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If Jesus is God in human form, did God the Father experience suffering during the moment of his crucifixion and when he was in the tomb? Either, as some might presume, as a father towards his son, or, as part of a greater suffering caused to the Godhead.
I hear two different angles on this. That God sacrificed something that was precious to Him, which was also himself, and this caused him pain. Or that God himself, the Father as well as the Son, bore the sins unto himself.
But if he's in control of everything and has the power to forgive sins, it would seem odd he would deliberately cause himself needless suffering. That's if an all-powerful God can truly suffer.
In the prophecy from Isaiah 53: 10... about the plan for Jesus , which God made some 700 years before the cross of Christ......``Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him, he has put him to grief, when you will make his soul an offering for sin, he will see his seed , he will prolongs his days, and the pleasure of the Lord will prosper in his hand .....He will see of the labor of His soul , and will be satisfied, by his knowledge will my righteousness servant justify many, for he will bear their iniquities ...``...............See God has a plan that Jesus would be the judgment for men of their sin , and this judgment would free men to be children of God ...... Otherwise the judgment without Jesus for sin is separation from God which is lost souls..... See the cross of Jesus was a good thing , means the devil authority for the man is judged and God puts coal on the devils head and bless those who repent and turn to Jesus as the judgement......
I go with hljc above. It pleased God to bruise him for our sin. God is that holy---he cannot let sin go unpunished. But the problem is, there is no innocent, spotless person that can be executed on our behalf, as we are all sinful beings. Because of that, God died in our place.
Did God the Father suffer? I'm not aware of any verse that indicates he did...but He did turn his back on the Son....and that couldn't have been easy.
om·ni·scient adjective \-shənt\1 : having infinite awareness, understanding, and insight
2 : possessed of universal or complete knowledge
Then we know he has the capacity to FEEL all suffering. I believe all the suffering in Creation is felt by God.
God is said to have the ability to be grieved. The only way for me to relate to that is the fact that I too am acquainted
with grief, as was Jesus. I think if people thought about God in a more personal sense they would be a lot closer to knowing him in Spirit and truth.
God does not suffer. Suffering is a human condition. If God could suffer, he would have suffered by not sending His Son to redeem the world. By dying for us, Christ brought us to God which would be cause for rejoicing by God (and us!).
om·ni·scient adjective \-shənt\1 : having infinite awareness, understanding, and insight
2 : possessed of universal or complete knowledge
Then we know he has the capacity to FEEL all suffering. I believe all the suffering in Creation is felt by God.
God is said to have the ability to be grieved. The only way for me to relate to that is the fact that I too am acquainted
with grief, as was Jesus. I think if people thought about God in a more personal sense they would be a lot closer to knowing him in Spirit and truth.
I see it a bit differently. I think God understands our suffering, but that doesn't mean he suffers too. God understands our sins, but does he sin?
I believe it did to some degree. When the temple curtain ripped, it symbolized one of two things or both:
1. It destroyed the barrier between man and God
2. I've heard from a Jewish source that the Temple curtain represented God's Robe and in that culture, a father would tear his robe out of misery or when one of his children died.
om·ni·scient adjective \-shənt\1 : having infinite awareness, understanding, and insight
2 : possessed of universal or complete knowledge
Then we know he has the capacity to FEEL all suffering. I believe all the suffering in Creation is felt by God.
God is said to have the ability to be grieved. The only way for me to relate to that is the fact that I too am acquainted
with grief, as was Jesus. I think if people thought about God in a more personal sense they would be a lot closer to knowing him in Spirit and truth.
Your insight serves you well yet again, Heartsong. Suffering as we humans understand it is unique to consciousness. It is not merely a reaction to the pain sensors of our body . . . it is our capacity for "knowing" we are suffering (or others are) that results from our consciousness. God is consciousness . . . so ALL suffering becomes God's suffering as well . . . just as we suffer when we know of others' suffering. Suffering is entirely a phenomenon of consciousness . . . just as the knowledge of Good and Evil is.
If Jesus is God in human form, did God the Father experience suffering during the moment of his crucifixion and when he was in the tomb? Either, as some might presume, as a father towards his son, or, as part of a greater suffering caused to the Godhead.
I hear two different angles on this. That God sacrificed something that was precious to Him, which was also himself, and this caused him pain. Or that God himself, the Father as well as the Son, bore the sins unto himself.
But if he's in control of everything and has the power to forgive sins, it would seem odd he would deliberately cause himself needless suffering. That's if an all-powerful God can truly suffer.
What do you think?
Here's what I think: God the Father suffered tremendously when His Son was being sacrificed for us. Here's a snippet (from a sermon by LDS Apostle, Melvin J. Ballard) that expresses my feelings better than I can myself:
“In that hour I think I can see our dear Father behind the veil looking upon [His Son's] dying struggles until even He could not endure it any longer, and like the mother who bids farewell to her dying child, has to be taken out of the room, so as not to look upon the last struggles, so He bowed His head, and hid in some part of His universe, He great heart almost breaking for the love that He had for His Son.”
It was probably at this moment when Christ, for the first and only time in His life, could no longer feel the all-encompassing presence of His Father. I suspect that's when he cried out in despair, "My God, why hast thou forsaken me?"
Last edited by Katzpur; 02-01-2013 at 08:50 AM..
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