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Old 10-05-2013, 08:37 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,314 posts, read 34,497,942 times
Reputation: 10557

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xian Catalyst View Post
There is nothing biblical to provide any support for your claim without you presupposing/assuming/imagining things.

I'd like to hear your comments on what Telioo means here, or whatever derivative it is here.

How does that affect the meaning when you read it as mature, not perfect.

How does the description of the man being forced to become a Pauper by Christ, and the beattitude blessed are the poor in spirit where Poor describes a Pauper fit into your view?

Doesn't it make a lot more sense, that Jesus didn't "LOVE THE YOUNG MAN" as much or close to as much as He did Lazarus AND LET HIM WALK OFF TO DIE? Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead. Preventing the death would be a LIKE action.

Now, please, answer the points here before you tell me how it is. Show me it was not a mistake to take you off ignore please. and btw, you are henceforth called JABBER by me. ONLY because it's funny, and I just now realized that WASN'T what it said.
It means perfect / complete, but if you prefer to use mature, it is fine because it does not change the meaning, which I already explained.
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:43 PM
 
Location: Dallas TX
304 posts, read 248,039 times
Reputation: 42
[quote=travric;31684684]
Quote:
So I've heard.

Show me in scripture how that is a better take than what I presented.

I'd contend that is presumption that is NOT stated in scripture.

I guess from my point of view (of course it's an interpretation) I'm trying to simplify the 'essence' and perhaps conclusions of the text with regard to the fairly well-to-do fellow. Nothing wrong with wealth or making moolah but if that's one's 'God' well it's off the track. Christ I think wants the person who makes it his 'God' to wake up from the 'pride' as previous poster finely noted that holds one back in the spiritual life. Those who are 'poor in spirit are kind of on the mark. Just my take.
Ok, so the beattitude, blessed are the poor in spirit... WHere the Greek word for poor means to be poor, a beggar.....

....wHich was exactly what Christ asked of the RYR.

Does what to your view?

Remember (if you don't deny) that "telios" or Perfect means more like mature than OUR perfect word today...
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:46 PM
 
Location: Dallas TX
304 posts, read 248,039 times
Reputation: 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
It means perfect / complete, but if you prefer to use mature, it is fine because it does not change the meaning, which I already explained.
Oh Jabber. You are a trip.

It meant "perfect" in 1611, because PERFECT meant something different back then than it does now.

COMPLETE is synonymous with MATURE in this sense of the words.

You are just dancing trying not to have to give up ground.

BTW, what gives YOUR more credentials than about 8000 Greek Scholars on what the word means?

I mean, if we have that sorta GREATNESS in the house, I'm happy to learn from it. I gotta ask, where is that person?
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Old 10-05-2013, 10:15 PM
 
2,532 posts, read 2,023,139 times
Reputation: 327
[quote=Xian Catalyst;31692684]
Quote:
Originally Posted by travric View Post

Ok, so the beattitude, blessed are the poor in spirit... WHere the Greek word for poor means to be poor, a beggar.....

....wHich was exactly what Christ asked of the RYR.

Does what to your view?

Remember (if you don't deny) that "telios" or Perfect means more like mature than OUR perfect word today...
"Blessed are the poor in Spirit" is a call to those who realize they can not make it on there own but become hungry of heart for Christ to give them the Bread of Life Eternal. No one stays poor of spirit once they receive the unsearchable and inexhaustible riches of Christ!
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Old 10-05-2013, 10:20 PM
 
Location: Dallas TX
304 posts, read 248,039 times
Reputation: 42
[quote=garya123;31693010]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xian Catalyst View Post
"Blessed are the poor in Spirit" is a call to those who realize they can not make it on there own but become hungry of heart for Christ to give them the Bread of Life Eternal. No one stays poor of spirit once they receive the unsearchable and inexhaustible riches of Christ!
Cliche.

It doesn't say anywhere you get richer. The word for poor means pauper and dependent.

A strong spirit is contraindicating with God's plan of giving yourself to Him.

Born again... DIe to one life be born in another.

RYR.... die to your former life, come to me as a pauper, it doesn't get much more OTHER than that, right?
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Old 10-05-2013, 10:49 PM
 
2,532 posts, read 2,023,139 times
Reputation: 327
[quote=Xian Catalyst;31693067]
Quote:
Originally Posted by garya123 View Post

Cliche.

It doesn't say anywhere you get richer. The word for poor means pauper and dependent.

A strong spirit is contraindicating with God's plan of giving yourself to Him.

Born again... DIe to one life be born in another.

RYR.... die to your former life, come to me as a pauper, it doesn't get much more OTHER than that, right?
Is the Bread of Life a poor diet or a rich meal of the fruit of the Spirit. What man who is poor of spirit wouldn't want that rich meal if only he believed he could get it from Christ.

To die to self/"one life" that produces only poverty of spirit is to be "born in another" by the Spirit of His riches in Christ.
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Old 10-06-2013, 06:18 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,314 posts, read 34,497,942 times
Reputation: 10557
[quote=travric;31684684]
Quote:
So I've heard.

Show me in scripture how that is a better take than what I presented.

I'd contend that is presumption that is NOT stated in scripture.

I guess from my point of view (of course it's an interpretation) I'm trying to simplify the 'essence' and perhaps conclusions of the text with regard to the fairly well-to-do fellow. Nothing wrong with wealth or making moolah but if that's one's 'God' well it's off the track. Christ I think wants the person who makes it his 'God' to wake up from the 'pride' as previous poster finely noted that holds one back in the spiritual life. Those who are 'poor in spirit are kind of on the mark. Just my take.
This is what I meant when I said Jesus said it on order to highlight the mans wealth as a stumbling block in his spiritual life, and sure enough, he walked away when he heard Jesus' comment.

"For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also".

It would have been impossible for the man to obtain spiritual perfection, or maturity as someone someone said, as long as he prioritized his wealth above God. The 12 diciples were on their path to perfection/maturity as Jesus pointed out in the same chapter.
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Old 10-06-2013, 06:23 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,314 posts, read 34,497,942 times
Reputation: 10557
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xian Catalyst View Post
Oh Jabber. You are a trip.

It meant "perfect" in 1611, because PERFECT meant something different back then than it does now.

COMPLETE is synonymous with MATURE in this sense of the words.

You are just dancing trying not to have to give up ground.

BTW, what gives YOUR more credentials than about 8000 Greek Scholars on what the word means?

I mean, if we have that sorta GREATNESS in the house, I'm happy to learn from it. I gotta ask, where is that person?
I think your problem is that you see disagreement and argument where there is none. I just told you that you can use either word, because if does not change anything in the message, but behave as if there is a major disagreement.
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Old 10-06-2013, 06:24 AM
 
Location: Florida
63,314 posts, read 34,497,942 times
Reputation: 10557
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xian Catalyst View Post

Cliche.

It doesn't say anywhere you get richer. The word for poor means pauper and dependent.

A strong spirit is contraindicating with God's plan of giving yourself to Him.

Born again... DIe to one life be born in another.

RYR.... die to your former life, come to me as a pauper, it doesn't get much more OTHER than that, right?
That's what he just told you, but you called it a cliche. There is that eagerness to disagree again.
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Old 10-06-2013, 12:26 PM
 
2,532 posts, read 2,023,139 times
Reputation: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
That's what he just told you, but you called it a cliche. There is that eagerness to disagree again.
Indeed. I was showing how a man poor of spirit need not stay that way because the Kingdom of God belongs to such if they believe what Jesus said. What possible disagreement can one have over such an invitation to become rich of spirit in the Kingdom. Blessing to you Finn_Jarber for seeing the obvious.
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