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Old 03-08-2013, 06:45 AM
 
7,780 posts, read 13,135,220 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sizzly Friddle View Post
Gravity is experienced identically for everyone.
God is not.
The two are not comparable.

I do not consider living forever to be an option at all.
You and I would also experience the grand canyon differently but the grand canyon IS the grand canyon. There is but one God and eternity is not optional.
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Old 03-08-2013, 11:14 AM
 
4,445 posts, read 2,184,442 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sizzly Friddle View Post
The question is-
If I don't want to live forever, what does Christianity have to offer me?
In Jesus 'Sermon on the Mount' Jesus gave an appeal to principles that when they govern our lives they become living principles which the world in general is void of those righteous principles of morality and behavior. Sow good reap good.
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Old 03-08-2013, 01:04 PM
 
Location: Denver, Colorado U.S.A.
14,174 posts, read 22,226,820 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
You're going to, either way. Either in heaven or hell.

I can guarantee you can't pass a "good person test", though. God's standard is perfection. If you've ever lied, stolen, gotten angry unjustly, lusted, used his name in vain....you've sinned. You're going to go to hell w/out Jesus.
Yes, because good people deserve an eternity of pain, but jerks who "got saved" deserve an eternity of bliss

The fact is, nobody knows what happens after we die. My best guess is that most religions are at lease someone off-base with their predictions of the afterlife. Studying near death experiences is probably the closest thing you'll find to any idea of what happens.
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Old 03-08-2013, 05:09 PM
 
367 posts, read 276,124 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denverian View Post
Yes, because good people deserve an eternity of pain, but jerks who "got saved" deserve an eternity of bliss
Oh no! Jerks like you and I deserve and eternity of pain too! We who are saved will escape our just reward.
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Old 03-08-2013, 06:19 PM
 
Location: Rivendell
1,387 posts, read 2,088,398 times
Reputation: 1638
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
In Jesus 'Sermon on the Mount' Jesus gave an appeal to principles that when they govern our lives they become living principles which the world in general is void of those righteous principles of morality and behavior. Sow good reap good.
So the only moral people are Christians? And if I were a Christian I would be a more moral person?
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Old 03-08-2013, 06:23 PM
 
Location: Rivendell
1,387 posts, read 2,088,398 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207 View Post
You and I would also experience the grand canyon differently but the grand canyon IS the grand canyon. There is but one God and eternity is not optional.
Anybody can experience the Grand Canyon. There are no special rules to do so. The dimensions of the Grand Canyon are not up for debate. The nature of God is.
Yet another invalid analogy.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:09 PM
 
Location: Up above the world so high!
45,270 posts, read 85,104,254 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sizzly Friddle View Post
Anybody can experience the Grand Canyon. There are no special rules to do so. The dimensions of the Grand Canyon are not up for debate. The nature of God is.
Yet another invalid analogy.
His point was that not everyone can or will experience the Grand Canyon exactly the same way.

Having been there and "done that" I can so get the point you missed.

His analogy is actually brilliant in my opinion.

You see, there really are some "special rules" you apparently aren't aware of for experiencing the best of the Grand Canyon - going down into the Canyon itself.

Sure, anyone can drive into the park and peer out over the rim, but you aren't even experiencing HALF of what the canyon is all about if that's all you do - which btw, is what the vast majority of visitors to the Grand Canyon do. (Kind of reminds me of so many people who only ever give God a passing glance too).

Some will venture down a trail for a few hours and have a definitely more tactile, sensory experience - but only a fraction of all the people who actually get to the Grand Canyon every year will actually hike across it from rim to rim.

Which is a real shame, because the most amazing and sublime part of the whole Grand Canyon experience is what people see from down on the floor of the canyon - more than 10,000 feet in elevation below those rims.

See, every year, tens of thousands of people request permits to make that approximate 3 day trip across the canyon but only 13,000 permits are granted. Special rules and all...

I beg to differ that the "nature of God is up for debate", for it is no more up for debate than the existence and splendor and wonder of the Grand Canyon itself!

But if you never make the journey down into the heart of a thing, you'll never really know or even truly appreciate what you are missing
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Old 03-09-2013, 09:54 AM
 
Location: Rivendell
1,387 posts, read 2,088,398 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sizzly Friddle View Post
Anybody can experience the Grand Canyon. There are no special rules to do so. The dimensions of the Grand Canyon are not up for debate. The nature of God is.
Yet another invalid analogy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovesMountains View Post
His point was that not everyone can or will experience the Grand Canyon exactly the same way.

Having been there and "done that" I can so get the point you missed.

His analogy is actually brilliant in my opinion.

You see, there really are some "special rules" you apparently aren't aware of for experiencing the best of the Grand Canyon - going down into the Canyon itself.

Sure, anyone can drive into the park and peer out over the rim, but you aren't even experiencing HALF of what the canyon is all about if that's all you do - which btw, is what the vast majority of visitors to the Grand Canyon do. (Kind of reminds me of so many people who only ever give God a passing glance too).

Some will venture down a trail for a few hours and have a definitely more tactile, sensory experience - but only a fraction of all the people who actually get to the Grand Canyon every year will actually hike across it from rim to rim.

Which is a real shame, because the most amazing and sublime part of the whole Grand Canyon experience is what people see from down on the floor of the canyon - more than 10,000 feet in elevation below those rims.

See, every year, tens of thousands of people request permits to make that approximate 3 day trip across the canyon but only 13,000 permits are granted. Special rules and all...

I beg to differ that the "nature of God is up for debate", for it is no more up for debate than the existence and splendor and wonder of the Grand Canyon itself!

But if you never make the journey down into the heart of a thing, you'll never really know or even truly appreciate what you are missing
My point stands. Anybody can experience the Grand Canyon. Whether or not their experiences are the same as another matters not.
It is concrete and real, visible to anyone.
God is not experienced (with very rare exceptions) by those who were not raised to believe in it.

We must not be reading posts in the same forum if you think the nature of God is not debated.
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Old 03-09-2013, 06:27 PM
 
36,761 posts, read 24,686,955 times
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Default What if I don't want to live forever?

No one knows, Sizzly . . . but I suspect that if you really don't . . . you won't. I am fairly certain that all the positives that we hold in our consciousness as "loves, preferences, etc." will be controlling. I'm fairly sure the negatives will be refined out as dross. But I believe we really do create our own after life . . . for better or worse depending on what we have reaped and must ultimately sow. We cannot unthink our thoughts, unfeel our feelings and undo our doings . . . all of which are permanent residents within our cumulative consciousness. I think it truly will be a function of "garbage in garbage out" and similar aphorisms.
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Old 03-11-2013, 09:19 PM
 
Location: Rivendell
1,387 posts, read 2,088,398 times
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I feel like I haven't asked my question the right way, or maybe the whole concept of religion is so alien to me that I just don't "get it".

Most people here are telling me that I get an afterlife. Some say there is a hell, some say there isn't. I get that. That is what Christians believe. I am not a Christian. I do not believe in any sort of afterlife. I do not believe in souls.

Just suppose that I was really interested in Christianity, and I wanted to know what the attraction is to it,
minus the concept of an afterlife.

There must be more to it than a reward of a heavenly afterlife or the threat of eternal punishment.
What is it?
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