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Unread 12-21-2011, 03:04 PM
 
11,408 posts, read 5,232,678 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiloh1 View Post
Why do you just keep stating things with out any justifications - we all know what the Pre-trib position is and how it is suppossed to work. We disagree and have pointed out why it is wrong - and you just come back with a restatement. People are not refusing to see - they are seeing things that flat out contradict the Pre-trib framework. Your constant cut and paste work form Scofield is not demonstrating anything.
No Shiloh. Everything that has been said is Bibically correct. You as do those who are like you simply refuse to understand what has been clearly stated. I have quoted Dr. Scofield only once on this thread and mentioned his name in one other post.
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Unread 12-21-2011, 03:08 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garya123 View Post
DAN 9:24 "Seventy weeks are determined upon your people and upon your holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy."

The 70th week has nothing to do with the Great Tribulation but rather to bring redemption to the world through Christ as the above scripture says.

Those who use this scripture for any other reason are misinterpreting a wide variety of scripture. No wonder there is no Power in what they say.
No Garya. The 70th week of Daniel is the seven year tribulation which will take place after the church has been raptured. It has already been explained in an earlier post.
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Unread 12-21-2011, 04:32 PM
 
2,254 posts, read 653,514 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
No Garya. The 70th week of Daniel is the seven year tribulation which will take place after the church has been raptured. It has already been explained in an earlier post.
No Mike, your explanations are wrong. The Word speaks for itself without outside help.
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Unread 12-21-2011, 04:35 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garya123 View Post
No Mike, your explanations are wrong.
If I remember correctly, did you not say on another thread that you believe that the tribulation has been going on for two thousand years, or something to that effect?
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Unread 12-21-2011, 05:07 PM
 
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The title of this thread would almost be hysterical to me if so many didn't say the same thing. Is the Rapture of the Church clearly taught? Oh yeah, so clearly that the pretrib rapture theory didn't show up until well after the Reformation and its still vigorously debated today between scholars and denominations Meh, Who cares about the endtimes theories of the first 1500 years anyways?! Rapture is a nice thought for us Christians who just want to be taken away from the Tribulation Chaos, but as a clear biblical teaching, I think I've seen clearer mud before.

I'm surprised Sciotamicks isn't all over this thread.
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Unread 12-21-2011, 05:22 PM
 
5,993 posts, read 1,778,979 times
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Try to imagine, if you will, a world without fanaticism:
"Letting reality be reality."
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Unread 12-21-2011, 05:23 PM
 
2,254 posts, read 653,514 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
If I remember correctly, did you not say on another thread that you believe that the tribulation has been going on for two thousand years, or something to that effect?
Absolutely.
MT 24:15 When you therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, [whoso reads, let him understand]
MT 24:16 Then let them which be in Judea flee into the mountains:
MT 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
MT 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
MT 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
MT 24:20 But pray you that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
MT 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Judea will never have to flee again because God said He would bring the Jews back into the land and that they would no more be cast out. The prophesy of Jesus has already happened to Judea but the great tribulation has not ended for the world.

MK 13:20 "And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he has chosen, He has shortened the days." We are on the shortened end because of mass media. MT 24:14 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."

The Jews of Judea had to flee the onslaught of the Romans. It happened circa 70AD and Jesus said this would mark the beginning of great tribulation called "those days" and we know that in Prophetic time a day to the Lord is as a thousand years.
2PET 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

ACTS 2:17 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:" Concurrent to this great tribulation we are in, even as Peter was in, in his day, is the fact that the Spirit is being poured out to save in these last days.


All one needs to do is look no more than 100 yrs backward and you will see much of Revelation unfolded but there is more to come. Do you really think that the last 7 years of people living on this earth are more worthy of the wrath of God then other generations. How blind you are to think so.
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Unread 12-21-2011, 05:27 PM
 
11,408 posts, read 5,232,678 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrhockney View Post
The title of this thread would almost be hysterical to me if so many didn't say the same thing. Is the Rapture of the Church clearly taught? Oh yeah, so clearly that the pretrib rapture theory didn't show up until well after the Reformation and its still vigorously debated today between scholars and denominations Meh, Who cares about the endtimes theories of the first 1500 years anyways?! Rapture is a nice thought for us Christians who just want to be taken away from the Tribulation Chaos, but as a clear biblical teaching, I think I've seen clearer mud before.

I'm surprised Sciotamicks isn't all over this thread.
Is not the deity of Jesus Christ also clearly taught? And yet, are there not many who will deny that the Bible teaches that Jesus Christ is God? In like manner, the pretribulational rapture is clearly taught but denied by many. Anyone with an understanding of the dispensational nature of God's plan for the ages would realize that the church must be taken off the earth before the time of Jacob's trouble - the tribulation can begin.
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Unread 12-21-2011, 05:33 PM
 
11,408 posts, read 5,232,678 times
Reputation: 1527
Quote:
Originally Posted by garya123 View Post
Absolutely.
MT 24:15 When you therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, [whoso reads, let him understand]
MT 24:16 Then let them which be in Judea flee into the mountains:
MT 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
MT 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
MT 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
MT 24:20 But pray you that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
MT 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Judea will never have to flee again because God said He would bring the Jews back into the land and that they would no more be cast out. The prophesy of Jesus has already happened to Judea but the great tribulation has not ended for the world.

MK 13:20 "And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he has chosen, He has shortened the days." We are on the shortened end because of mass media. MT 24:14 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."

The Jews of Judea had to flee the onslaught of the Romans. It happened circa 70AD and Jesus said this would mark the beginning of great tribulation called "those days" and we know that in Prophetic time a day to the Lord is as a thousand years.
2PET 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

ACTS 2:17 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:" Concurrent to this great tribulation we are in, even as Peter was in, in his day, is the fact that the Spirit is being poured out to save in these last days.


All one needs to do is look no more than 100 yrs backward and you will see much of Revelation unfolded but there is more to come. Do you really think that the last 7 years of people living on this earth are more worthy of the wrath of God then other generations. How blind you are to think so.
Do you believe that God's plan is dispensational?
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Unread 12-21-2011, 05:36 PM
 
2,254 posts, read 653,514 times
Reputation: 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Is not the deity of Jesus Christ also clearly taught? And yet, are there not many who will deny that the Bible teaches that Jesus Christ is God? In like manner, the pretribulational rapture is clearly taught but denied by many. Anyone with an understanding of the dispensational nature of God's plan for the ages would realize that the church must be taken off the earth before the time of Jacob's trouble - the tribulation can begin.
Time of Jacobs Troubles! What do you think happened in 70AD and all the way through into world war11. Are you blind or are you ignorant of history?
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