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Old 03-18-2012, 10:39 PM
 
6,824 posts, read 4,872,983 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
lee...re-write the entire Bible here on this thread if that is what makes you happy...but it doesn't change a single word of truth that comes from every word you quote...you do not read His truth with understanding....truth has been veiled from you by God because of your lack of faith...you believe in the traditions of man and what man has filled your head with...and not of the commands of God and His will for your life.


...blessings to you lee.
The Scriptures could have spoke for themselves. I added commentary in part so it didn't get deleted. Go back over the Scriptures listed and see for yourself.

Either Peter, James, and Paul were chosen vessels or not.
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Old 03-18-2012, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 6,237,725 times
Reputation: 837
Quote:
Originally Posted by mzjamiedawn View Post
Fair enough. I believe the commandments are any commands that Jesus gave while on this earth.

Your turn.
...huh...? Your answer to what my entire post of Scriptural truth means to you is simply that they are commandments that Jesus gave while on this earth...? really...? REALLY...?

mzjamiedawn...until God sees you worthy to unveil His truth of His Gospel to you, I cannot even begin to learn it for you...you have some serious, faithful seeking, soul searching to do in order to have any kind of relationship with God and His truth being revealed to, and lived out by you.

...a good start would be to read and listen and learn truth.
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Old 03-18-2012, 10:45 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,965 posts, read 5,572,297 times
Reputation: 1584
Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
...huh...? Your answer to what my entire post of Scriptural truth means to you is simply that they are commandments that Jesus gave while on this earth...? really...? REALLY...?

mzjamiedawn...until God sees you worthy to unveil His truth of His Gospel to you, I cannot even begin to learn it for you...you have some serious, faithful seeking, soul searching to do in order to have any kind of relationship with God and His truth being revealed to, and lived out by you.

...a good start would be to read and listen and learn truth.
Verna,

What perfect law are you keeping by condemning all who do not see eye to eye with you? There are several posters on this forum who do the exact same thing. I will refrain from calling them by name.
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Old 03-18-2012, 10:48 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 6,237,725 times
Reputation: 837
Quote:
Originally Posted by lee9786 View Post
The Scriptures could have spoke for themselves. I added commentary in part so it didn't get deleted. Go back over the Scriptures listed and see for yourself.

Either Peter, James, and Paul were chosen vessels or not.
I read it...I believe every passage you quoted...the difference between you and I is that I read it in the Spirit and Light of Truth.

Scripture definately speaks for itself...that isn't the problem here...it is your misunderstanding of it.
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Old 03-18-2012, 10:50 PM
 
Location: Florida
5,261 posts, read 6,237,725 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
Verna,

What perfect law are you keeping by condemning all who do not see eye to eye with you? There are several posters on this forum who do the exact same thing. I will refrain from calling them by name.
I believe my OP states it pretty clearly Heartsong...it is the word of God...pure.
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Old 03-18-2012, 11:11 PM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,818,165 times
Reputation: 1302
Verna,

Do you recall this exchange between Jesus and this man:

Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?”
Jesus replied. “.. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.”
“Which ones?” the man inquired
Jesus replied, “ ‘Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother,’ and ‘love your neighbor as yourself.’ ”
“All these I have kept,” the young man said. “What do I still lack?”
Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect ....."
I hope you really take notice on what is said and what is not said by Jesus and the conclusion the man came to despite him obeying the commands.


The two points you should notice is:
  1. that even if you keep all the commands, you will still be lacking eternal life
  2. The law demands that you are to "be perfect"
The truth is that the only purpose of the law is to convict you of your imperfection and point you to Jesus as your subsitute for your imperfection.
But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify....
For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law.

For if those who live by law are heirs, faith has no value and the promise is worthless because law brings wrath....

Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes...
know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ.
So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law,
because by observing the law no one will be justified.

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Old 03-18-2012, 11:14 PM
 
6,824 posts, read 4,872,983 times
Reputation: 3724
Quote:
Originally Posted by Verna Perry View Post
I read it...I believe every passage you quoted...the difference between you and I is that I read it in the Spirit and Light of Truth.

Scripture definately speaks for itself...that isn't the problem here...it is your misunderstanding of it.
How do you interpret the following:

Galatians 5

1Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

2Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.


5For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

6For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

7Ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth?

8This persuasion cometh not of him that calleth you.

9A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.

10I have confidence in you through the Lord, that ye will be none otherwise minded: but he that troubleth you shall bear his judgment, whosoever he be.

11And I, brethren, if I yet preach circumcision, why do I yet suffer persecution? then is the offence of the cross ceased.

12I would they were even cut off which trouble you.

13For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

14For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
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Old 03-18-2012, 11:45 PM
 
6,824 posts, read 4,872,983 times
Reputation: 3724
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
Verna,

Do you recall this exchange between Jesus and this man:

Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?”
Jesus replied. “.. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.”
“Which ones?” the man inquired
Jesus replied, “ ‘Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother,’ and ‘love your neighbor as yourself.’ ”
“All these I have kept,” the young man said. “What do I still lack?”
Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect ....."
I hope you really take notice on what is said and what is not said by Jesus and the conclusion the man came to despite him obeying the commands.


The two points you should notice is:
  1. that even if you keep all the commands, you will still be lacking eternal life
  2. The law demands that you are to "be perfect"
The truth is that the only purpose of the law is to convict you of your imperfection and point you to Jesus as your subsitute for your imperfection.
But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify....
For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law.

For if those who live by law are heirs, faith has no value and the promise is worthless because law brings wrath....

Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes...
know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ.
So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law,
because by observing the law no one will be justified.

Good post!

The Lord sees White and Black (or Red) with Justification. There is no in-between. We have to be perfect.

Isaiah 1:18
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

Therefore it is through imputed righteousness through baptism of the Holy Spirit by Faith in Christ alone in being "born again" by which our sins become "white as snow".

Grace is not conditional. It is freely given undeservedly.


Romans 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

1 Corinthians 2:12
Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

We can't earn it

Romans 4
3For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.


If we are "working" it is debt not Grace. If we are working, we get a paycheck (or something equivalent). It is making God our debtor. We are HIS debtor with wages WE CAN'T PAY. He has freely given to us what WE DON'T DESERVE. Therefore it is GRACE. HE's paid our debt.

What's happens to our Works when we are attempting to EARN what we've been freely given?

Romans 11:6
And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.


wood, hay, stubble (1 Cor 3) it looks like. That's why it is blasphemy to add MAN to God's completed work on Calvary.

When we are born-again we are "purchased" with Christ's blood. We are saved from Damnation freely by God's Loving Grace giving us what we don't deserve. Our body is not ours anymore. We will all be accountable to how we performed (Parable of Talents, etc). Some will be Co-heirs with Christ. Some will be "Cast Aways." All born again will be Saved from Damnation by God's faithfulness.

1 Corinthians 9:24-27
24Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

25And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

26I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:

27But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.


When did the race start? When we were "born again" into the Spirit of God. Born again believers can lose our "inheritance" by unfaithfulness. They will not inherit the Kingdom. Paul said he was "sealed" with the Holy Spirit "until the day of redemption". We can't equate Cast Away with Damnation.

The Lord also mentioned a distinct category called "Cast Away"

Luke 9:25
For what is a man advantaged, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?

If we Love God we indeed will Keep his Commandments - a fruit not a root of Justification. Love expressing itself in the Obedience of Faith striving against the Flesh/Sin by
walking in the Spirit producing fruit.
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:07 AM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,818,165 times
Reputation: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by lee9786 View Post
Good post!

The Lord sees White and Black (or Red) with Justification. There is no in-between. We have to be perfect.

Isaiah 1:18
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

Therefore it is through imputed righteousness through baptism of the Holy Spirit by Faith in Christ alone in being "born again" by which our sins become "white as snow".

Grace is not conditional. It is freely given undeservedly.

Romans 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

1 Corinthians 2:12
Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

We can't earn it

Romans 4
3For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

If we are "working" it is debt not Grace. If we are working, we get a paycheck (or something equivalent). It is making God our debtor. We are HIS debtor with wages WE CAN'T PAY. He has freely given to us what WE DON'T DESERVE. Therefore it is GRACE. HE's paid our debt.

What's happens to our Works when we are attempting to EARN what we've been freely given?

Romans 11:6
And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

wood, hay, stubble (1 Cor 3) it looks like. That's why it is blasphemy to add MAN to God's completed work on Calvary.

When we are born-again we are "purchased" with Christ's blood. We are saved from Damnation freely by God's Loving Grace giving us what we don't deserve. Our body is not ours anymore. We will all be accountable to how we performed (Parable of Talents, etc). Some will be Co-heirs with Christ. Some will be "Cast Aways." All born again will be Saved from Damnation by God's faithfulness.

1 Corinthians 9:24-27
24Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain.

25And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.

26I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:

27But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

When did the race start? When we were "born again" into the Spirit of God. Born again believers can lose our "inheritance" by unfaithfulness. They will not inherit the Kingdom. Paul said he was "sealed" with the Holy Spirit "until the day of redemption". We can't equate Cast Away with Damnation.

The Lord also mentioned a distinct category called "Cast Away"

Luke 9:25
For what is a man advantaged, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?

If we Love God we indeed will Keep his Commandments - a fruit not a root of Justification. Love expressing itself in the Obedience of Faith striving against the Flesh/Sin by walking in the Spirit producing fruit.
That is a very solid follow up.
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Old 03-19-2012, 05:39 AM
 
Location: RV Park
7,543 posts, read 11,558,523 times
Reputation: 4461
"For the love of God" is the quote I will use.

Can we all agree that God is holy?

That we are to be a light in this world?

That we should not behave as the world?

That last one is what we're touching on here - and this is what I believe.

Jesus lives His life in us - believe it or not? He is the only perfect sacrifice, for we had no way to wash away our sin. But now the curtain has been torn, and we can freely enter in (got a song stuck in my head now). His life in us causes us to live differently - are we getting it now? But the reason we live pleasing to the Father is because we're focused on the Son, and the Son is pleasing to the Father.

It's not because of us; God is not impressed with our "righteousness".

All this scripture being thrown around is true - every bit of it - and is being used against itself; it's childish and I don't believe it's pleasing to the Lord for us to use His word to bash each other over the head with it.
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