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Old 11-07-2013, 02:58 PM
 
Location: a nation with hope
13,153 posts, read 17,429,798 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post

As for "losing" your salvation, no one can take it away from you, but you can throw it away.
Amen.

Hebrews 6:4-6 KJV
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Or, from the Contemporary English Version:
But what about people who turn away after they have already seen the light and have received the gift from heaven and have shared in the Holy Spirit? What about those who turn away after they have received the good message of God and the powers of the future world? There is no way to bring them back. What they are doing is the same as nailing the Son of God to a cross and insulting him in public.
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Old 11-07-2013, 10:05 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Jesus came to save sinners FROM their sins, not IN them.

The Church is an organism not an organization

Worth repeating
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Old 11-08-2013, 03:43 AM
 
Location: New England
32,239 posts, read 21,123,632 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
Yep, after all sinning against the Holy Spirit, would be a deliberate rejection of it's leading. Can't do that unless it has been leading you. OSAS just puts butts in seats and money in Pastors wallets, oh and makes people feel good. That is about it.

As for "losing" your salvation, no one can take it away from you, but you can throw it away.

Popularity does not guarantee correctness, so who cares what any man says unless it is clearly and specifically taught in Scripture. Then it doesn't matter who says it.
So does fear of losing salvation, which to be honest is the same salvation as OSAS(being saved from eternal hell), but with the potential to lose it. Fear of losing your salvation also puts money in your pastors pockets and makes you feel bad.

Who in the right mind with any amount of understanding to actually how great salvation is, would consciously throw it away. I have never met a single person that has. Yea they've left the church(who can blame them) and drifted, but you have left one thing out of the whole equation, God does not give up.
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Old 11-08-2013, 06:24 AM
 
Location: a nation with hope
13,153 posts, read 17,429,798 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
So does fear of losing salvation, which to be honest is the same salvation as OSAS(being saved from eternal hell), but with the potential to lose it. Fear of losing your salvation also puts money in your pastors pockets and makes you feel bad.

Who in the right mind with any amount of understanding to actually how great salvation is, would consciously throw it away. I have never met a single person that has. Yea they've left the church(who can blame them) and drifted, but you have left one thing out of the whole equation, God does not give up.
Excellent points. I've always had difficulty understanding how someone who is really saved could walk away from it. I've also had difficulty accepting the concept that believers have to hold on to their salvation. I firmly believe that God holds onto us - even when we fall, or when we drift and let things of the world squeeze the things of God out of our lives and our daily awareness. We can grieve the Holy Spirit, and He might grow silent, but He doesn't abandon us.
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Old 11-08-2013, 01:03 PM
 
17,579 posts, read 10,646,199 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Jesus came to save sinners FROM their sins, not IN them.

The Church is an organism not an organization

Worth repeating
Actually it is organized, as it was in the 1st century.
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Old 11-08-2013, 01:07 PM
 
17,579 posts, read 10,646,199 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
So does fear of losing salvation, which to be honest is the same salvation as OSAS(being saved from eternal hell), but with the potential to lose it. Fear of losing your salvation also puts money in your pastors pockets and makes you feel bad.

Who in the right mind with any amount of understanding to actually how great salvation is, would consciously throw it away. I have never met a single person that has. Yea they've left the church(who can blame them) and drifted, but you have left one thing out of the whole equation, God does not give up.
Strange I do not fear losing my salvation, even though I know I can. I fear displeasing God, but my love for Him is stronger. As the Bible says, love casts fear aside. 1 John 4:18
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Old 11-08-2013, 01:25 PM
 
Location: New England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
Strange I do not fear losing my salvation, even though I know I can. I fear displeasing God, but my love for Him is stronger. As the Bible says, love casts fear aside. 1 John 4:18
I'm sorry but I find that hard to believe in fact impossible to believe . If you believe you can lose something that the consequences of losing it are eternal torment or being annihilated, then you cannot but be in fear. If love casts aside fear, then you have no fear of displeasing God and losing it on the basis of displeasing him. It also sounds from what you are saying, that you base salvation on your love for him, yet scripture tells us he first loved us.

Our security is not in the doctrine of a belief such as OSAS, neither is it in our ability in continuing in obedience, but in God. The scripture clearly tells us and in numerous places that God is our Salvation. You see David had it right when he said things like God is my Salvation, The Lord is my Shepherd, God is our Refuge, he is my strength. Salvation is of God.
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:15 PM
 
17,579 posts, read 10,646,199 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
I'm sorry but I find that hard to believe in fact impossible to believe . If you believe you can lose something that the consequences of losing it are eternal torment or being annihilated, then you cannot but be in fear. If love casts aside fear, then you have no fear of displeasing God and losing it on the basis of displeasing him. It also sounds from what you are saying, that you base salvation on your love for him, yet scripture tells us he first loved us.

Our security is not in the doctrine of a belief such as OSAS, neither is it in our ability in continuing in obedience, but in God. The scripture clearly tells us and in numerous places that God is our Salvation. You see David had it right when he said things like God is my Salvation, The Lord is my Shepherd, God is our Refuge, he is my strength. Salvation is of God.
You may find it hard to believe and in fact you may live in fear according to your position, but I don't.
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Old 11-08-2013, 06:08 PM
 
Location: New England
32,239 posts, read 21,123,632 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expatCA View Post
You may find it hard to believe and in fact you may live in fear according to your position, but I don't.
There is no fear in faith in God being your salvation( salvation not being from eternal or annihilation which both are rooted in fear).
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Old 11-08-2013, 06:51 PM
 
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He came to seek and save those who lost their way; not to condemn them.
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