Armed forces and Christianity. (priests, Creator, history, Catholic)

[michael_atw]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

thanks for proving my point.

Your response makes no sense.

[michael_atw]

Originally Posted by Mike555

So you're saying that the Old Testament accounts of the Israelites going to war against their enemies were not justified despite the fact that God commanded them to?

Are you saying that World Wars One and Two were not justified?

World War II is the only war in modern history that can be argued to be justified. World War I was a war started because of an assassination. WWII was started because of tyranny.

That being said, it can just as easily be argued that alternative actions could have performed the same result - or better. As we can see, 60 years later, the results of the conflict led to a string of events that has been an erosion rather than a solution.


"He replied, "Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."

-Matthew 17:20


Faith in Jesus' commands, that is. Not in one's own actions or guns and bullets. Such a concept that Jesus is describing should not be foreign or hard to grasp for you. If it is, you might want to re-examine some things.

[Mike555]

Originally Posted by michael_atw

World War II is the only war in modern history that can be argued to be justified. World War I was a war started because of an assassination. WWII was started because of tyranny.

That being said, it can just as easily be argued that alternative actions could have performed the same result - or better. As we can see, 60 years later, the results of the conflict led to a string of events that has been an erosion rather than a solution.


"He replied, "Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."

-Matthew 17:20


Faith in Jesus' commands, that is. Not in one's own actions or guns and bullets. Such a concept that Jesus is describing should not be foreign or hard to grasp for you. If it is, you might want to re-examine some things.

I asked you if you believe that the accounts of Israel's wars in the Old Testament were not justified despite being ordered by God. Answer the question.

It is you that need to re-examine your pacifism. It is not justified by anything in the Bible.

You need to actually study what I said and the links provided in post #56 concerning the divine institutions and divine establishment.

[ted08721]

Originally Posted by Mike555

So you're saying that the Old Testament accounts of the Israelites going to war against their enemies were not justified despite the fact that God commanded them to?

Are you saying that World Wars One and Two were not justified?

I stated my case bibically and Michael has gone around and around with you on the subject, you push certain scripture while ignoring what Jesus said so I see no use in going around in circles.

As far as any war that our country has been involved in has either been started and or entered into by us has been based on LIES, this is going back to including the war for independence, even our involvement in the so called GOOD war was based on lies.
I don't know why WWII is referred to as the good war when between 50 million and 70 million people were killed.

[Jerwade]

Did God command genocide?

Implying that something is true, because there are no obstacles or opposing conditions within your own mind does not make it truth.

[Mike555]

Originally Posted by ted08721

I stated my case bibically and Michael has gone around and around with you on the subject, you push certain scripture while ignoring what Jesus said so I see no use in going around in circles.

As far as any war that our country has been involved in has either been started and or entered into by us has been based on LIES, this is going back to including the war for independence, even our involvement in the so called GOOD war was based on lies.
I don't know why WWII is referred to as the good war when between 50 million and 70 million people were killed.

No you did not state your case Biblically. You ignore the fact that the entire Bible is the word of God. How many times does the Bible have to say something in order for it to be true? Once!!!

Jesus Christ IS God. And God commanded the Israelites to destroy their enemies. Do you deny this?

Do you deny that the Bible says that a just war is from God? Answer the question.

A just war is from God. 1 Chron 5:22 'For many fell slain, because the war was of God.

Numbers 32:20-23 is part of a larger passage (Numbers 32:5-23) which talks about fighting a war in another country to protect your own country.

Num 32:20 So Moses said to them, "If you will do this, if you will arm yourselves before the LORD for the war, 21] and all of you armed men cross over the Jordan before the LORD until He has driven His enemies out from before Him, 22] and the land is subdued before the LORD, then afterward you shall return and be free of obligation toward the LORD and toward Israel, and this land shall be yours for a possession before the LORD. 23] But if you will not do so (by not going to war), behold, you have sinned against the LORD, and be sure your sin will find you out.

That passage says that it can be sinful not to go to war. Do you deny it?

Do you not believe what the Bible says?

There will be war until Christ returns. And under the principle of divine establishment a nation defends its freedom from hostile nations by having a strong and prepared military. And the believer in Jesus Christ has a duty to fight in defense of his country. He has a duty to defend the lives and freedom of his fellow man.

[Jerwade]

Originally Posted by Jerwade

Did God command genocide?

Implying that something is true, because there are no obstacles or opposing conditions within your own mind does not make it truth.

No, he did not command genocide.
It was their religion he wanted to destroy; not the people.

"For I desire mercy, not sacrifice."

[Jerwade]

Originally Posted by Mike555

No you did not state your case Biblically. You ignore the fact that the entire Bible is the word of God. How many times does the Bible have to say something in order for it to be true? Once!!!

Jesus Christ IS God. And God commanded the Israelites to destroy their enemies. Do you deny this?

Do you deny that the Bible says that a just war is from God? Answer the question.

A just war is from God. 1 Chron 5:22 'For many fell slain, because the war was of God.

Numbers 32:20-23 is part of a larger passage (Numbers 32:5-23) which talks about fighting a war in another country to protect your own country.

Num 32:20 So Moses said to them, "If you will do this, if you will arm yourselves before the LORD for the war, 21] and all of you armed men cross over the Jordan before the LORD until He has driven His enemies out from before Him, 22] and the land is subdued before the LORD, then afterward you shall return and be free of obligation toward the LORD and toward Israel, and this land shall be yours for a possession before the LORD. 23] But if you will not do so (by not going to war), behold, you have sinned against the LORD, and be sure your sin will find you out.

That passage says that it can be sinful not to go to war. Do you deny it?

Do you not believe what the Bible says?

There will be war until Christ returns. And under the principle of divine establishment a nation defends its freedom from hostile nations by having a strong and prepared military. And the believer in Jesus Christ has a duty to fight in defense of his country. He has a duty to defend the lives and freedom of his fellow man.

Naivety, error, contradiction, and wickedness have not been removed from the Bible.
Therefore, God must have wanted you to know the truth about the hearts of men.

Can you not see, beyond your own hatred? (Answer the question!)

[RevelationWriter]

Originally Posted by Mike555

No you did not state your case Biblically. You ignore the fact that the entire Bible is the word of God. How many times does the Bible have to say something in order for it to be true? Once!!!

Jesus Christ IS God. And God commanded the Israelites to destroy their enemies. Do you deny this?

Do you deny that the Bible says that a just war is from God? Answer the question.

A just war is from God. 1 Chron 5:22 'For many fell slain, because the war was of God.

Numbers 32:20-23 is part of a larger passage (Numbers 32:5-23) which talks about fighting a war in another country to protect your own country.

Num 32:20 So Moses said to them, "If you will do this, if you will arm yourselves before the LORD for the war, 21] and all of you armed men cross over the Jordan before the LORD until He has driven His enemies out from before Him, 22] and the land is subdued before the LORD, then afterward you shall return and be free of obligation toward the LORD and toward Israel, and this land shall be yours for a possession before the LORD. 23] But if you will not do so (by not going to war), behold, you have sinned against the LORD, and be sure your sin will find you out.

That passage says that it can be sinful not to go to war. Do you deny it?

Do you not believe what the Bible says?

There will be war until Christ returns. And under the principle of divine establishment a nation defends its freedom from hostile nations by having a strong and prepared military. And the believer in Jesus Christ has a duty to fight in defense of his country. He has a duty to defend the lives and freedom of his fellow man.

- Mike, God destroyed 7 Nations in the Land of Canaan God distributed their Land to them by alotment. - Lev.25:38 - Acts 13:19

This fact is not a Biblical justification of all wars. -

[Mike555]

Originally Posted by RevelationWriter

- Mike, God destroyed 7 Nations in the Land of Canaan God distributed their Land to them by alotment. - Lev.25:38 - Acts 13:19

This fact is not a Biblical justification of all wars. -

I agree that not all war is justified and said so in post #34 where I said the following.

'Now, not all war is justified. But a just war is from God. 1 Chron 5:22 'For many fell slain, because the war was of God.'