Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-06-2018, 06:28 PM
 
63,809 posts, read 40,077,272 times
Reputation: 7871

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by tvescovi View Post
Worship is due God. He is CREATOR and we are HIS subjects. He is due what is rightfully HIS, our Worship.
Worship is for HIM and our rightful response to a gracious GOD who is HOLY. The TRINITY: God the Father, Jesus Christ the SON, and The HOLY SPIRIT. The original Hebrew in the Septuagint supports this (Genesis)
Sorry that you think our Almighty God is needy. Our God needs NOTHING. He is complete. WE need Him and when we worship WE gain from His presence.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-06-2018, 06:33 PM
 
2 posts, read 902 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
Do you know what the word 'Worship' means?...


wor·ship
[wur-ship] Show IPA noun, verb, wor·shiped, wor·ship·ing or ( especially British ) wor·shipped, wor·ship·ping.
noun
1.
reverent honor and homage paid to God or a sacred personage, or to any object regarded as sacred.
2.
formal or ceremonious rendering of such honor and homage: They attended worship this morning.
3.
adoring reverence or regard: excessive worship of business success.
4.
the object of adoring reverence or regard.
5.
( initial capital letter ) British . a title of honor used in addressing or mentioning certain magistrates and others of high rank or station (usually preceded by Your, His, or Her ).
verb (used with object)
6.
to render religious reverence and homage to.
7.
to feel an adoring reverence or regard for (any person or thing).

Of course HaShem would command the Angels to worship Him, for Yeshua was His first-begotten of ALL creation...And He did not command them to worship Him as God, He just commanded them to worship Him or Honor or regard or respect Him...
The word "begotten" is in reference to Jesus (as the Son of God PS 2:7, 2 Sam 7:14) in His position not a reference to "time" Heb 1:6 in the Septuagint Greek translation of the ancient Hebrew He is the "protokos" or the chief, supreme, excellency, Ruler of those below Him. To worship anyone less than God is blasphemy. God would never tell the angels whom are created to serve HIM, GOD to worship a created man, prophet, etc. Therefore according to the original Hebrew translated into the Septuagint greek "protokos" the angels are commanded to worship Jesus because HE is GOD. The text, the original language settles it as it should, as the Author intended.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-06-2018, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Mobile, Al.
3,671 posts, read 2,244,007 times
Reputation: 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
Where does it state 'HaShem only'?...
1 Peter 1:21 "Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God".

but there is a problem to this thinking, because Isaiah 42:8 "I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images". is correct as it reads, and here's why.

if the one whom you calls father raised up the lord Jesus body, PROBLEM. John 2:18 "Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

John 2:19 "Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

John 2:20 "Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

John 2:21 "But he spake of the temple of his body.

here it very clear that the Lord Jesus raised up his body from the dead, and he's addressed as God. and there is only ONE GOD.

so if I may ask, "Who raise up the body of the Lord Jesus".


PICYJAG.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2018, 07:52 PM
 
18,172 posts, read 16,395,091 times
Reputation: 9328
Quote:
Originally Posted by antredd View Post
I know that the same Greek word used to worship God is the same word used here to worship JEsus, and that's my point. I can't believe you would ask me do I know what the word worship means. RICHARD, its the same Greek Word, and the NWT wants to render it less to support their teachings that only God is worthy of true worship where Jesus is to be given obeisance. No matter how you spell it or word it in English. It's the same Greek word that you can't make it mean one thing in one verse, and another in another verse when it clearly means definition 1 in your list.
The word in context refers to Jesus as king. The word carries many basic meanings like even standing when a judge arrives in court. Nothing in the context indicates worshiping as God.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2018, 07:56 PM
 
18,172 posts, read 16,395,091 times
Reputation: 9328
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvescovi View Post
The word "begotten" is in reference to Jesus (as the Son of God PS 2:7, 2 Sam 7:14) in His position not a reference to "time" Heb 1:6 in the Septuagint Greek translation of the ancient Hebrew He is the "protokos" or the chief, supreme, excellency, Ruler of those below Him. To worship anyone less than God is blasphemy. God would never tell the angels whom are created to serve HIM, GOD to worship a created man, prophet, etc. Therefore according to the original Hebrew translated into the Septuagint greek "protokos" the angels are commanded to worship Jesus because HE is GOD. The text, the original language settles it as it should, as the Author intended.
The word in scripture can be applied and acted on even when not God. Note:


KJV 1 Chronicles 29:20 And David said to all the congregation, Now bless the LORD your God. And all the congregation blessed the LORD God of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped the LORD, and the king.

No worship of God spoken of about Jesus, just respect and honor. Oh, please provide a verse where Protokos is translated as ruler or supreme one, etc?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2018, 08:50 PM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,029,149 times
Reputation: 2227
Quote:
Originally Posted by antredd View Post
Hebrews 1:6

"And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him."

From cover to cover in the Bible, you will find a multitude of verses that enforce that God shares His glory and worship with no one. Only He can receive it. This verse can't be any plainer. God the Father commands His angels to worship Jesus Christ. God is sovereign, holy, and righteous and would never command His angels to worship anything except...God. Straightforward, unless you are a Jehovah's Witness. Their NWT changes the word "worship" to "obeisance". In fact, everywhere in their translation, they translate the Greek word to obeisance when it is in reference to Jesus Christ; however, when it refers to God, false gods, and even Satan, it is translated as worship. Makes one go hummmmm?
Worship means to respect...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2018, 08:52 PM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,029,149 times
Reputation: 2227
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvescovi View Post
Worship is due God. He is CREATOR and we are HIS subjects. He is due what is rightfully HIS, our Worship.
Worship is for HIM and our rightful response to a gracious GOD who is HOLY. The TRINITY: God the Father, Jesus Christ the SON, and The HOLY SPIRIT. The original Hebrew in the Septuagint supports this (Genesis)
The Septuagint is not in Hebrew but in Greek...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2018, 08:56 PM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 22,029,149 times
Reputation: 2227
Quote:
Originally Posted by 101c View Post
1 Peter 1:21 "Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God".

but there is a problem to this thinking, because Isaiah 42:8 "I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images". is correct as it reads, and here's why.

if the one whom you calls father raised up the lord Jesus body, PROBLEM. John 2:18 "Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

John 2:19 "Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

John 2:20 "Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

John 2:21 "But he spake of the temple of his body.

here it very clear that the Lord Jesus raised up his body from the dead, and he's addressed as God. and there is only ONE GOD.

so if I may ask, "Who raise up the body of the Lord Jesus".


PICYJAG.
Go away....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-07-2018, 11:04 PM
 
Location: Panama City, FL
3,536 posts, read 1,709,120 times
Reputation: 1399
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
This is only confusing if you retain the mistaken notion that worship is FOR God. It has nothing to do with God because God needs NOTHING from us or anyone else. He is complete. Worship is for the worshiper. It facilitates the proper state of mind within the worshiper. That is why obeisance could be a reasonable interpretation. Worship is NOT for God. We can not add to God's glory by worship. God's glory can not be added to. Only human hubris and arrogance would think that anything we do could ever add to God's glory.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-08-2018, 03:24 AM
 
Location: On the brink of WWIII
21,088 posts, read 29,219,613 times
Reputation: 7812
Quote:
Originally Posted by antredd View Post
Hebrews 1:6

"And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him."

From cover to cover in the Bible, you will find a multitude of verses that enforce that God shares His glory and worship with no one. Only He can receive it. This verse can't be any plainer. God the Father commands His angels to worship Jesus Christ. God is sovereign, holy, and righteous and would never command His angels to worship anything except...God. Straightforward, unless you are a Jehovah's Witness. Their NWT changes the word "worship" to "obeisance". In fact, everywhere in their translation, they translate the Greek word to obeisance when it is in reference to Jesus Christ; however, when it refers to God, false gods, and even Satan, it is translated as worship. Makes one go hummmmm?
This makes me go hmmmmm..... and wonder exactly how the hierarchy is structured..


Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels?-----------------MATTHEW 26:53


So the question that is begging to be answered...

If angels worship Jesus, why does Jesus need to ask god's permission to send angels? Why not command it himself?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:11 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top