free of the myth of sin for as a human being I can see that this too is a man made religious concept which I choose not to endorse.
If you don't believe there's sin, what is murder? Is it just a crime, morally wrong, or what? I'm just curious.
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Old 10-13-2011, 05:45 AM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,153 posts, read 3,387,835 times
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Exclamation There is no bad news..just good news

Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
There is no bad news..just good news.
"There is no bad news..just good news"

I agree with that.
Even kolasis aionion (age-during corrective chastisement) is good news because of what it will achieve.

ARMINIAN ET THEOLOGY'S so-called "good news." - It's as if God says
“Unless you are lucky enough to find out about my son during this lifetime, and even if you are that lucky, if you don’t have the good sense to cooperate with my son properly before you die, then I am going to raise you from the dead and I will sustain you alive in an inescapable state of eternal torment forever.”

CALVINIST ET THEOLOGY'S so-called "good news." - It's as if God says
"Since there is nothing you can do about it because you are totally depraved and you are not one of the elect, it is obvious that I created most of you for the purpose of torturing you forever. However, I am going to choose a few of you to go to heaven where you will be happy forever."

UNIVERSAL RECONCILIATION THEOLOGY'S "good news." It's as if God says
"Sooner or later, according to My perfect timing for each individual, I will save everyone from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will, just like I did for Saul of Tarsus."

I believe that God will eventually fit every individual into His master plan in a positive way that necessitates their unique temporary involvement in evil and suffering that will enable God to manifest, and glorify, and magnify the many facets of His character in a way that uniquely involves that person, and everyone else involved in that person’s life too.

For me, that is the "truth that sets me free."
For me, that is really "good news!"
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Old 10-13-2011, 06:18 AM
 
Location: Florida
76,949 posts, read 47,272,488 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Pray you do not convince too many to believe in ET, Finn . . . each soul we convince becomes part of our responsibility and must be accounted for.
You think God will punish me for preaching that people need to trust Christ IN THIS LIFE for salvation?

Perhaps you need to pray even harder, because when you realize you were wrong (and you will) about preaching that Christ is unnecessary in this life (which is what ur boils down to), you will be held accountable for the eternal loss of those you led away from the truth.

Just saying.....

Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 10-13-2011 at 06:29 AM..
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Old 10-13-2011, 06:44 AM
 
9,229 posts, read 8,503,009 times
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To which truth do you refer? According to physicists, there are as many truths as there are perspectives. In God's world, all things are possible.

And yes, I am free to follow any truth I set my mind to -- it is my gift of free will, direct from God.

Do not put your God in a box of dogma created by small minds.
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Old 10-13-2011, 06:47 AM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,153 posts, read 3,387,835 times
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Post God is going to save everyone from everything from which they need to be saved

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
you will be held accountable for the eternal loss of those you led away from the truth.
The idea that anyone will be lost eternally did not come from a literally translated Bible.
Instead, here is where it came from.
The Origin and History of the Doctrine of Endless Punishment

Instead of being lost eternally, sooner or later, God is going to save everyone from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will, just like He did for Saul of Tarsus.

We know this because God will have (wants if you like) all men to be saved (1 Timothy 2:4)
It is God’s “pleasure” that all mankind be saved.
And “God is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will” (Ephesians 1:11).

Change it to read “in accord with the counsel of what He wants if you like.
Because God says
"My counsel shall stand.
I will do all my pleasure
(the saving of all mankind is part of the pleasure that God wants)
Yea I have spoken it.
I will also bring it to pass.
I have purposed it.
I will also do it."
Isaiah 46:10,11

Job 23:13 “But he stands alone, and who can oppose Him?
He does whatever he pleases.
(the saving of all mankind is part of what He wants that pleases Him).

Isaiah 55:11 so is my word that goes out from my mouth:
It will not return to me empty,
but will accomplish what I desire
and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.
(the saving of all mankind is part of all of which God desires or wants)

So we see God does all His pleasure, He does whatever He pleases, and His word accomplishes that which He desires.
His pleasure, that which He desires and pleases Him is what He wants.

His will = What He wants
What does He want?
THE SALVATION OF ALL MANKIND
Why will it happen?
Because God Himself will see to it that it gets done.

Any cooperation towards our salvation is the result, not the cause of God laying hold on us by His saving grace and causing Jesus to be "choice" in our heart, just like it was in the case of Lydia and Saul of Tarsus.

The opinions of exactly how God will achieve universal salvation may differ from UR to UR just like, as Bright Hope pointed out, the opinions of ETers also vary from person to person about what the Bible teaches about salvation.

Last edited by rodgertutt; 10-13-2011 at 07:05 AM..
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Old 10-13-2011, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 6,338,763 times
Reputation: 873
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
It is knowing the truth that sets you free. What truth is it that we need to know that sets us free ?. That God is not reckoning your sin against you.

Blessed and happy and to be envied is the person of whose sin the Lord will take no account nor reckon it against him. Romans 4:8

Why? because you have a clear conscience before him,and because of that you have confidence and boldness to approach the throne of grace and to call upon Him at your will.

Want to be free ? Know that God is not reckoning your sin against you !!!!!!.


It was God [personally present] in Christ, reconciling and restoring the world to favor with Himself, not counting up and holding against [men] their trespasses [but cancelling them], and committing to us the message of reconciliation (of the restoration to favor).2 Cor 5:19
Just read this post. AMEN!!

Thanks Paul for these words!

Blessings,
brian
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Old 10-13-2011, 07:00 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 6,338,763 times
Reputation: 873
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodgertutt View Post
The idea that anyone will be lost eternally did not come from a literally translated Bible. Instead, here is where it came from.
The Origin and History of the Doctrine of Endless Punishment

Instead of being lost eternally, sooner or later, God is going to save everyone from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will, just like He did for Saul of Tarsus.

We know this because God will have (wants if you like) all men to be saved (1 Timothy 2:4)
It is God’s “pleasure” that all mankind be saved.
And “God is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will” (Ephesians 1:11).

Change it to read “in accord with the counsel of what He wants if you like.
Because God says
"My counsel shall stand.
I will do all my pleasure
(the saving of all mankind is part of the pleasure that God wants)
Yea I have spoken it.
I will also bring it to pass.
I have purposed it.
I will also do it."
Isaiah 46:10,11

Job 23:13 “But he stands alone, and who can oppose Him?
He does whatever he pleases.
(the saving of all mankind is part of what He wants that pleases Him).

Isaiah 55:11 so is my word that goes out from my mouth:
It will not return to me empty,
but will accomplish what I desire
and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.
(the saving of all mankind is part of all of which God desires or wants)

So we see God does all His pleasure, He does whatever He pleases, and His word accomplishes that which He desires.
His pleasure, that which He desires and pleases Him is what He wants.

His will = What He wants
What does He want?
THE SALVATION OF ALL MANKIND
Why will it happen?
Because God Himself will see to it that it gets done.

Any cooperation towards our salvation is the result, not the cause of God laying hold on us by His saving grace and causing Jesus to be "choice" in our heart, just like it was in the case of Lydia and Saul of Tarsus.

The opinions of exactly how God will achieve universal salvation may differ from UR to UR just like, as Bright Hope pointed out, the opinions of ETers also vary from person to person about what the Bible teaches about salvation.
Thank you for the link, Rodger!

Blessings,
brian
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