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Old 09-15-2015, 06:31 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
15,552 posts, read 7,007,722 times
Reputation: 1604

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
I told you...Believe whatever you want...
If that were an answer to how YOU justify those mitzvot you might not be avoiding the question, but it is not, and you are.
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Old 09-16-2015, 10:11 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
15,552 posts, read 7,007,722 times
Reputation: 1604
Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
If that were an answer to how YOU justify those mitzvot you might not be avoiding the question, but it is not, and you are.
And STILL no answer, so let's review what went on:

I mentioned that the mitzvot were not perfect, and may even have indicated that some of them were outdated.

You intimated that they were perfect and cited a couple of mitzvot that shared universal condemnation of obviously anti-social acts.

I called that misdirection and asked what the point was in the mitzvot about mixed fibers and beard trimmning.

You said to find out the reason for them and I would have my answer.

THEN I said you were avoiding and later provided commentary from Jewish sources that essentially stated the the reasons were unknown, gave speculations and details of enforcement, noting that they were often ignored by practicing Jews except for "the very religious."

You did not respond

You STILL have not responded.

10 posts ago you said, "No, I don't avoid the tough questions, you keep believing that if you like...I am rarely confused.."

Once again, I point out that you avoiding tough questions brings doubt on your position AND your integrity.
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Old 02-12-2017, 11:10 AM
 
1 posts, read 178 times
Reputation: 10
It would make sense to be obedient to those things that are possible to obey.

If one digs a bit you can see that the law known as Torah and the law known as the tradition of the elders (the oral law aka talmud) are not distinguished from one another by the individuals that translated into Greek, when they should have. And there is great reason to believe the NT was translated into Greek.

Investigation into that talmud helps to clear up matters. It's what Messiah spoke against. The quickest example is;
Mat 15:2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
Mat 15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of G-d by your tradition?

Being that there is no hand washing instruction in the OT this is a strange passage.

Having investigated the talmud it became apparent it was what Messiah and His disciples including Paul, spoke against There are many more examples.

Also when speaking on
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Fulfilled can mean several things as can the Greek word from which it came 'ginomai' yet "complete" is not an adequate translation, that would have been 'plēroō'. Which it is not.

Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teachthem, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

So is it possible there where additions made to Torah? Sure we were warned against the lying pen of the scribes an the Pharisee's
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Old 02-12-2017, 12:30 PM
 
Location: US
26,271 posts, read 13,935,357 times
Reputation: 1595
Quote:
Originally Posted by QoDeShiYM View Post
It would make sense to be obedient to those things that are possible to obey.

If one digs a bit you can see that the law known as Torah and the law known as the tradition of the elders (the oral law aka talmud) are not distinguished from one another by the individuals that translated into Greek, when they should have. And there is great reason to believe the NT was translated into Greek.

Investigation into that talmud helps to clear up matters. It's what Messiah spoke against. The quickest example is;
Mat 15:2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
Mat 15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of G-d by your tradition?

Being that there is no hand washing instruction in the OT this is a strange passage.

Having investigated the talmud it became apparent it was what Messiah and His disciples including Paul, spoke against There are many more examples.

Also when speaking on
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Fulfilled can mean several things as can the Greek word from which it came 'ginomai' yet "complete" is not an adequate translation, that would have been 'plēroō'. Which it is not.

Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teachthem, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

So is it possible there where additions made to Torah? Sure we were warned against the lying pen of the scribes an the Pharisee's
Hey...Look...A new guy...
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Old 02-12-2017, 04:27 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
15,552 posts, read 7,007,722 times
Reputation: 1604
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
Hey...Look...A new guy...
Yes, another one who can't distinguish between law and principle.
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