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Old 10-16-2013, 10:51 PM
 
3,274 posts, read 5,284,419 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
Many people who call themselves Christian claim that what you believe is not important. Someone just made that claim on another thread on this forum. The Bible begs to differ.

Jesus said to the unbelieving Jews;
''Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.'' (John 8:24)
So does it matter whether you believe that Jesus is 'I am'? You bet it does!!!

Jesus said to Martha;
''I am the resurrection and the life; he who believes on Me will live even if he dies, and everyone who lives and believes on Me will never die, Do you believe this?'' (John 11:25-26)
Is it therefore important that you believe on Christ? Absolutely. What you believe regarding salvific truth matters. What you believe in salvific matters determines where you will spend the eternal future.

Now, not everything is salvific. That is, not every category of truth has bearing on your eternal salvation. Still, the Bible is the word of truth as stated in 2 Timothy 2:15 and has bearing on your spiritual growth as a believer. What you believe certainly matters. And if you disagree, as some or many of you always will, you are sadly and tragically mistaken.
Mike, you started an interesting thread. I agree with you 100%. Now I am swaying on the fence when Christians argue that in order to be saved, one must not only believe in Jesus but believe that Jesus is God the son. I know that Jesus said that He is the only way to God, and I believe that.

But, I don't see evidence in the bible that says that my salvation is to believe that Jesus is God the Son. I don't want you to think that I am saying that I don't believe that Jesus is God the Son---I do. But Help me out here as why we must believe that Jesus is God the Son in order to have salvation.
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Old 10-17-2013, 12:40 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,965 posts, read 5,774,155 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShepherdMaster View Post
I believe little elves may shine my shoes while I sleep.


Belief is meaningless.


Knowledge and faith is a different matter.
I don't think belief is meaningless. Believing lies has many consequences as does knowing the truth. Or would you argue that being deluded does not affect a person's entire perception of reality?
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Old 10-17-2013, 05:56 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
I don't think belief is meaningless. Believing lies has many consequences as does knowing the truth. Or would you argue that being deluded does not affect a person's entire perception of reality?


God the Father gave us his Word. Most believe the mind of God is unobtainable, they do not read the Word, they do not seek his Wisdom and Knowledge. What value then does belief have?


Belief is built upon the sand, Knowledge is built upon the rock.


The Father does not reveal himself to those who do not seek him, to those who do not ask for Wisdom and Knowledge and guidance.

Hebrews 11:1 for the definition of Faith.
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Old 10-17-2013, 06:01 AM
 
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Also, the mind of God is found in the OT, salvation through Christ is found in the NT.

The two compliment each other and the whole of the bible tells of God's plan for man.
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Old 10-17-2013, 06:25 AM
 
Location: Frisco, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TroutDude View Post
Words expressing belief in doing good may come easily.

The deeds don't always follow.
But words and belief go hand in hand - that's the way God formed the universe, and it's the way He instructs us to take the Kingdom.

If we considered all the scripture regarding words, the tongue, our conversation - it would blow us away. Consider James' admonishment (chapter 3) that the tongue directs our life like the rudder of a ship. We've been given authority to bless, to curse, to bind and to loose; we do all these things daily whether we know it or not.

Life and death is in the power of the tongue, and they that love it will eat the fruit thereof. (Prov 18:21) We all eat the fruit of our words - what crop have you been planting?
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Old 10-17-2013, 06:32 AM
 
183 posts, read 140,768 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer View Post
But words and belief go hand in hand - that's the way God formed the universe, and it's the way He instructs us to take the Kingdom.

If we considered all the scripture regarding words, the tongue, our conversation - it would blow us away. Consider James' admonishment (chapter 3) that the tongue directs our life like the rudder of a ship. We've been given authority to bless, to curse, to bind and to loose; we do all these things daily whether we know it or not.

Life and death is in the power of the tongue, and they that love it will eat the fruit thereof. (Prov 18:21) We all eat the fruit of our words - what crop have you been planting?


You have no authority without knowledge.
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Old 10-17-2013, 06:40 AM
 
Location: Frisco, TX
7,559 posts, read 11,920,103 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShepherdMaster View Post
You have no authority without knowledge.
Look at the world around you, and the systems that man has built even without the knowledge of the truth.

Read Genesis 11 - The Lord said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them." (v 6)

Everyone has the breath of life within them, given by God. The truth (Christ) will set them free if they know it, but mankind himself was made "a little lower than the angels, with glory and honor and was made ruler over the works of His hands".

I'd like to think you're right, and that only followers of Christ have power, but that's not the case.
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Old 10-17-2013, 07:00 AM
 
Location: San Antonio
2,819 posts, read 2,881,307 times
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I guess it depends on what it is.
''Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.'' (John 8:24) I believe that Jesus is He. am I now saved? what if I don't believe in Hell, trinity, freewill, tongues, etc.... am I still saved? most say NO!. but I believe that Jesus is He!. Well, that is not enough. I must also believe many other things in order to be accepted into man's version of heaven.
But we should not care to be accepted by man. I believe that Jesus is He. The Son of God.
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Old 10-17-2013, 07:09 AM
 
183 posts, read 140,768 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer View Post
Look at the world around you, and the systems that man has built even without the knowledge of the truth.

Read Genesis 11 - The Lord said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them." (v 6)

Everyone has the breath of life within them, given by God. The truth (Christ) will set them free if they know it, but mankind himself was made "a little lower than the angels, with glory and honor and was made ruler over the works of His hands".

I'd like to think you're right, and that only followers of Christ have power, but that's not the case.


The ONE language, God gave Adam the Hebrew language........read earlier in Genesis.


What you are referring to is the building of the Tower of Babel. Man doing his own will outside the will of the Father, evil. Also note the punishment that followed.
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Old 10-17-2013, 07:16 AM
 
Location: Frisco, TX
7,559 posts, read 11,920,103 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShepherdMaster View Post
The ONE language, God gave Adam the Hebrew language........read earlier in Genesis.


What you are referring to is the building of the Tower of Babel. Man doing his own will outside the will of the Father, evil. Also note the punishment that followed.
Without question - but you're saying that non-believers don't have power, and I'm disagreeing. The one language in Genesis is the same as the natural spirit in the world today - people are bound together in their flesh which is antichrist.
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