U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-23-2007, 11:51 AM
 
Location: Temporary on Earth for a little while
320 posts, read 815,217 times
Reputation: 178

Advertisements

Are our churches "lukewarm"?

I don't know about you but i feel that the churches nowadays are just a money market filled with the power of greed. (just like the government ).

Its always a competion between churches (who can build the biggest and nicest churches,etc... ?)

There are so many churches that i have been to that are so power hungry. The leadership is not in God's will anymore, therefore, the preachers preach messages and sermons about "what people want to hear instead of what people 'NEED' to hear". This makes the church lukewarm and not on fire for God. "LUKEWARM"

i ask myself, " Does not GOd say that he will spue them out of his mouth?

And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
Revelation 3:14-19 (KJV)


I know that we, as christians, should be on fire for God, but it's sad when the leadership of the church aren't. I personally feel this way becsue of the atmosphere and they was they present themselves.

I am not just speaking about a specific church here. I am generalizing them. I have personally been to so many different churches and most of them have the same outcome "LUKEWARM" and even freezing temperatures!

What do we as christians do about this? Leave the church ? and find another church or another or another? What can we do other then "pray"?


I have known pastors that sued his congregation. He STILL preaches up at the pulpit to this day "unchanged" STILL threatening people to sue them. He is still in power due to his loyal "subjects" as one would call them. They support him with money they pay to him every month as a pastor. And he only puts people to preach only if they support him and give very big contributions. If i wasn't so strong in my faith, i would have left the Christian church a long time ago due to these heretics.

It's sad because nowadays, the congregation is being let astray blindingly by their leadership. Everything is acceptable in church ... They have permitted the gate to be wide and easy. Matthew 7:13-14 says, "Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter it are many. for the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few. " life is not easy . The church nowadys makes it so wide and narrow leading innocent people astray that don't know better. This is another cause of our chrurches being "LUKEWARM".



Before you answer to this thread, please don't tell me to shop around for a different church. i have been there and done that. I am asking for advice on what i can do to help the church. I know i am called to be in this church right now. Am i just supposed to just sit back and watch the church die little by little? I don't hate the church , i honestly love it , that's why i am so passionate about it. I don't want any of these people to lose their salvation.


It honestly just irritates me that the church has made the holy temple of God and business instead of a place of true worship... did Jesus not get mad at these types of people in his church? He got angry without sin.
Isaiah 29:13 " and the Lord said, "Because this people draw near with their mouth and honor me with their lips, while their hearts are far from me. and their fear of me is a commandment taught by men. "

Yes we as Christians should be imitators of Christ, but i find it hard to worship God knowing that the leadership do not care about the flock. I do go to church to meet Jesus. But how can i meet Jesus when the guy preaching up at the pulpit doesn't know Jesus himself? How can he , in fact , be led by the spirit when he doesn't practice what he preaches? This affects the whole church. Making it LUKEWARM.


I know i wrote alot and i still have so much to say but for the purpose of opening up more topics and making this subject more complex then it already is, i will let you all talk please share if you experienced something like this before and have some advice. Thank you

Last edited by girleylips; 10-23-2007 at 12:05 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:06 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,531 posts, read 13,535,159 times
Reputation: 1560
I do not believe in churches, but I've learned to always fight for the things I believe in.
Maybe it is time for you to take an active stance or perhaps even more of a leadership role to change the temperature in your church?
I assume that it will be very difficult, because the current leadership seems to have personal followers with deep pockets.

Anyway, it might be time for you to stand up and fight for what you believe in?

I suggest you either fight or flee, because lingering around and not doing anything might make you feel passive and depressed.
At least that is my experience.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Texas
8,666 posts, read 18,711,257 times
Reputation: 21246
My first impression is just that maybe you haven't been in the right churches lately!

Also, I think it's important not to be hasty about judging the intents and motives of leadership. In the absence of overt sin or heresy, I think we should give them the benefit of the doubt so to speak, that they are doing the best they know to do. Now if they are in serious error, etc....horse of a different color. And sometimes it is the will of God for us to be elsewhere even when the leadership is OK. Does that make sense? Maybe you personally just need something more.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Mississippi
3,927 posts, read 7,204,012 times
Reputation: 11374
I get where she is coming from. I, too, have found that many churches are that way today and I do believe it is so sutle that many don't realize it. Let's call a spade a spade here, when you have the Southern Baptist Association sitting there working up an agenda that they pass along to all the churches under them, and producing themes that they should all be preaching on so that, if you were to go to ten different churches that are under the SBA association on any given day, you would basically hear the same theme of message being preached. Is this God called? I think not, it is SBA called.

Yet, in order to keep in line with the Sunday school books and tie this in with preaching, this has been done in many churches.

What about current events happening in a communty that renders the pastor on his knees asking GOd to give him an answer, so he can preach on it that Sunday? Does this even exist anymore?

Sadly, not in too many places....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:40 PM
 
Location: Temporary on Earth for a little while
320 posts, read 815,217 times
Reputation: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
I do not believe in churches, but I've learned to always fight for the things I believe in.
Maybe it is time for you to take an active stance or perhaps even more of a leadership role to change the temperature in your church?
I assume that it will be very difficult, because the current leadership seems to have personal followers with deep pockets.

Anyway, it might be time for you to stand up and fight for what you believe in?

I suggest you either fight or flee, because lingering around and not doing anything might make you feel passive and depressed.
At least that is my experience.

yeah it has made me very depressed...i mean i just want to know how i go about doing something. I know i am called to be at this church. i just want the atmosphere to change. i want people to pray when there is prayer time in church and i want people to be real.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:45 PM
 
Location: All around the world.....
2,886 posts, read 6,934,413 times
Reputation: 1031
Quote:
Originally Posted by girleylips View Post
Are our churches "lukewarm"?

I don't know about you but i feel that the churches nowadays are just a money market filled with the power of greed. (just like the government ).

Its always a competion between churches (who can build the biggest and nicest churches,etc... ?)

There are so many churches that i have been to that are so power hungry. The leadership is not in God's will anymore, therefore, the preachers preach messages and sermons about "what people want to hear instead of what people 'NEED' to hear". This makes the church lukewarm and not on fire for God. "LUKEWARM"

i ask myself, " Does not GOd say that he will spue them out of his mouth?

And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
Revelation 3:14-19 (KJV)


I know that we, as christians, should be on fire for God, but it's sad when the leadership of the church aren't. I personally feel this way becsue of the atmosphere and they was they present themselves.

I am not just speaking about a specific church here. I am generalizing them. I have personally been to so many different churches and most of them have the same outcome "LUKEWARM" and even freezing temperatures!

What do we as christians do about this? Leave the church ? and find another church or another or another? What can we do other then "pray"?


I have known pastors that sued his congregation. He STILL preaches up at the pulpit to this day "unchanged" STILL threatening people to sue them. He is still in power due to his loyal "subjects" as one would call them. They support him with money they pay to him every month as a pastor. And he only puts people to preach only if they support him and give very big contributions. If i wasn't so strong in my faith, i would have left the Christian church a long time ago due to these heretics.

It's sad because nowadays, the congregation is being let astray blindingly by their leadership. Everything is acceptable in church ... They have permitted the gate to be wide and easy. Matthew 7:13-14 says, "Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter it are many. for the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few. " life is not easy . The church nowadys makes it so wide and narrow leading innocent people astray that don't know better. This is another cause of our chrurches being "LUKEWARM".



Before you answer to this thread, please don't tell me to shop around for a different church. i have been there and done that. I am asking for advice on what i can do to help the church. I know i am called to be in this church right now. Am i just supposed to just sit back and watch the church die little by little? I don't hate the church , i honestly love it , that's why i am so passionate about it. I don't want any of these people to lose their salvation.


It honestly just irritates me that the church has made the holy temple of God and business instead of a place of true worship... did Jesus not get mad at these types of people in his church? He got angry without sin.
Isaiah 29:13 " and the Lord said, "Because this people draw near with their mouth and honor me with their lips, while their hearts are far from me. and their fear of me is a commandment taught by men. "

Yes we as Christians should be imitators of Christ, but i find it hard to worship God knowing that the leadership do not care about the flock. I do go to church to meet Jesus. But how can i meet Jesus when the guy preaching up at the pulpit doesn't know Jesus himself? How can he , in fact , be led by the spirit when he doesn't practice what he preaches? This affects the whole church. Making it LUKEWARM.


I know i wrote alot and i still have so much to say but for the purpose of opening up more topics and making this subject more complex then it already is, i will let you all talk please share if you experienced something like this before and have some advice. Thank you
Quote:
It's sad because nowadays, the congregation is being let astray blindingly by their leadership. Everything is acceptable in church ... They have permitted the gate to be wide and easy. Matthew 7:13-14 says, "Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter it are many. for the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few. " life is not easy . The church nowadys makes it so wide and narrow leading innocent people astray that don't know better. This is another cause of our chrurches being "LUKEWARM".


Well you've said a mouthful; I don't quite know which topic to pick first!!;
But I have to start somewhere so it might as well be this;
Matthew 7:13 is it. We are walking a tightrope" plain and simple, But this it is our confidence.girleylips"

16 and I will ask the Father, and another Comforter He will give to you, that he may remain with you--to the age; 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world is not able to receive, because it doth not behold him, nor know him, and ye know him, because he doth remain with you, and shall be in you.


John 14:16-17 (YLT)

This is how we get through it and enjoy the trip
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:47 PM
 
Location: Temporary on Earth for a little while
320 posts, read 815,217 times
Reputation: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaykay View Post
My first impression is just that maybe you haven't been in the right churches lately!

Also, I think it's important not to be hasty about judging the intents and motives of leadership. In the absence of overt sin or heresy, I think we should give them the benefit of the doubt so to speak, that they are doing the best they know to do. Now if they are in serious error, etc....horse of a different color. And sometimes it is the will of God for us to be elsewhere even when the leadership is OK. Does that make sense? Maybe you personally just need something more.


i understand what you are saying but sadly i won;t give them the benefit of the doubt anymore because i know and have tested out their motives....i have been going to the right churches. i dont think you are understanding the issue here...what can we as christians do to help in the current church they are in.? ?if everyone flees i am not a kind of person that just will flee from church to church to church anymore. I won't let it fly by like everything is okay when they are not okay i have seen these things with my own eyes and this is what the pastors literally do nowadays.... i will not be blind to this.
....and continue on going in my way. thank you for your opinion though
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Temporary on Earth for a little while
320 posts, read 815,217 times
Reputation: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiangel_writer View Post
I get where she is coming from. I, too, have found that many churches are that way today and I do believe it is so sutle that many don't realize it. Let's call a spade a spade here, when you have the Southern Baptist Association sitting there working up an agenda that they pass along to all the churches under them, and producing themes that they should all be preaching on so that, if you were to go to ten different churches that are under the SBA association on any given day, you would basically hear the same theme of message being preached. Is this God called? I think not, it is SBA called.

Yet, in order to keep in line with the Sunday school books and tie this in with preaching, this has been done in many churches.

What about current events happening in a communty that renders the pastor on his knees asking GOd to give him an answer, so he can preach on it that Sunday? Does this even exist anymore?

Sadly, not in too many places....



i agree with you and it hurts me inside because they don't let the spirit of GOd truely work anymore i received Christ a long time ago and i love him) i am sure his heart is hurting as well to see his church this way. we don;t have reliable pastors to tend the flock anymore....i mean there are still a few out there that still keep the narrow road....thanks for your input...it helped me out alot to know that other people see it too and are not just turning thierr face away from what is really going on in church
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:51 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,531 posts, read 13,535,159 times
Reputation: 1560
You could talk with others of your church about your concerns.
You don't necessarily have to say anything negative.
For example; you could ask them to comment about your statement about the church being lukewarm.
This way you at least are doing something. And it always helps to get the opinion of others who go to your church.
You could also ask them why they have their opinion.

I mean begin with taking small steps.
Every journey, great or small, begins with the 1st step anyway.

It seems I was mistaken about your 1st step.
Your 1st step was talking about it here on the board, the 2nd step is to talk with your fellow churchgoers.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-23-2007, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Temporary on Earth for a little while
320 posts, read 815,217 times
Reputation: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by yhwhshalomjr View Post

Well you've said a mouthful; I don't quite know which topic to pick first!!;
But I have to start somewhere so it might as well be this;
Matthew 7:13 is it. We are walking a tightrope" plain and simple, But this it is our confidence.girleylips"

16 and I will ask the Father, and another Comforter He will give to you, that he may remain with you--to the age; 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world is not able to receive, because it doth not behold him, nor know him, and ye know him, because he doth remain with you, and shall be in you.


John 14:16-17 (YLT)
This is how we get through it and enjoy the trip


amen to that but alot of people in the church don't know better ...you know what i mean....they believe everything they hear from the pulpit. they don't know how to test out the pastor. yes i know that God is in me and i test out and look at scripture if the pastor is preaching according to the bible. i just feel bad for the new believers cause they don't know better
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $99,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2017, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 - Top