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thoughts on Christians in bars...I cant speak for anyone but myself...for me to go to a bar..for any reason other than to witness..(and I havent done that..yet) would reflect very poorly on my witness for Christ..why?..lets say next Sat I went with a few others to go knock on doors to witness, and to invite people to church..well lets say I came to "Freds" house..and Fred had saw me at the bar the night before...poof..Fred doesnt see anything different about me..Im just like the rest of the world..I just lost all credibility as a Christian in his sight..maybe its just the area I live in..he would say..your no better than I am..what has Jesus did for you? You havent changed..I just saw you last night..and you were drinking just like me....
Does that make any sense?
I understand completely what you are saying. I guess this is when I would have to explain to Fred that drinking (IMHO) is not a sin; it is drinking in excess and whatever else we/I might have been doing in the bar. Maybe I should take this to a new thread?
I understand completely what you are saying. I guess this is when I would have to explain to Fred that drinking (IMHO) is not a sin; it is drinking in excess and whatever else we/I might have been doing in the bar. Maybe I should take this to a new thread?
idk...about the thread..I think it depends on what part of the country you are from as far as it being a "general" sin...where Im from..most here.would say being in a bar equates with a non-Christian-or back-slidden one. Thats why If I said what you would say to Fred..he would just laugh...Weather..I totally understand what you are saying..and I get it..but alot of folks (here) dont that arent Christians..thats why I wouldnt..I dont wanna take that chance of offending someone, or someone having a negative view of me.
Several interesting points have been made in regard to the original post of where the Word is shared. I find it interesting how unwilling some are to go into those places to actually share the Word. Should we let sinners then wallow in their sin?
WWJD? Where is one place Jews thought they'd never see Jesus offer the Word? In the synagogue. Where'd Jesus go? Into the synagogue! Did He sit down and have lunch w/ Pharisees and Sadducees and shoot the breeze? No. Jesus Christ went it; He said His peace, and He left.
This model Jesus set may be applicable to arguy's bar situation. Do you think it might be a better alternative than the original plan of sitting at a booth and waiting for someone to come over? Just looking at a different angle.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and venture to say that myself, Alpha, cg81, Hoosier, WCRob & Weather all have arguy's best interests at heart. I don't think any of us would expect another brother-in-Christ to do something we aren't willing to do ourself.
Last edited by grew-up-3rd-culture; 10-08-2007 at 12:11 PM..
Reason: typo
Several interesting points have been made in regard to the original post of where the Word is shared. I find it interesting how unwilling some are to go into those places to actually share the Word. Should we let sinners then wallow in their sin?
We have no record of Jesus going into brothels or houses of ill repute to spread His message. He wasn't afraid to speak to sinners and associate with them, but He did it on His terms, not theirs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grew-up-3rd-culture
WWJD? Where is one place Jews thought they'd never see Jesus offer the Word? In the synagogue. Where'd Jesus go? Into the synagogue! Did He sit down and have lunch w/ Pharisees and Sadducees and shoot the breeze? No. Jesus Christ went it; He said His peace, and He left.
It could be that's more of a literal analogy than most of us care to admit. I'm not sure the church isn't where Jesus' message is the most obscure. Maybe it's time for a grass roots campaign in these 'Houses of the Holy' that drive people FROM God rather than TO Him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grew-up-3rd-culture
This model Jesus set may be applicable to arguy's bar situation. Do you think it might be a better alternative than the original plan of sitting at a booth and waiting for someone to come over? Just looking at a different angle.
I think going in anywhere and addressing sinners in a confrontational manner won't see much fruit. Remember, Jesus' audience THOUGHT they knew God better than anyone. They were self-righteous and proud. Jesus always brought GRACE to the humble and LAW to the proud. There's our model.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grew-up-3rd-culture
I'm going to go out on a limb here and venture to say that myself, Alpha, cg81, Hoosier, WCRob & Weather all have arguy's best interests at heart. I don't think any of us would expect another brother-in-Christ to do something we aren't willing to do ourself.
It is with an enormous amount of interest that I have read what everyone has written in this thread. Granted, I am not one who frequents bars, or especially even drinks, for that matter. However, your thoughts and words have lead me to wonder the following:
There are those who are so consumed with pain in their lives that they will seek out company and comfort in some very particular places, and for very particular reasons...I have to wonder whether that individual sitting at the bar, alone, isn't doing so for a reason...Who is he most wanting to "connect" to, or with, amid the noise, amid the booze, amid the apparrent anonymity that he feels he brings there? --Himself.
I suspect that he is both attempting to numb his internal pain, at the very same time that he is attempting to inter-relate with himself. There exists a very real, very particular type of longing in such individuals...I am not saying that people should make an all-out effort to infiltate bars as a means of bringing people to god. I am saying, however, that within that "space" or place where souls reside, can any one of us not relate to that longing of both wanting to know who we are, and why?
--Or then again, perhaps they are just there to listen to the blaring music...
It is with an enormous amount of interest that I have read what everyone has written in this thread. Granted, I am not one who frequents bars, or especially even drinks, for that matter. However, your thoughts and words have lead me to wonder the following:
There are those who are so consumed with pain in their lives that they will seek out company and comfort in some very particular places, and for very particular reasons...I have to wonder whether that individual sitting at the bar, alone, isn't doing so for a reason...Who is he most wanting to "connect" to, or with, amid the noise, amid the booze, amid the apparrent anonymity that he feels he brings there? --Himself.
I suspect that he is both attempting to numb his internal pain, at the very same time that he is attempting to inter-relate with himself. There exists a very real, very particular type of longing in such individuals...I am not saying that people should make an all-out effort to infiltate bars as a means of bringing people to god. I am saying, however, that within that "space" or place where souls reside, can any one of us not relate to that longing of both wanting to know who we are, and why?
--Or then again, perhaps they are just there to listen to the blaring music...
I understand your points, and they make sense to me.
It is with an enormous amount of interest that I have read what everyone has written in this thread. Granted, I am not one who frequents bars, or especially even drinks, for that matter. However, your thoughts and words have lead me to wonder the following:
There are those who are so consumed with pain in their lives that they will seek out company and comfort in some very particular places, and for very particular reasons...I have to wonder whether that individual sitting at the bar, alone, isn't doing so for a reason...Who is he most wanting to "connect" to, or with, amid the noise, amid the booze, amid the apparrent anonymity that he feels he brings there? --Himself.
I suspect that he is both attempting to numb his internal pain, at the very same time that he is attempting to inter-relate with himself. There exists a very real, very particular type of longing in such individuals...I am not saying that people should make an all-out effort to infiltate bars as a means of bringing people to god. I am saying, however, that within that "space" or place where souls reside, can any one of us not relate to that longing of both wanting to know who we are, and why?
--Or then again, perhaps they are just there to listen to the blaring music...
LOL. The blaring music. You make me smile.
I see what you're saying (is that possible).
I'm all for reaching out to the hurting, June.
And I think that what you said about "within that "space" or place where souls reside, can any one of us not relate to that longing of both wanting to know who we are, and why?" holds much truth.
That is exactly why I think we(The Church) need to do a better of job of meeting people on their level.
What makes more sense "I'm just like you, but God has healed me"
There are those who are so consumed with pain in their lives that they will seek out company and comfort in some very particular places, and for very particular reasons...I have to wonder whether that individual sitting at the bar, alone, isn't doing so for a reason...Who is he most wanting to "connect" to, or with, amid the noise, amid the booze, amid the apparrent anonymity that he feels he brings there? --Himself.
I suspect that he is both attempting to numb his internal pain, at the very same time that he is attempting to inter-relate with himself. There exists a very real, very particular type of longing in such individuals...I am not saying that people should make an all-out effort to infiltate bars as a means of bringing people to god. I am saying, however, that within that "space" or place where souls reside, can any one of us not relate to that longing of both wanting to know who we are, and why?
Good points, june. When people are in soul trouble, or filled with pain in their lives, wanting to fill it with something... is a good time to be a friend. Not come to them saying "You need to read your Bible and become a Christian", but to be a FRIEND. I have found this out, especially in rescue missions/soup kitchens, etc. that just to show an interest in their situations, strike up a conversation, and let THEM open up their spiritual longings, can lead to some heart-touching conversations. As far as going into a bar.... I'm not saying yes or no, but I would definitely have to be at peace with this and know that God was leading, and be open to His direction.. He moves in mysterious ways.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207
What makes more sense "I'm just like you, but God has healed me"
And I think that what you said about "within that "space" or place where souls reside, can any one of us not relate to that longing of both wanting to know who we are, and why?" holds much truth.
That is exactly why I think we(The Church) need to do a better of job of meeting people on their level.
Follow?
June is listening to Cat Steven's "Into White" as she writes this...
And yes, I think it is absolutely possible that you know what I am saying. I think we both "follow" the other's thought. I suspect that people need to truly understand the meaning behind "The Church," as it is undoubtedly found in some very interesting, off-the-beaten-path places...Perhaps it is also found in individual's where you would least expect it...
You can try and force someone to listen to your favorite music, or song, but they might not always love it exactly as much as you do. However, I would have to ask you whether or not they are still capable of liking/loving music, themselves...
???
Take gentle care, my friend and friends!
-June: "With everything emptying into white..."
I suspect that people need to truly understand the meaning behind "The Church," as it is undoubtedly found in some very interesting, off-the-beaten-path places...
Ah yes, I think we do 'follow' each other's thoughts.
What I quoted above is probably my current theme.
Many times I'll talk about church, my church, your church, their church, but what we really need to be thinking about is The Church.
(that almost sounds like Dr. Suess!!)
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food for thought
