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Old 01-21-2012, 08:43 AM
 
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Hello church history buffs.... Please help!

When Augustine prevailed against Pelagius around 400AD, was that a fantastic victory for Christianity.... or the start of something sinister that has a hold on many today?

I mean, there's no denying that original sin doctrine is the bedrock of numerous "key doctrines" today in many church traditions, and how you understand the nature of man is crucial in forming one's understanding of what is up with pretty much everything in the Bible, especially soteriology.

So who was right?

A. Augustine
B. Pelagius (assuming we can ever really know what he believed..)
C. Neither

And if you pick b. or c. then how bad are the collateral damages we're dealing with?

 
Old 01-21-2012, 09:21 AM
 
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C. Very, very bad.
 
Old 01-21-2012, 02:36 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steph1980 View Post
Hello church history buffs.... Please help!

When Augustine prevailed against Pelagius around 400AD, was that a fantastic victory for Christianity.... or the start of something sinister that has a hold on many today?
It was the start of the apostasy warned about 300+ years earlier. Augustine should be called Satan Augustine.
Quote:
I mean, there's no denying that original sin doctrine is the bedrock of numerous "key doctrines" today in many church traditions, and how you understand the nature of man is crucial in forming one's understanding of what is up with pretty much everything in the Bible, especially soteriology.

So who was right?

A. Augustine
B. Pelagius (assuming we can ever really know what he believed..)
C. Neither

And if you pick b. or c. then how bad are the collateral damages we're dealing with?
B . . . and the collateral damage is significant. It undermines the sense of responsibility for our own sanctification and justification through "love of God and each other."
 
Old 01-21-2012, 02:45 PM
 
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No person can, has, or will be justified by God to escape from serving the penalty of eternal death by loving God or his fellow man. God will only allow a person to esacpe from the penalty of eternal death by the faith of obeying the Lord's command given through the apostles.
 
Old 01-21-2012, 02:49 PM
 
661 posts, read 484,154 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cxjonz View Post
No person can, has, or will be justified by God to escape from serving the penalty of eternal death by loving God or his fellow man. God will only allow a person to esacpe from the penalty of eternal death by the faith of obeying the Lord's command given through the apostles.
You seem to say things.... but say nothing at all. It is really rather bewildering to the reader.
 
Old 01-21-2012, 02:52 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cxjonz View Post
No person can, has, or will be justified by God to escape from serving the penalty of eternal death by loving God or his fellow man. God will only allow a person to esacpe from the penalty of eternal death by the faith of obeying the Lord's command given through the apostles.
Loving God and each other is the ONLY way we are justified and sanctified under the grace (Love) of Christ. It attunes us to His perfect consciousness which connects us to God.
 
Old 01-21-2012, 02:55 PM
 
299 posts, read 209,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steph1980 View Post
You seem to say things.... but say nothing at all. It is really rather bewildering to the reader.
Woman if you have a more perfect way of getting into God's kingdom than what I have described that you MUST have the faith to use have at it. But you had better hope like hell that what I've told you is not the Way that has been perfected by Jesus' crucifixion.
 
Old 01-21-2012, 02:56 PM
 
37,035 posts, read 24,923,824 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steph1980 View Post
You seem to say things.... but say nothing at all. It is really rather bewildering to the reader.
His tiny cult has a twisted sense of the Gospel . . . that ironically does correctly understand the tragedy of the crucifixion at our hands.
 
Old 01-21-2012, 03:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
His tiny cult has a twisted sense of the Gospel . . . that ironically does correctly understand the tragedy of the crucifixion at our hands.
So strange. I am always wary of people who don't speak plainly, especially when they tell you that what they are not saying is super important for you to figure out.

...Except Jesus, His parables are all good.
 
Old 01-21-2012, 03:19 PM
 
299 posts, read 209,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steph1980 View Post
So strange. I am always wary of people who don't speak plainly, especially when they tell you that what they are not saying is super important for you to figure out.

...Except Jesus, His parables are all good.
Woman I've said to you very plainly that you will not escape from serving the penalty of eternal death unless you confess directly to God that you are truly sorry Jesus' life was lost by bloodshed when he was crucified and be baptized into this WAY. There is no other way the Lord's command given through the apostles can be obeyed. Since you say that you are pregnant I am sure that you will not forgive a single person of a mob who has taken that child's life by bloodshed who does not confess to you that they are sorry. Would you?
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