Why must one believe that "Jesus is the only way"? (churches, dogma)

[I LOVE NORTH CAROLINA]

Originally Posted by Mike555

If someone is turned away by the truth then so be it. It is not holier than thou to state what God has revealed in His word. God desires that all come to a knowledge of the truth (1 Tim 2:4). But He will nevertheless hand a person who persists in rejecting the truth over to delusion (2 Thess 2:11-12).

There is no eternal salvation apart from faith in Jesus Christ.

That's right Mike. Jesus said the road to Heaven was narrow and few would find it.

[Pleroo]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

It seems some people pick a verse in the Bible and use it to challenge God and demand salvation based on a misundersood verse, rather that asking Christ for forgiveness.

"If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

Pleroo's paraphrase of above verse:

Don't be afraid to admit your wrongdoings (your lack of loving thought, attitude and actions) because God is faithful to his promise: He is not holding those things against you; you are forgiven. And WHEN you let go of the fear of admitting you're wrong ... then you will be CLEANSED from it: you'll be able to release the SELF-condemnation that is holding you in bondage to that sin because you will know that GOD has already forgiven you. You are free to LOVE.

[Finn_Jarber]

Originally Posted by Mike555

Many people choose what they will and will not believe from the Scriptures and customize their own personal belief system which then contradicts and ignores what is actually taught in the Bible.

Sad, but true

[Finn_Jarber]

Originally Posted by Pleroo

Pleroo's paraphrase of above verse:

Don't be afraid to admit your wrongdoings (your lack of loving thought, attitude and actions) because God is faithful to his promise: He is not holding those things against you; you are forgiven. And WHEN you let go of the fear of admitting you're wrong ... then you will be CLEANSED from it: you'll be able to release the SELF-condemnation that is holding you in bondage to that sin because you will know that GOD has already forgiven you. You are free to LOVE.

Thanks for proving what Mike just said.

[Padgett2]

Originally Posted by Mike555

If someone is turned away by the truth then so be it. It is not holier than thou to state what God has revealed in His word. God desires that all come to a knowledge of the truth (1 Tim 2:4). But He will nevertheless hand a person who persists in rejecting the truth over to delusion (2 Thess 2:11-12).

There is no eternal salvation apart from faith in Jesus Christ.

Two Questions;

1. Has everyone in the entire world since Adam and Eve been told about Jesus? Yes___, No____.


2. Does God want everyone since Adam and Eve, that hasn't learned about Jesus turned into the firey pit? Yes____, No____.

Let's add some more questions.

What is so important about living eternally? What's so bad about just ceasing to exist? What are people afraid of? If there is nothing, then you won't know about it, will you!

[Pleroo]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

Thanks for proving what Mike just said.

I knew you'd see it that way, Finn.

You see conditional forgiveness in the same words where I see love. That is what rings true to me, and I can see it no other way. Just as you can apparently not see things differently than you do.

[littlemagician]

i love allof you.. i want all of us to spend this time giving thanks and praises to the creator who gave us all this life that we have at this very moment.. if for jsut a min we cant put aside our differences and just be thankful for all that we have.. whatever relgion or belief.

He wants us to Be thanksful for is gift of life to us.. if jsut for a moment in the chatter.. jsut to be grateful fully sumerged in thanks. for this moment right here..

I am sending my heart of of love to all of you who want .. Unconditioned LOVE .. no conditions

I give thanks

[LookinForMayberry]

Originally Posted by Pleroo

Thanks for your thoughts, Lookin.

I see Paul differently than you do. I don't think Paul's motives were as self-serving as you do.

I think that Paul and Jesus' other disciples WERE inspired and enlightened by Jesus (or what they knew of Jesus). But, like all of us, they had to interpret things in a way that made sense to them in the context of the times they lived in, and the religious beliefs they held.

aisi

Excellent point and well stated. Certainly the ancients have no monopoly on misconstruing God -- or anyone else, for that matter. As you've so astutely pointed out, I could have misconstrued Paul.

The more I learn, the more I find how little I know.

[Mike555]

Originally Posted by Pleroo

Yep ... "eternal life" ... life in this age. As I've said, I agree that what one believes matters ... if one believes they are not forgiven by God, that matters and will keep them in bondage to fear.

Eternal life is not age-during life. It is what it says it is. Eternal life. The very same eternal life which is in Jesus Christ. As God Jesus Christ has eternally existed. As man He is now in resurrected body and alive forevermore. Those who recieve Jesus Christ as Savior do not have age-during life, they have eternal unending life imputed to their soul. The body will be resurrected in the future.

And I said that if you don't believe that Jesus Christ died for you personally then you don't have eternal life. Which is not what you are saying.

No, your subjective experience of forgiveness is dependent on faith in Jesus' message ... God is not holding your sins against you.

Your faith in that promise has nothing to do, however, with it's objective truth.

To the contrary. Your sins were judged at the cross. They are not forgiven until you believe in Christ. If you die without believing in Christ you will die in your sins as per John 8:24 ''I said therefore to you, that you shall die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am, you shall die in your sins.''

Jesus said twice that they would die in their sin (John 8:21,24). If they rejected Him as Savior, if they rejected the Sin-bearer, then they would continue in sin. If they rejected Him as Savior they would miss their only chance of eternal salvation.

So, you believe ALL sin has already been "paid for". WHY would God rescind this declaration because someone does not understand that they are forgiven, or because they do not understand WHY they are forgiven?

I mean, I think you're completely dead wrong about WHY you have been forgiven, but I know God's forgiveness is not contingent upon that. You're forgiven Mike. And God loves you. He loves and forgives us all.

Scripture is clear that you are not forgiven until you believe on Christ. Your sins were judged at the cross, but not forgiven.

As I said, since sin has been judged at the cross, not forgiven but judged, that the issue in salvation is not sin but rather that until a person believes in Christ he does not receive the imputation of either God's eternal life or of His Perfect Righteousness. And because he does not possess eternal life or God's Perfect Righteousness he cannot live with God forever.

When a person dies never having believed in Christ for eternal life, it is not his sin which condemns him even though he does die in his sins. He cannot be judged for his sins because Jesus Christ was already judged for them. He is instead judged - condemned on the basis of his relative righteousness which is incompatable with God's Perfect Righteousness.

The issue in eternal salvation is not personal sin but the fact that God cannot accept your imperfect righteousness. But when a person has faith in Christ then he is credited with God's own Righteousness and declared justified. God sees His own Perfect Righteousness in the believer and not the believer's own relative righteousness.

[Pleroo]

Originally Posted by littlemagician

i love allof you.. i want all of us to spend this time giving thanks and praises to the creator who gave us all this life that we have at this very moment.. if for jsut a min we cant put aside our differences and just be thankful for all that we have.. whatever relgion or belief.

He wants us to Be thanksful for is gift of life to us.. if jsut for a moment in the chatter.. jsut to be grateful fully sumerged in thanks. for this moment right here..

I am sending my heart of of love to all of you who want .. Unconditioned LOVE .. no conditions

I give thanks

I'll join you in the moment.

And I AM grateful for ALL of the people who've participated and shared of themselves on this thread and elsewhere (not just the people I agree with). I enjoy coming here and hashing things out in my own mind/heart through interacting with everyone. And, beyond that, I simply appreciate the chance to connect on whatever level.