U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-14-2007, 10:38 PM
 
Location: Cary, NC
2,408 posts, read 9,819,058 times
Reputation: 1371

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marks View Post
I don't because it's origins are deeply rooted in it. The problem is, people will not do the proper research to see if these things are so. I have, and the answers are quite real. christmas
Those arguments have been tossed around before and quite frankly, don't have a lot of weight. Maybe we shouldn't go to church on Sundays because there's no biblical doctrine for going to church on Sundays.

And to be totally honest, the writer lost all credibility with me when he/she called referred to the Roman Catholic church as a cult.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-08-2007, 08:48 PM
 
Location: West Coast USA
1,577 posts, read 1,842,796 times
Reputation: 3135
I am a believer who doesn't do Christmas and who, admittedly, simply doesn't like Christmas and its traditions, but I do tire of the beligerant attitudes some of us take toward those who do it. Of course, I also tire of the militance of those who insist that everyone must celebrate their holiday. But, the fact is that I used to be that way, too -- constantly trying to reeducate others in what I knew.

What really bothers me is those who insist that others greet them according to their beliefs and name things according to their ideas. I am thankful for the believers who can have a conversation regarding these things without getting their santa hats all in a twist, who can ask questions and accept the answers giving their own insights, and who can debate them without getting crazy.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 03:14 PM
 
21 posts, read 49,058 times
Reputation: 22
Post Christians should be warring ....

to stop CHRISTMAS at all cost. Do your homework. Do a google using "Christmas not Christian", and "reasons I do not celebrate Christmas" and you will come up with many, many sound reasons and TRUTH about what Christmas is really about and WHY we as Christians should have NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. We finally gave it up in it's entirety about 7 years ago, after we took everything out of it that was not TRUE.........all we had left was a day as usual WORSHIPPING with our lives KING JESUS.

It is not in the bible.

It is taking the name of the Lord in Vain.........he is not dead. There are many names of Christ/GOD/JESUS in the WORD, but not one of them is CHRISTMAS.

Santa = Satan

He was not born on Dec. 25th.......DECEIT = there is not shadow of darkness or deceit in HIM.

It is SELF INDULGENT = He said: DENY YOURSELVES

It is pagan = not scriptural (no disciple or anyone else in the WORD talks about anything but the HOLY DAYS of God in the Bible. Do a google...you can find out what the RIGHT WAY TO WORSHIP GOD IS.

MANY, MANY, MANY pagan rituals in it = green tree, holly, the list is ENDLESS

The GOD of MONEY is worshipped.

SELF, SELF, SELF.

Who really has a Birthday party for someone and brings everyone a gift but the BIRTHDAY HONORED ANYWAY ?

God told us in HIS WORD not to learn the way of the HEATHENS.

It's all distored.........wrapped up in a very THIN LAYER OF CHRISTIANTY and THE BIRTH STORY.........= doesn't satan always make the deception PRETTY AS A PICTURE........with some LIGHT/WORD in it ? Otherwise, we wouldn't buy it.

OUR GOD is PERFECT in all HIS WAYS.......why on earth if HE wanted this HULLABALOO to go on in HIS NAME and for HIS BIRTHDAY, didn't HE TELL US WHEN THAT WAS and HOW TO DO IT ? MISTAKE ? NOT !!! Christians should be FIGHTING TO TAKE CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS because HE NEVER WAS IN IT. He is not DEAD = MASS - CHRISTMAS - I will not use that term.....taking HIS NAME IN VAIN. The LOST, the HEATHEN, THE WORLD knows all this better than the Christians......shame on us Christians for leading the world to hell in a handbasket of SELF INDULGENGE, MALLS, WORSHIP OF MONEY, DECOR, THINGS, all in JESUS name of course....and how does that bring Glory to HIM ? It really is all so simple and so clear once you STUDY and understand the TRUTH. He said HE WAS THE TRUTH and HE DID NOT ONCE SAY ANYTHING about this CHRISTMAS STUFF nor call HIS NAME by it.

They did not celebrate birthdays in those days: = the day a man died was the day they held honor.........just as when Christ Died.......the condition of a man's soul when he died.....was what mattered.......not when he was born.
SELF INDULGENGE again.......the BIRTHDAY IS also.

MONEY, MONEY, MONEY..........= the ROOT OF ALL EVIL

There are literally dozens of reasons for NOT KEEPING CHRISTMAS (x-mas) to me now.........so if you really are a born again believer, I challenge you to seek the TRUTH (if you really are a TRUTH SEEKER). Study it........it's everywhere........not hidden.......we are just sooooo gullible we'll buy anything.....probably even the mark of the beast.......which will come from a man who is chasmatic (light) speaks peace (word) and appears as LIGHT.......but is from the darkest pit of hell.

YOUR FLESH will have to DIE a 1,000 deaths to OBEY THIS TRUTH, but your life will change drastically for it. HE blesses those who worship HIM in SPIRIT AND TRUTH ONLY.........we cannot worship HIM anyway we want to.

Santa is a LIE - ALL liars go to hell

Parents who lead little one's astray are better off to have a millstone (about 1,000 lbs) tied around the neck and thrown into the sea the WORD says.

Take everything that is NOT in the BIBLE away from CHRISTMAS and see what you have left...........that's what we did.

We had the story of JESUS BIRTH..........and another ordinary day to worship HIM with our lives. That's ALL. IT IS NOT IN THE WORD.......so THEREFORE WE DO NOT DO IT.

WE also do not celebrate EASTER.............do another GOOGLE SEARCH.....the TRUTH is right there in PLAIN SIGHT.

We do not celebrate any holidays.

GOD FORGIVE US ALL for letting our FLESH RULE and not even LOOKING/SEARCHING for the TRUTH, for HE SAID we would find IT/HIM when we search for it with ALL OUR HEARTS.

MAY GOD BLESS YOU AS YOU SEEK HIS TRUTH AND HIS ALONE.......if you really are a CHRISTIAN.

DENY YOURSELVES..............take up your CROSS (an instrument of pain and suffering and dying to self/flesh) and FOLLOW ME.

We now KEEP THE HOLY DAYS of the WORD and that's all. We have been highly favored and blessed since doing so and supporting ISRAEL with all our efforts.

GOD BLESS ALL.............HE IS THE WAY, THE "TRUTH" and the LIFE !

No lies, no deceit, no adding to, no darkness, no indulgence, no self worship, no WORLDLINESS, (an enemy to CHRIST), No pagan rituals, no make believe birthdates (lies, deceit) in HIM.

HE SAID, "MY PEOPLE "PERISH" for lack of KNOWLEDGE'".

How easy it will be for the anti-christ to fool and deceive.....!!!

I am a BORN AGAIN, SPIRIT FILLED PROTESTANT CHILD OF THE MOST HIGH GOD...........a BAPTIST to be direct ! Not some strange religion or entity, just for the RECORD.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 03:40 PM
 
7,780 posts, read 13,476,969 times
Reputation: 3452
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shug58 View Post
to stop CHRISTMAS at all cost. Do your homework. Do a google using "Christmas not Christian", and "reasons I do not celebrate Christmas" and you will come up with many, many sound reasons and TRUTH about what Christmas is really about and WHY we as Christians should have NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. We finally gave it up in it's entirety about 7 years ago, after we took everything out of it that was not TRUE.........all we had left was a day as usual WORSHIPPING with our lives KING JESUS.

It is not in the bible.

It is taking the name of the Lord in Vain.........he is not dead. There are many names of Christ/GOD/JESUS in the WORD, but not one of them is CHRISTMAS.

Santa = Satan

He was not born on Dec. 25th.......DECEIT = there is not shadow of darkness or deceit in HIM.

It is SELF INDULGENT = He said: DENY YOURSELVES

It is pagan = not scriptural (no disciple or anyone else in the WORD talks about anything but the HOLY DAYS of God in the Bible. Do a google...you can find out what the RIGHT WAY TO WORSHIP GOD IS.

MANY, MANY, MANY pagan rituals in it = green tree, holly, the list is ENDLESS

The GOD of MONEY is worshipped.

SELF, SELF, SELF.

Who really has a Birthday party for someone and brings everyone a gift but the BIRTHDAY HONORED ANYWAY ?

God told us in HIS WORD not to learn the way of the HEATHENS.

It's all distored.........wrapped up in a very THIN LAYER OF CHRISTIANTY and THE BIRTH STORY.........= doesn't satan always make the deception PRETTY AS A PICTURE........with some LIGHT/WORD in it ? Otherwise, we wouldn't buy it.

OUR GOD is PERFECT in all HIS WAYS.......why on earth if HE wanted this HULLABALOO to go on in HIS NAME and for HIS BIRTHDAY, didn't HE TELL US WHEN THAT WAS and HOW TO DO IT ? MISTAKE ? NOT !!! Christians should be FIGHTING TO TAKE CHRIST out of CHRISTMAS because HE NEVER WAS IN IT. He is not DEAD = MASS - CHRISTMAS - I will not use that term.....taking HIS NAME IN VAIN. The LOST, the HEATHEN, THE WORLD knows all this better than the Christians......shame on us Christians for leading the world to hell in a handbasket of SELF INDULGENGE, MALLS, WORSHIP OF MONEY, DECOR, THINGS, all in JESUS name of course....and how does that bring Glory to HIM ? It really is all so simple and so clear once you STUDY and understand the TRUTH. He said HE WAS THE TRUTH and HE DID NOT ONCE SAY ANYTHING about this CHRISTMAS STUFF nor call HIS NAME by it.

They did not celebrate birthdays in those days: = the day a man died was the day they held honor.........just as when Christ Died.......the condition of a man's soul when he died.....was what mattered.......not when he was born.
SELF INDULGENGE again.......the BIRTHDAY IS also.

MONEY, MONEY, MONEY..........= the ROOT OF ALL EVIL

There are literally dozens of reasons for NOT KEEPING CHRISTMAS (x-mas) to me now.........so if you really are a born again believer, I challenge you to seek the TRUTH (if you really are a TRUTH SEEKER). Study it........it's everywhere........not hidden.......we are just sooooo gullible we'll buy anything.....probably even the mark of the beast.......which will come from a man who is chasmatic (light) speaks peace (word) and appears as LIGHT.......but is from the darkest pit of hell.

YOUR FLESH will have to DIE a 1,000 deaths to OBEY THIS TRUTH, but your life will change drastically for it. HE blesses those who worship HIM in SPIRIT AND TRUTH ONLY.........we cannot worship HIM anyway we want to.

Santa is a LIE - ALL liars go to hell

Parents who lead little one's astray are better off to have a millstone (about 1,000 lbs) tied around the neck and thrown into the sea the WORD says.

Take everything that is NOT in the BIBLE away from CHRISTMAS and see what you have left...........that's what we did.

We had the story of JESUS BIRTH..........and another ordinary day to worship HIM with our lives. That's ALL. IT IS NOT IN THE WORD.......so THEREFORE WE DO NOT DO IT.

WE also do not celebrate EASTER.............do another GOOGLE SEARCH.....the TRUTH is right there in PLAIN SIGHT.

We do not celebrate any holidays.

GOD FORGIVE US ALL for letting our FLESH RULE and not even LOOKING/SEARCHING for the TRUTH, for HE SAID we would find IT/HIM when we search for it with ALL OUR HEARTS.

MAY GOD BLESS YOU AS YOU SEEK HIS TRUTH AND HIS ALONE.......if you really are a CHRISTIAN.

DENY YOURSELVES..............take up your CROSS (an instrument of pain and suffering and dying to self/flesh) and FOLLOW ME.

We now KEEP THE HOLY DAYS of the WORD and that's all. We have been highly favored and blessed since doing so and supporting ISRAEL with all our efforts.

GOD BLESS ALL.............HE IS THE WAY, THE "TRUTH" and the LIFE !

No lies, no deceit, no adding to, no darkness, no indulgence, no self worship, no WORLDLINESS, (an enemy to CHRIST), No pagan rituals, no make believe birthdates (lies, deceit) in HIM.

HE SAID, "MY PEOPLE "PERISH" for lack of KNOWLEDGE'".

How easy it will be for the anti-christ to fool and deceive.....!!!

I am a BORN AGAIN, SPIRIT FILLED PROTESTANT CHILD OF THE MOST HIGH GOD...........a BAPTIST to be direct ! Not some strange religion or entity, just for the RECORD.
OK.

So if you take a random day and dedicate it to the Lord, it's a pagen, Satan-fest?

Are you suggesting that what was meant for evil, God can't make for good?

Gen 50:20 comes to mind. If Christians can take a pagan holiday and commit to honoring Jesus the Christ, who are you to tell them they aren't actually honoring God? I can honor God on Boxing Day in Canada and if my heart is right, God is glorified.

Same for Christmas.

It's all about your heart.

Last edited by Alpha8207; 12-10-2007 at 05:55 PM.. Reason: corrected verse number-thanks Jess5
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 04:11 PM
 
174 posts, read 450,712 times
Reputation: 168
To be zealous for the things and truth of the Lord is highly commendable. It is even more valuable in this age where so much confusion has entered into the church and the doctrines of devils have been mingled to oppose the straightforward truth of the Lord. However, to assert that the setting aside of a day to remember the birth of our Saviour is pagan is incorrect. To be sure, there have been many attempts at its corruption, but to the pure of heart in their love for Christ it serves to edify; not just to the saved, but as a witness to His Glory for the world.

Here is something I'd like to share written by a very good friend of mine:

Dispelling the myth of Saturnalia....

By the beginning of December the farmer should have finished his fall planting. Now, at the time of the winter solstice (December 25 in the Julian calendar), Saturnus, the god of seed and sowing, was honored with a festival. The celebration was not on the 25th, but for about a week preceding...

The Saturnalia officially was celebrated on December 17 (a.d. XVI Kal. Ian.), midway between two other agricultural festivals:

In the Roman calendar, the Saturnalia was designated a holy day, or holiday, (feriae publicae) on which religious rites were performed.

It also was a festival day (dies festus). After sacrifice at the temple, there was a public banquet (convivium publicum), which Livy says was introduced in 217 BC (there also may have been a lectisternium, a banquet for the god in which its image is placed in attendance, as if a guest). Afterwards, according to Macrobius, the celebrants shouted "Io, Saturnalia!"

In Cicero's time, the Saturnalia lasted seven days, from December 17-23. When Christians started to celebrate 'Christmas' saturnalia was not at the same time...

later, when those who wanted to celebrate 'saturnalia' were far fewer, they moved their date of celebration over... to the time of Christmas...

Augustus attempted to limit the holiday to three days, so the civil courts would not have to be closed any longer than necessary, and Caligula extended it to five.

Still, everyone seems to have continued to celebrate for a full week. So it was celebrated from the 17th to the 23th..
not even on the 25th....

The Saturnalia was the most popular holiday of the Roman year. Catullus describes it as "the best of days" (optimus dierum), and Seneca complains that the "whole mob has let itself go in pleasures." Pliny the Younger writes that he retired to his room while the rest of the household celebrated. Cicero fled to the countryside. It was an occasion for celebration, visits to friends, and the presentation of wax candles (cerei), perhaps to signify the returning light after the solstice, and small earthenware figurines (sigillaria).

During the holiday, restrictions were relaxed and the social order inverted. Gambling was allowed in public. Slaves were permitted to use dice and did not have to work. Instead of the toga, less formal dinner clothes were permitted, as was the pilleus, a felt cap normally worn by the manumitted slave that symbolized the freedom of the season.

Slaves were treated as equals, allowed to wear their masters' clothing, and be waited on at meal time in remembrance of an earlier golden age thought to have been ushered in by the god. This equality was temporary, of course, and Petronius speaks of an impudent slave being asked at some other time of the year whether it was December yet.

The early Christians had to cease work for the one, three, five, or seven day celebration...

and they did not want to celebrate Saturn, nor partake in the pagan ritual...

So, they chose to use the time to prepare for a special day...
the twenty-fifth of Dec....
the winter solstice...
when the day was the shortest, but now beginning to be longer each day...
more and more sunlight hours would be started on that day...

to them, they thought of the coming of Jesus to earth, and this was the coming of The Light of the world and He began to shine at that day of incarnation and birth...
Since the pagan holiday had ended... and the debauchery of its celebration was over...

the coming back to the celebration of light...
was a symbolic joy to the Christians...

during Saturnalia, the pagans had given candles...
in celebration of their god...
so the Christians waited till their celebration was over, and chose to give gifts to each other, in celebration of the gift of God to this world, Jesus Christ...
God gave, so we give...
He gave much, very much... and at this time of the year, Christians give much... very much in celebration of that...

So it was not the Christians who celebrated Saturnalia...
it was later, that those who were still into paganism,,,
saw the joyous time of celebration of Christians,
and decided to take the 25th to
continue their celebration...
they have tried to steal the day from Christians...
and we do not need to give it up...

in fact, I know of no one who celebrates Saturnalia now..

Christmas has been compromised by commercialism,
greed, and many other things...

but Christians do not need to cease celebrating it properly due to many who celebrate it improperly...

many celebrate Sunday improperly,
with everything but church... and worship...
but I do not throw the day to the devil because of that...
the same can be said for every Christian day of celebration...
we need to celebrate the incarnation of the Lord Jesus...
and quit being 'taken in' by the judgmental, hypocritical ones who want to attack everything in the faith...

we are not commanded to celebrate any day in Christianity...
we should not celebrate a day...
(See Romans 14)
we should celebrate Jesus...
three days and three nights before Resurrection day,
we celebrate His death...
then three days later, we celebrate His resurrection...
on Pentecost we celebrate the coming of the Holy Spirit...
every Sunday we celebrate the resurrection...
and on the 25th,
the day after the pagans had celebrated Saturn...
we can celebrate something wonderful
Jesus' birth...

no, it likely was not the day of His birth...
but 51 of 52 Sundays a year,
we celebrate the Resurrection day on the wrong day too....

So... half truths, stupid assumptions, and evil judgmentalism of attack against Christians who love Jesus more than the attackers...
marks those who attack our celebration of the birth of Jesus...

do not be discouraged...
but celebrate Jesus...!!!!

-Murjahel
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 05:17 PM
 
Location: Seward, Alaska
2,739 posts, read 7,832,005 times
Reputation: 1982
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jess5 View Post
Christmas because it is a pagan holiday? Any of you, or anyone you know of?
Perhaps my reply would more appropriately fit in the "Health" forum, or in a thread by itself, but then again, there may be others here in the same situation, so here goes...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'll tell you all a little secret: I used to celebrate Christmas with much joy, anticipation, and happiness...for the first 50-some years of my life. Now I don't...so much...anymore. And not because of "pagan" origins, but for a more sinister reason: my wife of 4 years has PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder).

Posttraumatic stress disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

One of the problems with this condition is that a PTSD "event" can be triggered by certain things, that bring back the memory of the trauma...that make the victim relive it, and the feelings associated with it. The person undergoes severe depression, fear, and hopelessness. The trigger can take the form of an event, a person, a particular date, or seeing/hearing a thing. In my wife's case, ONE of the triggers (yes, there's more than one!) is....Christmas. Why? Because...as a young child she was horribly abused by her parents and siblings. A few examples: she was beaten, punched, kicked, screamed at daily, had her hair pulled out, held down while her teeth were jerked out with pliers, etc. (nowadays these people would be in jail for child abuse)
And.....EACH and EVERY Christmas: EVERYONE in her family would get presents...lots of them! EXCEPT her. She NEVER got a single gift...ever! Not once! Not anything at all! She would watch while her sister and brother got lots of wonderful things. And her mom. And her dad. But she would end up with nothing. If she protested, they would beat her, so she would just spend the day hiding under the staircase. For the life of me, I just can't fathom why ANYONE would do that to their kids...but they do...
Needless to say, it is now an extreme struggle for her to try to enjoy Christmas, even though those people are not around her on that date anymore...and even though that cruelty happened well over 45 years ago. Even if I shower her with gifts and attention, I am still walking on egg-shells and treading ever-so-lightly, because the slightest little thing can set her off into extreme feelings of sadness and depression that quite often last for days. (or even weeks)! Yes, she is being treated medically, but there simply is no "magic cure-all". (unless God Himself intervenes) I used to think PTSD was no big deal...that the stories about it were vastly overblown. I was wrong...it is very serious. It affects everybody in that family, and recovery from it's effects can take literally decades. (and in too many cases, there is no recovery...the person will take it with them to the grave...) Christmas is a heavy strain on our marriage. (it seems to make little difference whether we do, or don't, celebrate Christmas...as far as the PTSD goes, so I just take each passing hour on a "case-by-case" basis...and hope the day passes quickly...) Yes, I have seen some marginal improvement, but not nearly enough. If you are married to someone with PTSD, I thoroughly understand, and my prayers are with you! Please pray for us on Dec 25...

Thank you,
Bud
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 05:26 PM
 
4,046 posts, read 5,324,567 times
Reputation: 1523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shug58 View Post
to stop CHRISTMAS at all cost. ...
Have a glass of wine or something. Lay off the all-caps key.

You realize that online forums aren't in the Bible, either? Just think of how much evil is on the internet.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 05:42 PM
 
Location: Pikeville, Ky.
13,564 posts, read 21,671,439 times
Reputation: 18086
Bud, my prayers will go out for you and your precious "Sunshine" Thank you for sharing so much of yourself with us, and for making us understand that our children are so vulnerable and helpless, and the evils of their childhood are the demons of their adulthood...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 05:47 PM
 
4,046 posts, read 5,324,567 times
Reputation: 1523
Bud, I am really sorry for what your family goes through every year. I hope, somehow, this season can be stress-free for y'all.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 05:51 PM
 
3,935 posts, read 5,576,295 times
Reputation: 4160
"Gen 50:28 comes to mind. If Christians can take a pagan holiday and commit to honoring Jesus the Christ, who are you to tell them they aren't actually honoring God? I can honor God on Boxing Day in Canada and if my heart is right, God is glorified."

I don't know what Bible you read, but my Bible has no Gen. 50:28.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Christianity
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top