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Old 04-29-2013, 12:42 PM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,139 posts, read 2,685,166 times
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ETERNAL PUNISHMENT CHRISTIANS VERSUS ETERNAL PUNISHMENT MUSLIMS

As most Christians already know, millions of Christians believe that millions of Muslims (and all other non-Christians too) are going to suffer forever in hell.
They believe it because that's the way they were taught by their parents and by other people on whom they relied to tell them the truth.

What many Christians do not know is that millions of Muslims believe that millions of Christians (and all non-Muslims) are going to suffer forever in hell too.
And they also believe it because that's the way they were taught by their parents and by other people on whom they relied to tell them the truth
Quote from THE AFTER LIFE IN ISLAM
"Being a Muslim does not keep one out of Hell, but non-Muslims (kafir), however, will be punished eternally."
http://www.religionfacts.com/islam/beliefs/afterlife.htm

I think that the idea of "eternal hell" may be the cause of more suffering on this earth than any other idea that exists. That is why I am so glad there is another point of view.

In the forward to his book AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS, Louis Abbott wrote,
“One key area various denominations are divided over is the final destiny of the ungodly, the wicked, the unsaved, the unregenerate, or however one wishes to phrase it.
There are three views on this subject. Each position claims Scriptural support: (1) eternal torment; (2) eternal destruction; and (3) the ultimate salvation of all. It is obvious that all cannot be correct.
I pray this book will be a blessing to all who are struggling with this subject.” (unquote)
This book can be read online at this link
AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS
An Analytical Study of Words

In my opinion the greatest of all manifestations of God's grace in action on this earth is that anyone can believe that God will let anyone choose themselves into an inescapable state of everlasting suffering and not go insane thinking about it.
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:10 PM
 
231 posts, read 243,526 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodgertutt View Post
That is why I am so glad there is another point of view.
Unfortunately, only one point of view is right in this case.
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Old 04-29-2013, 01:38 PM
 
Location: Florida -
7,910 posts, read 9,475,451 times
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You make a valid point, but, place too much emphasis on 'what parents and misguided people teach their children.' Since you seem to place such great weight in what people say, allow me to quote Mark Twain, who was neither a Christian or a Muslim (but, he was an intelligent, articulate individual able to see what was obviously stated in the Bible … without any religious bias): He said, "It's not the things that I don't understand in the Bible that give me the most trouble, but, the things that I do understand."

Ever-changing opinions and religious dogma are never as binding as a consistently, reliable “Truth Standard” - such as the Bible. Discover for yourself what God has said on this matter … since He alone has the keys to eternal life and death.

Last edited by jghorton; 04-29-2013 at 01:49 PM..
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Old 04-29-2013, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,139 posts, read 2,685,166 times
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Post What most of the early christians believed

Quote:
Originally Posted by jghorton View Post
You make a valid point, but, place too much emphasis on 'what parents and misguided people teach their children.' Since you seem to place such great weight in what people say, allow me to quote Mark Twain, who was neither a Christian or a Muslim (but, he was an intelligent, articulate individual able to see what was obviously stated in the Bible … without any religious bias): He said, "It's not the things that I don't understand in the Bible that give me the most trouble, but, the things that I do understand."

Ever-changing opinions and religious dogma are never as binding as a consistently, reliable “Truth Standard” - such as the Bible. Discover for yourself what God has said on this matter … since He alone has the keys to eternal life and death.
WHAT MOST OF THE EARLY CHRISTIANS BELIEVED
And they were reading the Bible in its original language!

Universalism:
The Prevailing Doctrine Of the Christian Church During Its First Five-Hundred Years
http://hellbusters.8m.com/updcontents.html

WHAT CHRISTIANS BELIEVE TODAY ABOUT WHAT THE BIBLE TEACHES – FOUR VIEWS
ABSOLUTE ASSURANCE IN JESUS CHRIST
http://www.richardwaynegarganta.com/4ViewsOfSalvation.htm

Last edited by rodgertutt; 04-29-2013 at 04:25 PM..
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Old 04-29-2013, 06:19 PM
 
16,244 posts, read 8,322,192 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jghorton View Post
You make a valid point, but, place too much emphasis on 'what parents and misguided people teach their children.' Since you seem to place such great weight in what people say, allow me to quote Mark Twain, who was neither a Christian or a Muslim (but, he was an intelligent, articulate individual able to see what was obviously stated in the Bible … without any religious bias): He said, "It's not the things that I don't understand in the Bible that give me the most trouble, but, the things that I do understand."

Ever-changing opinions and religious dogma are never as binding as a consistently, reliable “Truth Standard” - such as the Bible. Discover for yourself what God has said on this matter … since He alone has the keys to eternal life and death.
Mark Twain has some interesting quotes, but here is one from Mahatma Gandhi.

"A man is but the product of his thoughts, what he thinks, he becomes."

Interesting that it goes along with
Proverbs, chapter 23, verse 7: "As a man thinketh in his heart, so is he."
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Old 04-30-2013, 03:42 AM
 
Location: Germany
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There is a verse in the koran that states that Christians and Jews believe that future punishment is only for a few days and that they are in error therein, does anybody knows where the koran says so, which sura it is?

PS: I seem to have found it, 3:24

"That is because they say, "Never will the Fire touch us except for [a few] numbered days," and [because] they were deluded in their religion by what they were inventing."

I remembered it differently.

Last edited by svenM; 04-30-2013 at 03:52 AM..
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:13 AM
 
875 posts, read 684,398 times
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Quote:
In my opinion the greatest of all manifestations of God's grace in action on this earth is that anyone can believe that God will let anyone choose themselves into an inescapable state of everlasting suffering and not go insane thinking about it.


Roger, I can't wrap my mind around this either. How so many christians can go about their business thinking that most of the people around them are going to burn forever yet its business as usual. They had their chances they will say. God is just they will say. God has to punish them they will say.

I also think your underestimating , if thats possible, the damage the teaching of hell has done. I am even open to the possibility it is the great lie or deception that Revelation warned us about. If the foundation is flawed, so is everything else. That's why the church has little to no power these days.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:48 AM
 
231 posts, read 243,526 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero 7 View Post
God is just they will say.
haha...any parent who does not punish their children for their disobedience is a bad parent, any judge who does not punish a criminal for their crimes is a bad judge, but any God who does punish a man for his sins is a bad God.
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Old 04-30-2013, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
3,139 posts, read 2,685,166 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckd83 View Post
haha...any parent who does not punish their children for their disobedience is a bad parent, any judge who does not punish a criminal for their crimes is a bad judge, but any God who does punish a man for his sins is a bad God.
I like how Ray Prinzing would probably respond to your post Chuck.

In DIVINE INWORKINGS – ALL IN ALL – RAY PRINZING wrote

“We would not minimize the judgments of God, but the more the spirit of revelation unfolds the truth, the more we see God’s judgments in proper perspective, that they are remedial, corrective in their nature and used to bring forth a state of righteousness. They shall not be executed in unholy vengeance, for MERCY shall balance the score. God’s judgments are ever tempered with mercy, and when they have fulfilled their purpose, the judgments end. Mercy will outlast all the judgments, and will rejoice in the ultimate restoration of all that was perverted, corrupt, and evil."

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Old 04-30-2013, 12:27 PM
 
231 posts, read 243,526 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodgertutt View Post
I like how Ray Prinzing would probably respond to your post Chuck.

In DIVINE INWORKINGS – ALL IN ALL – RAY PRINZING wrote

“We would not minimize the judgments of God, but the more the spirit of revelation unfolds the truth, the more we see God’s judgments in proper perspective, that they are remedial, corrective in their nature and used to bring forth a state of righteousness. They shall not be executed in unholy vengeance, for MERCY shall balance the score. God’s judgments are ever tempered with mercy, and when they have fulfilled their purpose, the judgments end. Mercy will outlast all the judgments, and will rejoice in the ultimate restoration of all that was perverted, corrupt, and evil."

That must have come from Matt. 25:47 or Rom. 9:22b or 2 Thess. 1:9b. One key piece of information left off.
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